Results 1 to 7 of 7
  1. #1
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    GA
    Posts
    3

    Default Video of Red Light Citation - Cop Can't See Light from His Angle

    My question involves a traffic ticket from the state of: GA

    I received a red light citation in GA. The ticket said that there was a video of the violation so I got the video and the it turns out that the cop was sitting 90 degrees from where I crossed the intersection (in other words, he was not behind me, he was to my left as I crossed the intersection).

    The video shows that the cop cannot see what light I am seeing when I cross the intersection nor can he tell when my light turned red and if it was already red when I entered the intersection. The only thing you see is that the light he is facing turns green as I exit the intersection.

    Can I be cited using this circumstantial evidence? Can the cop claim that since his light turned green as I exited the intersection that given the allotted time for a red to conclude and the facing green to begin that I must have entered when it was red???

    It seems very flimsy and circumstantial to me, and of course my memory is that it did not turn red until I was already in the intersection!

    Also, how do I find out the precise red light, and yellow durations for my municipality?

    Thanks!

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    Behind a Desk
    Posts
    98,846

    Default Re: Video of Red Light Citation - Cop Can't See Light from His Angle

    Yes, the officer can testify that his light was green, therefore yours was red. You can try to argue that the light was broken, but you had best have evidence of that - a report of the problem, repair records, etc. Also, depending on the construction of a traffic light and the time of day, sometimes you can tell the color of a light on a cross street. Depending upon the exact language of the statute or ordinance cited, if the officer agrees that you entered before the light was red, that could be a defense to the cited charge.

    You can see if your city's ordinances are made available through your city's website.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    GA
    Posts
    3

    Default Re: Video of Red Light Citation - Cop Can't See Light from His Angle

    Hi,

    However I have the video. His light was NOT green when I entered the intersection, it was red. His light only turned green immediately after I exited the intersection (not ENTERED, EXITED).

    The video also shows that the cop cannot see what color my light is. The traffic lights are clearly visible from the side in the video and it is clear that he cannot see what color it is.

    Is there something I am missing? Can he possibly argue that he was able to see that the lights from the other direction (my oncoming traffic) were red? I am just trying to figure out what the basis of my ticket is... Because unless I am missing something I cant see why he gave me the ticket and how he can defend it.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Metro Atlanta
    Posts
    71

    Default Re: Video of Red Light Citation - Cop Can't See Light from His Angle

    You're going to have to cross-examine him to figure that one out.

    You can call around to the Department of Transportation for that jurisdiction to find out about the timing of the lights.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    38,867

    Default Re: Video of Red Light Citation - Cop Can't See Light from His Angle

    =tqmshirt;341282]My question involves a traffic ticket from the state of: GA
    was this during the day or night?

    I received a red light citation in GA. The ticket said that there was a video of the violation so I got the video and the it turns out that the cop was sitting 90 degrees from where I crossed the intersection (in other words, he was not behind me, he was to my left as I crossed the intersection).
    actually that is bad for you. That is the best position to be able to determine if you entered the intersection after you light had turned red, if he could distinguish when your light turned red.



    The video shows that the cop cannot see what light I am seeing when I cross the intersection nor can he tell when my light turned red and if it was already red when I entered the intersection. The only thing you see is that the light he is facing turns green as I exit the intersection.
    what was the ambient light level?

    Can I be cited using this circumstantial evidence?
    sure. You can be cited with no evidence. you can contest based on the lack of evidence if there is no evidence to prove your violation

    Can the cop claim that since his light turned green as I exited the intersection that given the allotted time for a red to conclude and the facing green to begin that I must have entered when it was red???
    he can claim that but unless he could see what color your light was, he will also have to testify how long your light is yellow before turning red and how long after your light turned red before his light turned green so as to be able to calculate if you had entered the intersection after your light turned red.



