14 Years Old, First Time Drug Offense

[dannynguyen]

but arent i going to like juvenile court or something?

[jk]

but arent i going to like juvenile court or something?

If you don't know, we surely don't know. There are still generally options available even in juvi court. An attorney is still a good idea but it is up to you.

[BrendanjKeegan]

Hey guys,

Lighten up. He's fourteen. Obviously a middle schooler. Do you remember that time in your life? You probably experimented with quite a few legal drugs in your day, too. Take it easy on the kid. He's probably got quite a few people riding him right now to clean up his act. I'm sure he doesn't need more.

Danny,

Take a look at your "summons" it will say something like "In the court of..." If you're still having trouble, post it up.

I understand the desire to skip school and go hang with friends. Maybe even smoke a bit. At your age, plenty of other kids are doing so too. Hell, you'll find that even the most well respected college students skip class sometimes. But, IF you find the need to, then try and leave the drug possession out of it.

But, if you do find yourself in a sticky situation again (which I'm willing to bet you won't because you're gonna stop doing pot, right?) then don't let the officer search you. Even if she says you smell like weed. There are plenty of things that smell like weed- skunk for instance. Tell all your friends that you should NEVER submit to a search by an officer. NEVER EVER EVER. If you think you are going to answer one of her questions wrong, then DON'T answer it. Remember in the movies when they say "you have the right to remain silent?" Yeah... you do have the right until you're in front of a judge and under oath. Use it.

With that, I would like to provide you with what is known as the assertion of your rights. This would pertain to you drinking alcohol, but if you're a smart student, you know which points to change/leave out for drug use.

Here it is:

OFFICER, ON THE ADVICE OF COUNSEL IN WASHINGTON STATE:
I will provide my name and identification.
I will sign a citation, if any, and then I want to leave immediately.
I will not answer any questions without an attorney or my parents present.
I do not have to do any “field sobriety tests,” and I refuse to do them.
I do not consent to my person, house, or other property being searched.
If I am arrested, I want an attorney now, and I do not waive any of my rights.
If you want me to take a breath or blood test, I want to talk to my attorney first.
If my attorney cannot be reached, I want to talk to a public defender or another attorney.
I will submit to a breath or blood test. If you request I take a breath or blood test, I also want an additional legal blood test.
If I am not under arrest I want to leave. Please tell me so I may walk away.
Thank You.

Copy that into a word document. Shrink it up. Print it out. Cut it up. And put it into your wallet. You never know when you're gonna need to use it. I would recommend have an attorney and their phone number on the piece of paper, too. Just google Criminal Defense Attorney (your city), WA. Then use one of the names that comes up and their phone number. You don't have to be paying an attorney in order to say "I want to speak to my attorney."

Now, in the coming years, you'll be driving. And you'll probably go to a few high school parties. It's sort of inevitable. A rite of passage, I would say. If you ever get pulled over while just having been drinking or smoking use this assertion of rights:

OFFICER, ON THE ADVICE OF COUNSEL IN WASHINGTON STATE:
I will provide my driver’s license, proof of insurance, and registration.
I will sign a citation, if any, and then I want to leave immediately.
I will not answer any questions without an attorney present.
I do not have to do any “field sobriety tests,” and I refuse to do them.
I do not consent to my person, car, or other property being searched.
If I am arrested, I want an attorney now, I do not waive any of my rights.
If you want me to take a breath or blood test, I want to talk to my attorney first.
If my attorney cannot be reached, I want to talk to a public defender or another attorney.
I will submit to a breath or blood test. If you request I take a breath or blood test, I also want an additional legal blood test.
If I am not under arrest I want to leave. Please tell me so I may lock my car and walk away.
Thank You.

Pretty easy, eh? Best of luck in your future, Danny, and if you ever need anything, send me a PM.

Brendan

[jk]

we have a kid in my area that is 14 that is going on trial for murder. He killed his grandfather for no apparent reason. There is a kid out east that is 11 that is going on trial for murder. I believe both are being tried as adults.

age is less and less reason to consider the person a child, at least in terms of the legal system. Yes, when I was his age, such a long time ago, things were different. I could walk down the streets of my town any time of day or nightt and have no fear of being mugged. Not only could you leave your door unlocked, you could leave it open and not even be home and not worry about somebody stealing everything you own.

