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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Posts
    15

    Default Traffic Accident Leading to a Unsafe Speed Ticket

    My question involves a speeding ticket from the State of: California

    I had just left work and was driving southbound on beach blvd in huntington beach. The speed limit varies on the road from 50-55 and even to 60mph further northbound.

    I was driving between 75-85mph (not sure the actual speed when I hit the brakes), Again I was going southbound on a 3 lane road in each direction with a median in the middle. A vehicle pulled out of a neighborhood on the right side of the street to go Northbound through oncoming traffic (me and the other cars behind me). I slammed on my brakes and hit the rear left side (bumper) of her vehicle. The total impact movement of her car was maybe 5 feet. Meaning from where I hit her to where she ended up (which was nearly where she was going because I almost missed her) was about 5 feet of space. I continued forward holding the brakes still and left a few feet more of skids as out of fear I may have been pushing the gas and brake at the same time and pulled to the side of the road.

    A gang of motorcycle cops appeared and started harassing me, stating that from the skid mark they could tell I was driving at an EXTREMELY high rate of speed. (I may have been going 10-15 mph above the speed limit but flow traffic permitted it and no pedestrians were present anywhere). The officers did the usual finger to eye test to make sure I was not under any substance which I passed with flying colors of course. They never asked once if I was hurt or needed any medical assistance, even though my vehicle was in MUCH worse condition then hers, hers being drivable and only having minimal rear body damage.

    As I stated what happened and how I believed it was her fault for turning out of a neighborhood through traffic to go the opposite direction, one of the officers (the one who actually wrote the ticket I guess) stated "By the time the ink from my pen dries I'm gonna make sure its your fault". Also yelling at me and stating that I am the reason people get killed and whatnot.

    This is all at 8:00pm and it is pretty dark out. The officers do the walk with their measuring device and then state that there is over 400 ft of skid marks (Which I contest and asked them to walk it again with me there, they deny and state they don't want to do it again)

    all this being said I leave and await my fate... 2 days later I get the ticket in the mail, Unsafe Speed. 100mph+, Failure to yield to traffic, and a window tint ticket, all which are infractions..

    My question now that the details have been given, is what can I do to protest this? I was NOT going 100mph + and I have been back to the accident scene the skid marks are NO WHERE NEAR 400ft long, they look to be maybe 200 if that. Which I read equals to a speed equivalent to which I said about 70-80mph. What can I do? Is it not her fault? Was she not supposed to yield?

    Please let me know what I can do and if I have any rights here, the officers did harass me yelling and again never asking if I once needed any assistance.

    Also they didn't give me the ticket there and I never signed anything the ticket where my signature should be states
    Thomas 40600CVC
    Which i read to be a Traffic Collision course the officers must take?

    Please let me know


    Also, will I get a ticket in the courtesy notice in the mail stating how much I owe, or do I need to appear in court? Do I need a lawyer? It is only an infraction right, so the worse that could happen would be a fine? Please I am very nervous about this any help is much appreciated.

    Thanks

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Northern California
    Posts
    832

    Default Re: Traffic Accident Leading to a Unsafe Speed Ticket

    You left a 200+ skid mark? Think of a football field, you are 2/3's of a way to a touchdown. At 400 ft you can slap on the end zones and still have yardage left over.

    If you must speed, don't pick the one where there is cross traffic. People at those stop signs can assume traffic on the cross street (your street) is traveling at or near the speed limit, not 30 over. I say the collision is hands down your fault, no denying that.

    The officer method of speed calculation is critical in determining your speed. The officer who did the calculations should be the equivelent of an accident reconstruction officer. Roadway surface type, grade, weather, lenght of skid and other factors can effect simple speed by skid calculations. At 400 feet, by basic calculations are around 95-98 MPH, thats with dry asphalt conditions, no grade, ect.

    You should probably go back and measure the skids as best you can. If they are 400 feet or less you can use some online skid speed calculators and print out the results to raise reasonable doubt. You were charged with exceeding 100MPH. The officer needs to prove that you were in excess. That's why it is crucial you know how long your skids were.

    On a side note, 528 feet = .1 mile

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Posts
    15

    Default Re: Traffic Accident Leading to a Unsafe Speed Ticket

    I can accept that the accident is my fault, as I was going to fast. But what I do not get is why I was charged with Yield to Traffic. Also, the officer did not look at the tire tread or brake wear while making his assumptions.

    My real question was what is going to happen?

    Do I need to appear in court or will I get a notice stating what I owe?

