Telling Kids They're Victims of PAS

[Mr. Knowitall]

If the custody order prevents you from initiating counseling for the kids without mom's consent, particularly in light of stepdad's actions, I would venture that a court would order counseling if you filed a petition.

[llworking]

NdK1009,

Yes they have and still are victims of PAS.

So, what I'm understanding from you guys here is that it's a no win situation with bringing it up.

Let me add that their step dad was just arrested for video taping while they were showering and changing at their mom's house recently. The surreptitious taping went on for over 1 yr at their mom's house. Much credit to their mom for turning him in upon finding out, but the girls seem to think it is just a "bit mentally ill" for doing this-and maybe with the right help he can be rehabilitated etc.

And understand this is only one of many many things that have happened over the last 10 years. I had to even jail their mother once over night, but she has led them to believe she was protecting them by going to jail etc.

njb



I was thinking about letting them read what the symptoms are, having them printed out and then explaining what a healthy divorced 2 household family custody arrangement should look like and let them reach their own conclusions.

njb

Please understand that if your children do any real research on PAS they are going to find out how horribly discredited it is, and then they will think that you are crazy. You need to stop using the term PAS and absolutely do not give your children any materials that reference PAS.

Do some more research on Alienation, not on PAS.

I also agree with the other advice that you were given. Discussing it with your children at all is likely to backfire on you. If they are smart, they will figure it out on their own. If they are not smart enough to figure it out on their own, it definitely will backfire on you if you try to discuss it with them.

[NotJamesBond]

Please understand that if your children do any real research on PAS they are going to find out how horribly discredited it is, and then they will think that you are crazy. You need to stop using the term PAS and absolutely do not give your children any materials that reference PAS.

Do some more research on Alienation, not on PAS.

I also agree with the other advice that you were given. Discussing it with your children at all is likely to backfire on you. If they are smart, they will figure it out on their own. If they are not smart enough to figure it out on their own, it definitely will backfire on you if you try to discuss it with them.

So, how has the syndrome been discredited?

And isn't Alienation the same thing as PAS-but couched in different phraseology?


njb

[cyjeff]

So, how has the syndrome been discredited?

And isn't Alienation the same thing as PAS-but couched in different phraseology?


njb

Because the nutjob that invented the syndrome was also a pedophile that thought that a child should take over sexually for the mother if the mother was withholding sex from the father.... amongst other things... and the list goes on.

The first parent that puts the children in the middle of a custody battle loses. I recommend you stop this course of action accept to enter the children in counseling... without parameters.

[NotJamesBond]

Because the nutjob that invented the syndrome was also a pedophile that thought that a child should take over sexually for the mother if the mother was withholding sex from the father.... amongst other things... and the list goes on.

The first parent that puts the children in the middle of a custody battle loses. I recommend you stop this course of action accept to enter the children in counseling... without parameters.

Wow.

Well the kids are in counseling that I took them to, and they haven't figured things out yet- and don't think they can probably until they're adults.They are co dependents of their mom's afraid to leave her, never want to upset her, if mom doesn't want to them to go to my house, they won't. They always think mom has jurisdiction over my house when they're with me and will call and complain about my rules at my house which has more structure.

With this latest fiasco with her current husband taping my children (in the nude) she is taking them to a different counselor.

I think I will visit that counselor with my concerns and have her present-so it's on record and may help her realize the damage that's being done.

This is probably my the best course of action other than petitioning for custody-which will I cannot afford.

njb

[Mr. Knowitall]

Because the nutjob that invented the syndrome was also a pedophile that thought that a child should take over sexually for the mother if the mother was withholding sex from the father.... amongst other things... and the list goes on.

The syndrome was discredited by lies and false allegations against Richard Gardner? Fascinating.

No, really, the issue is that it was not a scientifically formulated "syndrome" and it has never gained formal acceptance.

[cyjeff]

The syndrome was discredited by lies and false allegations against Richard Gardner? Fascinating.

No, really, the issue is that it was not a scientifically formulated "syndrome" and it has never gained formal acceptance.

They were neither lies nor false allegations I was quoting... it was a line from one of his books.

I have about 10 pages of very disturbing quotes if you really want it.

The syndrome was created out of whole cloth... by a madman.

[NotJamesBond]

cyjeff,

Let us understand one thing though:

You do agree a obsessed ex can embitter her children against an ex spouse by:

-not honoring the visitation agreement, subversively and overtly.
-by being overly honest about her angry feelings towards her former spouse in front of the kids
-by calling the kids while the kids are at the other parent's home telling them how much she misses the kids more than a few times a day
-by speaking in code to the kids and letting them know that if they don't want to be there for any reason that she'll come and get them at anytime
-by snubbing the kid's father in public along with the kid's new step parent in public in front of the kids..

I could go on, but you do think that these types of behavior have negative impact on the children of divorced parents, I hope?

njb

[cyjeff]

cyjeff,

Let us understand one thing though:

You do agree a obsessed ex can embitter her children against an ex spouse by:

-not honoring the visitation agreement, subversively and overtly.

Yes, I agree.

When you took her back to court to show contempt of the court order, what happened?

-by being overly honest about her angry feelings towards her former spouse in front of the kids

Yes, I agree.

Was this behavior addressed in the custody agreement? If yes, when you took her back to court to show contempt of the court order, what happened?

-by calling the kids while the kids are at the other parent's home telling them how much she misses the kids more than a few times a day

Yes, I agree.

Was this behavior addressed in the custody agreement? If yes, when you took her back to court to show contempt of the court order, what happened?

-by speaking in code to the kids and letting them know that if they don't want to be there for any reason that she'll come and get them at anytime

Yes, I agree.

When you took her back to court to show contempt of the court order, what happened?

-by snubbing the kid's father in public along with the kid's new step parent in public in front of the kids..

This means nothing at all. You cannot make someone like you ... and she doesn't have to even be civil.

I could go on, but you do think that these types of behavior have negative impact on the children of divorced parents, I hope?

Yes, I agree... however, I am seeing something of a pattern here. One, why haven't you taken mom back to court for violations of the court order?

Two, if these actions are not addressed by the custody order, then they are not in violation of anything and you need to go back to court to have them added.

Three, even if all this is happening EXACTLY as you say, do NOT drag the children into the middle.

Trust me, they already see what is going on.. but using them as the rope in your control battle with your ex will (and should) sour them on BOTH of the petty people that would use children as weapons to fight a personal battle.

Take the high road... children recognize it...

[Mr. Knowitall]

They were neither lies nor false allegations I was quoting... it was a line from one of his books.

I have about 10 pages of very disturbing quotes if you really want it.

The syndrome was created out of whole cloth... by a madman.

I'm sure his opponents put together all sorts of fabrications and distortions - that's always easy than challenging ideas on their merits. If it makes you feel better to repeat the slurs, who am I to stop you.