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  1. #1
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    Default California Traffic Court Discovery

    My question involves traffic court in the State of California:

    Hey guys, following the procedures here, I wrote an discovery request to my DA. I got a letter back saying, in effect, that the DA is not prosecuting the case and that I should contact the law enforcement agency directly for any information I want. The specific languague was:

    Direct citations issued by law enforcement agencies are not filed by the Riverside County District Attorney's office and are not in possession of the Riverside County District Attorney's office . . . Customarily, the items relevant to your citation are brought to court by the citing officer. Should you need to inspect those documents prior to the date of the trial, contact the law enforcement agency directly.

    Then they tell me to write the CHP Discovery Clerk (which I'm sure is bs) and give me the address for the local CHP office.

    What should my next step be? Write the CHP directly or write a reply to the DA's office telling them that according to Cal Gov. Code 26500 the are the prosecuting attorney of record (please help with that--I've read all the discussion on the board, not sure who's right there) and cite People v. Marcroft that the officer is a witness, nothing more, nothing less? I sort of don't what the discovery to actually happen because I was hoping to get any evidence thrown out because I'm assuming they won't follow up with discovery. That's why I'm a little reluctant to write the law enforcement agency, because what if they follow through.

    Also, is it appropriate to ask that the officer not be allowed to testify if discovery is not followed through with, or would no judge in their right mind grant that?

  2. #2
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    Default Re: California Traffic Court Discovery

    Quote Quoting donselma
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    I've read all the discussion on the board, not sure who's right there
    Nobody's right... Not even the DA... Different courts will handle these matters differently.

    What were you cited with and what did you request via discovery?

  3. #3
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    Default Re: California Traffic Court Discovery

    Citing for crossing the gore point at a interstate off-ramp. Requested the basics:

    (a) Defendant’s statements at time of citation, including those recorded through electronic means;

    (b) The names and addresses of all prosecution witnesses who will testify at trial.

    (c) All relevant statements of known witnesses, including citing officer, whether written or recorded through electronic means, including but not limited to any diagrams or drawings. Request is specifically made for copy of any video recording, or if unavailable, sound recording and transcript of any conversation recorded and a photocopy of the reverse side of the citing officer’s copy of the Notice to Appear, if any notations have been made;

    (d) All notes, records, and log files made by citing officer in regards to the issuance of Citation No. 87017KW;

    (e) A listing of traffic tickets issued by citing officer for the month of May 2009, to include: date and time issued, alleged violation, and disposition (if determined);

    (f) Any of the officer's personnel records: specifically any complaints of misconduct.

  4. #4
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    Default Re: California Traffic Court Discovery

    Quote Quoting donselma
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    Citing for crossing the gore point at a interstate off-ramp.
    What CVC Section (Number)?

    As for the rest of your post.... here are my "personal views".... (others may disagree):
    Quote Quoting donselma
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    (a) Defendant’s statements at time of citation, including those recorded through electronic means;
    You don't remember what you said? Or are you trying to get that excluded if it is not provided to you through discovery? Did you incriminate yourself that bad?

    Quote Quoting donselma
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    (b) The names and addresses of all prosecution witnesses who will testify at trial.
    Usually that is limited to the citing officer... But a legitimate discovery request nevertheless.
    Quote Quoting donselma
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    (c) All relevant statements of known witnesses, including citing officer, whether written or recorded through electronic means, including but not limited to any diagrams or drawings. Request is specifically made for copy of any video recording, or if unavailable, sound recording and transcript of any conversation recorded and a photocopy of the reverse side of the citing officer’s copy of the Notice to Appear, if any notations have been made;
    Typically, that is limited to the officer's copy of the citation and the notes he made on the back of it. If you don't get that through discovery, and if you were to go to court with a motion to compel, I have seen and heard of a few instances where the judge will get you a copy of that from your court file.

    Quote Quoting donselma
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    (d) All notes, records, and log files made by citing officer in regards to the issuance of Citation No. 87017KW;
    See above... Anything above and beyond that (anything related to departmental procedures) will not be used against you in your case and therefore, you're unlikely to get that.

    Quote Quoting donselma
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    (e) A listing of traffic tickets issued by citing officer for the month of May 2009, to include: date and time issued, alleged violation, and disposition (if determined);
    And the point behind this item is??? I hope you're not going to claim that the officer was meeting a quota!

    Quote Quoting donselma
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    (f) Any of the officer's personnel records: specifically any complaints of misconduct.
    You're within your rights to request, review and question the officer about that. You'd be hard pressed in using any of that information to suggest that the officer's complaint record, contributed in any way to him citing you for the violation you allegedly committed. My pooint is if the officer has such a tarnished complaint record, then he won't be issuing citations, he would either be sitting at a desk somewhere or he would have had to give up his badge long before he cited you.

    Basically, and although you are requesting items that you can reasonably argue that you are entitled to via discovery, the DA's anticipated non-compliance will, at best, lead to the exclusions of those items (which were not provided to you) from the evidence against you. If my guess pans out and you get a copy of the officer's notes (whether through the DA, through the court or through the CHP), the rest of the items, and even if they are excluded will not win you the case. The officer will still testify according to his notes, the citation itself could not be excluded because you received and signed a copy of it at the time of the stop....