Yes, he is young but his attitude screams "I'm just a kid so this isn't serious". Those days are long gone.

and your list of claimed rights. You had best research some of those before invoking them.
Some of them will give the cops a pretty good laugh though.

Hell, you'll find that even the most well respected college students skip class sometimes

there is a HUGE difference between skipping school and skipping in college. There are no laws mandating attendance of college, there are for school. College is an entirely different situation. There is no fair comparison.

[cyjeff]

I cannot actually believe that a "boys will be boys" attitude is appropriate here.

He didn't squirt his next door neighbor with a garden hose. He obtained and was using illegal drugs at 14.

No, I do not remember a time in my 14th year (or 18th, or 24th or 34th or 44th year) when I experimented with illegal drugs.

In fact, MOST people do not.

Further, to tell this young person that what he is doing is not only okay but normal at his age is grossly inappropriate and irresponsible.

It is also dead wrong.

You are a student and so your view of the world is biased. However, that does not give you the right to tell other persons looking for help that illegal activity is okay. Especially here.

Further, your little list of things to do and not do is, again, wrong. Many of the things you suggest are simply not legal.

For instance, you are not legally allowed to consult your attorney before any breath or blood test is administered.

The supreme court has deemed that the collection of evidence - which the results of such a test have been deemed to be - does not have to degrade while your attorney is hunted down, brought to the station and then talk to you.

Think about it. if this were the case, your attorney would make sure that he/she couldn't be found for at least a day.... when all evidence would be lost.

I also don't know of any reputable attorney that runs to the police station to talk to a child without being previously consulted in advance.

Lastly, it is important to note that NONE of your little "rules of how to deal with 'the man'" will prevent him from spending time in the local lock up while these negotiations of yours are going on.

It is NEVER okay to use illegal drugs. It is NEVER okay to use alcohol and/or drugs and then drive.

Be very careful, Brendan... people have been banned from this site for far less.

[BrendanjKeegan]

we have a kid in my area that is 14 that is going on trial for murder. He killed his grandfather for no apparent reason. There is a kid out east that is 11 that is going on trial for murder. I believe both are being tried as adults.

Have you seen all of the evidence? Has he been convicted? Just because the media is saying that he is guilty doesn't mean that he actually is. Your statement "He killed his grandfather for no apparent reason" should have been "He is being tried for suspicion of murdering his grandfather for no apparent reason." On a side note: sounds like a hard case to me because there is no motive. (Nonetheless, this does not say that he hasn't or has committed the crime. It is still up in the air.)

Yes, he is young but his attitude screams "I'm just a kid so this isn't serious". Those days are long gone.

I'm just wondering where you got the notion that his attitude screams that. Because as of now, it seems to me like he is in desperate need of help. I'm offering that help because the rest of you seem to just be chastising him. As I said earlier, he probably has quite a few people riding his ass for this. And so he should have. But what gives you, OR I, the right to play parent?

and your list of claimed rights. You had best research some of those before invoking them.
Some of them will give the cops a pretty good laugh though.

Really, now? Which ones?

there is a HUGE difference between skipping school and skipping in college. There are no laws mandating attendance of college, there are for school. College is an entirely different situation. There is no fair comparison.

Touche. First real argument that I have seen. Yes, Danny should take note of Washington State's "Becca" Laws. However, after this scare, I am willing to bet that Danny and his friend's aren't going to be skipping or smoking anytime soon, if EVER again. Notice my quote, "(which I'm willing to bet you won't because you're gonna stop doing pot, right?)"

I cannot actually believe that a "boys will be boys" attitude is appropriate here.

It's not that type of attitude at all. I am just amazed at the amount of SENIOR MEMBERS chastising him. Again, who are we to play the role of the parent?

No, I do not remember a time in my 14th year (or 18th, or 24th or 34th or 44th year) when I experimented with illegal drugs.

In fact, MOST people do not.

Okay, that is you. Notice I said "probably." I don't know any of you and what you did in your days as a school boy, therefore I used the word probably.