    It seems very flimsy and circumstantial to me, and of course my memory is that it did not turn red until I was already in the intersection!
    of course it wasn't

    Also, how do I find out the precise red light, and yellow durations for my municipality?
    speak to the engineering department of whomever maintains the lights.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    GA
    Posts
    3

    Default Re: Video of Red Light Citation - Cop Can't See Light from His Angle

    --was this during the day or night?

    Morning.

    --That is the best position to be able to determine if you entered the intersection after you light had turned red, if he could distinguish when your light turned red.

    That is my point. From the video it seems clear that he could not see the color of my lights.

    --what was the ambient light level?

    Generally bright. I realize that at night you can see the reflections of the lights even from the side. This was a bright morning with traffic lights that have black extended "covers" or whatever they are called. I cant see how he could tell what color the light was. At least not with certainty.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    38,867

    Default Re: Video of Red Light Citation - Cop Can't See Light from His Angle

    like I said, if he could not see the light from his perspective, the only other way he can testify you light was red before entering would be IF he already knew exactly how long each light is each color before it changes and any time in between light changes.

    like I said, he would have to calculate in reverse:

    how long your light is red before his light turned green (some are immediate, some have a delay) and then, he would have to know exactly how long your yellow was and then he would have to calculate where you would have been exactly that time period before his light turned green.

    and again, he would have to know all of the exact run times of the lights before this incident to be able to determine if you had in fact entered after your light turned red.


    doesn't sound likely


    real simple

    when he testifies; Ask if he could see the light color from the side.

    You will need to be able to prove that he couldn't, or that is is very unlikely. The vid should be good for this but new pics with similar lighting would help prove it.

    then, once he concedes he could not see the light, ask him how long your light is yellow before it changes to red. Then, how long yours is red before his changes to green. Then ask exactly how fast you were going. then ask exactly where your car was when your light turned red.

    if he cannot answer every one of those questions, he cannot answer if your light was red when you entered the intersection because every one of them depends on the other for him to be able to determine via calculation your position.

    btw: if you have the engineering departments time settings, you can blow him out of the water if his "knowledge" is different because his calculations would be incorrect. You will also want to time the lights yourself to check the engineering department.

    and the officers times must be exact. Aprproximations cause variance.

    at 20 mph a car travels 29.3 feet per second. Unless he is extremely accurate, a little "guess" or "approximately" puts you in a very different place in respect to the stop line.




    for the fun of it. when asking about speed, ask him how many feet per second that is your car was travelling. He would have to know this to be able to calculate where your car was at any given instant.

    then, ask how accurate he can determine speed. You can use his tolerance to put your car in positions from one end of his tolerance to the other. If any of them show you not running a red light, he cannot testify that you ran the red light simply due to his margin of error.

    and the big kicker here is:

    if there are sensors at this intersection, you need to see how that affects the light times. If it alters them at all, all of his calculations are worthless since he could not possible know how long any given light is on.

    1. Sponsored Links
       

Similar Threads

  1. Lights, Signs and Traffic Controls: Can You Get A Citation For Running A Yellow Light?
    By cmbend in forum Moving Violations, Parking and Traffic Tickets
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 03-12-2010, 04:52 PM
  2. Lights, Signs and Traffic Controls: Red Light Traffic Citation
    By Death by FM in forum Moving Violations, Parking and Traffic Tickets
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 02-17-2010, 08:24 PM
  3. Lights, Signs and Traffic Controls: PE Red Light Traffic Citation
    By WhattaSchock in forum Moving Violations, Parking and Traffic Tickets
    Replies: 8
    Last Post: 02-09-2010, 01:20 AM
  4. Lights, Signs and Traffic Controls: Failure to Stop at Red Light (Video)
    By celeb09 in forum Moving Violations, Parking and Traffic Tickets
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 08-31-2009, 09:53 AM
  5. Lights, Signs and Traffic Controls: Red Light Violation Citation
    By Lifegame in forum Moving Violations, Parking and Traffic Tickets
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: 04-23-2007, 11:11 PM
 
 
Sponsored Links

Legal Help, Information and Resources