    All that work... then what?

  5. #5
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    Default Re: California Traffic Court Discovery

    Good point, I was starting to think the same thing. I don't have the actually violation citation handy, but if it might help you make anymore insightful comments, I could definetly look it up. I looked up the text, and it was just basically, something about illegally crossing over lane markings or something like that.

    Agree with most everything you said. Just to give an example, I only asked for the officer's logs for the month because the template I used suggested it; as a newbie, I figure I would just differ to the template even though I knew it would be worthless since I'm not making a quota defense (which I hear is hopeless). I guess the only thing would be the back of the ticket then. Does seem a lot of work for next to nothing.

    About point one, one statement I made that I'm worried he will use against me is that he asked me if I knew I should have exited. I answered yes primarily because I wanted to be agreeable and because I took "should" in a "would have been a good idea" sense, not a legal sense of law-breaking. Now that I'm learning about how officers think, I can see I probably condemned myself to the ticket with that answer since I think otherwise he wouldn't have felt confident enough to write me the ticket since it was night and he was easily 500 ft. behind me (which will be my main argument). When he did inform me he was giving me a ticket for crossing the gore point, I did emphatically insist that I crossed before the gore point when the lines were broken, but I'm afraid the officer will mention my earlier response in court as an admission of guilt, which I didn't intend it to be. Thanks for the good advice.

    For any posters, please nothing telling me how stupid I was to say that or how hopeless my case is now, as destroying the confidence of something who's never stepped in court before will hurt and not help the cause. Only constructive feedback about what can be done with things as they stand now, or perhaps to stay on topic, with any discovery request. Sorry about the disclaimer, but lawyers as as whole aren't known for their tact (sorry, guess a case of a few bad apples spoiling the bunch).

    I think "That Guy" is right, though--discovery's probably not worth the trouble.

    ps If I don't request discovery, am I still entitle to see his notes in court? I've heard I would be if he uses them in his testimony.

  6. #6
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    Default Re: California Traffic Court Discovery

    Quote Quoting donselma
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    Agree with most everything you said. Just to give an example, I only asked for the officer's logs for the month because the template I used suggested it; as a newbie, I figure I would just differ to the template even though I knew it would be worthless since I'm not making a quota defense (which I hear is hopeless).
    Not only is it hopeless, but (for future reference) “quotas” are illegal in California...

    41602. No state or local agency employing peace officers or parking enforcement employees engaged in the enforcement of this code or any local ordinance adopted pursuant to this code, may establish any policy requiring any peace officer or parking enforcement employees to meet an arrest quota.

    41603. No state or local agency employing peace officers or parking enforcement employees engaged in the enforcement of this code shall use the number of arrests or citations issued by a peace officer or parking enforcement employees as the sole criterion for promotion, demotion, dismissal, or the earning of any benefit provided by the agency. Those arrests or citations, and their ultimate dispositions, may only be considered in evaluating the overall performance of a peace officer or parking enforcement employees. An evaluation may include, but shall not be limited to, criteria such as attendance, punctuality, work safety, complaints by citizens, commendations, demeanor, formal training, and professional judgment.


    So while the number of citations that an officer writes during a certain period of time might come into play as part of his performance review, to argue that he/she starts his/her shift by having to write a certain number of citations is an notion that might tend to upset judges if it is brought up by you in court.

    Quote Quoting donselma
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    About point one, one statement I made that I'm worried he will use against me is that he asked me if I knew I should have exited. I answered yes primarily because I wanted to be agreeable and because I took "should" in a "would have been a good idea" sense, not a legal sense of law-breaking. Now that I'm learning about how officers think, I can see I probably condemned myself to the ticket with that answer since I think otherwise he wouldn't have felt confident enough to write me the ticket since it was night and he was easily 500 ft. behind me (which will be my main argument). When he did inform me he was giving me a ticket for crossing the gore point, I did emphatically insist that I crossed before the gore point when the lines were broken, but I'm afraid the officer will mention my earlier response in court as an admission of guilt, which I didn't intend it to be. Thanks for the good advice.
    …...
    ps If I don't request discovery, am I still entitle to see his notes in court? I've heard I would be if he uses them in his testimony.
    I would still follow through with the discovery request and even if it only gets you a copy of the officer's notes. Here's why; an officer, and by the time the court date rolls around, will probably not remember anything about your particular incident. So he will be reviewing his notes (from the back of his copy of the citation). If you are concerned about statements that you made at the time of the stop, then the best way to find out if the officer will mention them in court is to get a copy of his notes. If he made any notes about what was discussed at the time, then, yeah, he's probably going to mention them. If his notes show nothing to the effect, then chances are he won't.

    With that being said, you want to know whether he will mention that before your court date; as that will at least give you the opportunity to try and articulate a response to his statements. Simply waiting until the actual court date might not work to your best advantage.

    Good luck and keep us posted.

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