Further, to tell this young person that what he is doing is not only okay but normal at his age is grossly inappropriate and irresponsible.

And playing the role of his parent on an online forum is responsible? I never said that it is okay, I only stated that I understood. Take a look at my post. I even state: "But, IF you find the need to, then try and leave the drug possession out of it." If you do not possess the illegal drug, then how are you able to use it?

It is also dead wrong.

I will take note of your opinion. It has been validated.

For instance, you are not legally allowed to consult your attorney before any breath or blood test is administered.

Where did we come to this conclusion? Because I'm certain that I read in Miranda v. Arizona that "he [the person in custody] has the right to consult with a lawyer and to have the lawyer with him during interrogation." It does not give any exceptions, nor do I recall a case that this was overturned.

Think about it. if this were the case, your attorney would make sure that he/she couldn't be found for at least a day.... when all evidence would be lost.

Yet this argument is so ridiculous because of the clause in my post that states, "If my attorney cannot be reached, I want to talk to a public defender or another attorney." Therefore, if the police find that your attorney can't be reached they can offer you another one to consult with.

I also don't know of any reputable attorney that runs to the police station to talk to a child without being previously consulted in advance.

Indeed, this is your view. Because I know of quite a few reputable attorneys that will go to a police station to talk to their "client." Quite a few reputable attorneys will offer services on their websites that say "we work hard to get you out [out of the locker] so that you can get your life back on track." Child or not, I'm sure that if the client has money, the attorney will show.

Lastly, it is important to note that NONE of your little "rules of how to deal with 'the man'" will prevent him from spending time in the local lock up while these negotiations of yours are going on

I never said that you wouldn't be locked up. I also never stated that you're license wouldn't be suspended, which is probably what will happen.

Before I move onto your last statement, I would like to explain that almost this exact assertion of rights formulated for clients by more than 5 law firms in the state of Washington. In fact, the second one was taken straight from the back of a business card for a DUI attorney based in Bellevue. Her name: Lizanne Padula.

Would you like to challenge an attorney who has been successful in fighting DUI and Criminal charges in Washington State for almost 20 years? I would think not.

It is NEVER okay to use illegal drugs. It is NEVER okay to use alcohol and/or drugs and then drive.

I am in total agreement with this statement. If it was okay, the drugs wouldn't be illegal. Please, don't get me wrong. I am not endorsing the use of marijuana or other illicit drugs. You can talk to any one of my peers and you'll find each one of them saying that I am strictly against drugs and alcohol. If I were to have it my way, there would be prohibition forever. However, I am also strongly against people chastising minors online for their acts. It's called a law for a reason. Obviously, if he broke it, he knows he's in the wrong.

When I read the first post I saw this kid who was crying out for help as if he had no other way. When I read on, I saw nothing but fellow members reprimanding this student who obviously needed some help. I am embarrassed to say that I am part of an online community in which the same type of high school "bullying" goes on with some 30-60(?) year olds.

However, I am willing to admit that I am in the wrong, too. With certain exceptions.

Brendan

[cyjeff]

I am in total agreement with this statement.

The rest of your post is just crap. Face it, you don't know what the hell you are talking about. You feel that if you flip flop enough, you will stumble over the right answer without every being wrong.

You are NOT in total agreement... because you said, and I quote,

I understand the desire to skip school and go hang with friends. Maybe even smoke a bit. At your age, plenty of other kids are doing so too

and

Now, in the coming years, you'll be driving. And you'll probably go to a few high school parties. It's sort of inevitable. A rite of passage, I would say. If you ever get pulled over while just having been drinking or smoking use this assertion of right

I don't see the part in your post ANYWHERE that said that this behavior is illegal and wrong.

If it was okay, the drugs wouldn't be illegal.

But everyone is doing it and it is a rite of passage.

Please, don't get me wrong. I am not endorsing the use of marijuana or other illicit drugs

But everyone is doing it and it is a rite of passage.

You can talk to any one of my peers and you'll find each one of them saying that I am strictly against drugs and alcohol.

That is also crap. People strictly against drugs and alcohol do not say things like....

I understand the desire to skip school and go hang with friends. Maybe even smoke a bit. At your age, plenty of other kids are doing so too.