    What is the most I will have to pay? Is it going to be in the thousands or in the hundreds? Any advice please

    Thank You

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Posts
    15

    Default Re: Traffic Accident Leading to a Unsafe Speed Ticket

    ok so I took pictures of the skid marks and did some gps coordinated measurements and I got between 211-256 Feet. My insurance company has advised me to try to fight the tickets.

    My question is what do I need to do? My court date is on the 28th. The police report states 483 feet of skid marks but there is ABSOLUTELY no way that is true I did aerial photos and measurements and for it to be 483 feet it would have to been down 200+ feet longer nearly to the next light.

    How do I ask for an amended police report? What are my chances with this evidence of beating this?

    Any help

    Thanks

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    SF Bay Area
    Posts
    625

    Default Re: Traffic Accident Leading to a Unsafe Speed Ticket

    You're going to have a really well-prepared argument in order to prove that the officer's was off by that much. 100mph+ is a major violation, and you'd be looking at a near-guaranteed lic suspension and a $500-$2000 fine if the cops convince the court that you were, in fact, speeding over 100. Again, there's a pretty wide spread between the best and the worst case scenario, but the worst-case scenario looks pretty grim for you. I'd seriously consider hiring a GOOD traffic attorney and be open to pleading the whole thing down to a single count of VC22350 (be sure to plead no contest rather than guilty if the judge gives you the option). Suing the stupid broad who made the suicidal left turn isn't out of question, either. The person making a left turn has to yield to the through traffic, anyway.

    I'd also find out if it's possible to get in touch with the ofc who did the original investigation and see if they'd listen - or at least drive by the scene during daytime and check the skidmarks one more time.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Posts
    15

    Default Re: Traffic Accident Leading to a Unsafe Speed Ticket

    ok, my last question is this then. Whatever the outcome shall be, will I be able to pay payments or will I be mandated to pay all at once or suffer something else? Please let me know thank you.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    California
    Posts
    20,594

    Default Re: Traffic Accident Leading to a Unsafe Speed Ticket

    Quote Quoting tmead0123
    View Post
    ok, my last question is this then. Whatever the outcome shall be, will I be able to pay payments or will I be mandated to pay all at once or suffer something else? Please let me know thank you.
    Depending on jurisdiction, they will likely grant you a time period in which to pay the balance in total (30, 60, 90 days or something), but I do not believe any (or, at least, not many) courts allow payment plans.

    - Carl

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Posts
    1,622

    Default Re: Traffic Accident Leading to a Unsafe Speed Ticket

    Exactly which VC sections were you charged with?? I agree with you that the other vehicle should have been charged with the accident for failure to yield.


    Did he make any notes about the grade? Did he measure grade? That would have an effect on the speed estimate. What type of vehicle were you driving? If your car was one of the vehicles on this list, you may be able to argue that the cop had access to specific information regarding your speed. However, he chose to use a much less accurate method.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    California
    Posts
    20,594

    Default Re: Traffic Accident Leading to a Unsafe Speed Ticket

    Actually, Jim, they may not have had access to the data on the vehicle computer. Recent case law has indicated that a search warrant is required to access these systems, and search warrants will not generally issue for a traffic infraction.

    They will issue for ...

    (1) When the property was stolen or embezzled.
    (2) When the property or things were used as the means of committing a felony.
    (3) When the property or things are in the possession of any person with the intent to use it as a means of committing a public offense, or in the possession of another to whom he or she may have delivered it for the purpose of concealing it or preventing its being discovered.
    (4) When the property or things to be seized consist of any item or constitute any evidence that tends to show a felony has been committed, or tends to show that a particular person has committed a felony.
    (5) When the property or things to be seized consist of evidence that tends to show that sexual exploitation of a child, in violation of Section 311.3, or possession of matter depicting sexual conduct of a person under the age of 18 years, in violation of section 311.11, has occurred or is occurring.
    (6) When there is a warrant to arrest a person.
    (7) When a provider of electronic communication service or remote computing service has records or evidence, as specified in Section 1524.3, showing that property was stolen or embezzled constituting a misdemeanor, or that property or things are in the possession of any person with the intent to use them as a means of committing a misdemeanor public offense, or in the possession of another to whom he or she may have delivered them for the purpose of concealing them or preventing their discovery.

    A search warrant for data in an infraction investigation is not covered and is not going to be issued.

    The statutes on these devices originated in 2004 and are found in CVC 9950 et seq.

    But, nothing prevents the defendant from retrieving and using that information on his own behalf to challenge the conclusions of the police investigators, but the state is generally prohibited from obtaining that information absent a court order.

    - Carl

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