If I were to have it my way, there would be prohibition forever. However, I am also strongly against people chastising minors online for their acts. It's called a law for a reason. Obviously, if he broke it, he knows he's in the wrong.

Not after your post, he doesn't.

The child believes that what he did isn't so bad because everyone is doing it and everyone has done it at some point in his/her life.

When I read the first post I saw this kid who was crying out for help as if he had no other way. When I read on, I saw nothing but fellow members reprimanding this student who obviously needed some help. I am embarrassed to say that I am part of an online community in which the same type of high school "bullying" goes on with some 30-60(?) year olds.

Then I will ask that you be banned so that you don't have to worry about it anymore.

However, I am willing to admit that I am in the wrong, too. With certain exceptions.

Let's start here...

Where did we come to this conclusion? Because I'm certain that I read in Miranda v. Arizona that "he [the person in custody] has the right to consult with a lawyer and to have the lawyer with him during interrogation." It does not give any exceptions, nor do I recall a case that this was overturned.

The collection of evidence has NOTHING, repeat NOTHING, to do with Miranda.

In certain jurisdictions, he can actually be restrained to have blood tests performed all without his attorney being present.

here is a thought. Join "AskDrPhil.com" instead. We aren't a consulting house for drugged out teens.

He obtained and smoked while truant. Further, if you think this was this 14 year olds first time, you are nuts.

He is on a path to screwing up his life royally and completely. He may have already done it.

Your "poor sweet baby" crap doesn't help a thing.

[jk]

=BrendanjKeegan;414597]Have you seen all of the evidence? Has he been convicted? Just because the media is saying that he is guilty doesn't mean that he actually is. Your statement "He killed his grandfather for no apparent reason" should have been "He is being tried for suspicion of murdering his grandfather for no apparent reason." On a side note: sounds like a hard case to me because there is no motive. (Nonetheless, this does not say that he hasn't or has committed the crime. It is still up in the air.)

the kid IS guilty, that is not in question. He has admitted it. He just does not have a reason for doing it.

Same thing with the other kid out east. It is a known fact he is guilty.

I'm just wondering where you got the notion that his attitude screams that.

because he keeps asking "I'm going to juvi aren't I? Just probations or something, right?"

Because as of now, it seems to me like he is in desperate need of help

.and he has been told several times he needs an attorney yet he seems to believe this is not serious. That is another justification for believing he has a childish attitutude about this.

I'm offering that help because the rest of you seem to just be chastising him. As I said earlier, he probably has quite a few people riding his ass for this. And so he should have. But what gives you, OR I, the right to play parent?

because he asked. I even asked where his parents are and I get "they don't speak much English". This is something that not only should his parents be involved in, it is something the HAVE to be involved in yet he seems to have left them somewhere not speaking English.

Really, now? Which ones?

You do right ahead and support each one. I'm not going to do your research for you.

Touche. First real argument that I have seen. Yes, Danny should take note of Washington State's "Becca" Laws. However, after this scare, I am willing to bet that Danny and his friend's aren't going to be skipping or smoking anytime soon, if EVER again. Notice my quote, "(which I'm willing to bet you won't because you're gonna stop doing pot, right?)"

a fools bet. You don't know anything about this kid yet you are willing to bet money on him. I guess that says something about your thought processes as well.

Where did we come to this conclusion? Because I'm certain that I read in Miranda v. Arizona that "he [the person in custody] has the right to consult with a lawyer and to have the lawyer with him during interrogation." It does not give any exceptions, nor do I recall a case that this was overturned.

but the kid can set in jail and actually be presented to the court a couple times before an attorney would be required to be involved, even with the kid invoking his rights to an attorney.

Yet this argument is so ridiculous because of the clause in my post that states, "If my attorney cannot be reached, I want to talk to a public defender or another attorney." Therefore, if the police find that your attorney can't be reached they can offer you another one to consult with.

Nope, not their job. It is the defendants job to locate their attorney or find another one. As soon as you say "MY attorney", it's all up to you. Plus, you are not entitled to counsel before a PBT or a blood test. It has been ruled legal many times over.


and I tire of playing tit for tat with unreasonable arguments.