Results 1 to 3 of 3

Hybrid View

  1. #1
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Posts
    1

    Default Best Defense

    My question involves traffic court in the State of: PA

    I was being the DD for 5 of my friends when I was pulled over around 2AM. I saw where the officer was sitting, and even stopped at a red light right next to his location. I continued to drive about 1.5 miles down the road (stopping at another red light, and switching townships) with no officer behind me when the unmarked officer appeared and turned his lights on. He came to my window and didn't mention his name, police department, or why he was pulling me over. He asked for my license and registration and came back a little later with 2 tickets. He didn't mention what the first one was for, he just said that one of them was because the back passengers were not seatbealted. After he left I realized that he issued me a ticket for speeding (52 in a 35).

    PROBLEMS WITH THE SPEEDING TICKET:

    I stopped at a red light right next to his location, so it would have been impossible to pass him going 52 and then come to a complete stop that quickly.

    He didn't pull out right away, in fact I was already in a different municipality when he finally was behind me.

    the distance timed is .02 miles (about 105 ft) is this too short?

    The officer did not have me sign the citation


    PROBLEMS WITH THE SEATBELT TICKET:

    NONE of my information is filled out (name, address, vehicle info, license number etc.)

    The officer also did not have me sign this citation.

    I was cited under sec. 4581 A2 which says

    (2) Except for children under eight years of age and
    except as provided in paragraphs (1) and (1.1), each driver
    and front seat occupant of a passenger car, Class I truck,
    Class II truck or motor home operated in this Commonwealth
    shall wear a properly adjusted and fastened safety seat belt
    system. A conviction under this paragraph by State or local
    law enforcement agencies shall occur only as a secondary
    action when a driver of a motor vehicle has been convicted of
    any other provision of this title. The driver of a passenger
    automobile shall secure or cause to be secured in a properly
    adjusted and fastened safety seat belt system any occupant
    who is eight years of age or older and less than 18 years of
    age.
    The driver (myself) and the front seat occupant were wearing seat belts. Those in the back seat were not as there were 4 of them squished into 3 seats.


    Are any of these reasons grounds for getting the citations reduced/thrown out? or should I just go with the "I was trying to do the right thing and keep drunk drivers off the road! Feel sorry for me." strategy

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    Behind a Desk
    Posts
    98,846

    Default Re: Best Defense

    I've never found the "it would be impossible" argument to be compelling. You were speeding or you weren't. If you don't know how fast you were going, well, people can and do drive quickly and accelerate quickly. If you do, then you're arguing "I was going X MPH", not "it would have been impossible for me to go Y MPH". Couple the "it would have been impossible" defense with the "besides, the officer didn't have time to figure out my speed" defense, and it seems like you're just making excuses. (Which you're not doing, right? )

    Have you checked to see if the officer's vehicle had a camera on board, and if it was activated for the traffic stop? Your fate may lie on a videotape.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    Washington comma the Great State of.
    Posts
    1,211

    Default Re: Best Defense

    Quote Quoting bopitoup
    View Post
    My question involves traffic court in the State of: PA

    I was being the DD for 5 of my friends when I was pulled over around 2AM. I saw where the officer was sitting, and even stopped at a red light right next to his location. I continued to drive about 1.5 miles down the road (stopping at another red light, and switching townships) with no officer behind me when the unmarked officer appeared and turned his lights on. He came to my window and didn't mention his name, police department, or why he was pulling me over. He asked for my license and registration and came back a little later with 2 tickets. He didn't mention what the first one was for, he just said that one of them was because the back passengers were not seatbealted. After he left I realized that he issued me a ticket for speeding (52 in a 35).

    PROBLEMS WITH THE SPEEDING TICKET:

    I stopped at a red light right next to his location, so it would have been impossible to pass him going 52 and then come to a complete stop that quickly.

    He didn't pull out right away, in fact I was already in a different municipality when he finally was behind me.

    the distance timed is .02 miles (about 105 ft) is this too short?

    The officer did not have me sign the citation


    PROBLEMS WITH THE SEATBELT TICKET:

    NONE of my information is filled out (name, address, vehicle info, license number etc.)

    The officer also did not have me sign this citation.

    I was cited under sec. 4581 A2 which says



    The driver (myself) and the front seat occupant were wearing seat belts. Those in the back seat were not as there were 4 of them squished into 3 seats.


    Are any of these reasons grounds for getting the citations reduced/thrown out? or should I just go with the "I was trying to do the right thing and keep drunk drivers off the road! Feel sorry for me." strategy
    As goes the saying, "The path to hell is often laced with the best of intentions." (Doyle)

    While any judge is going to appreciate your efforts to reduce the number of drunk drivers on the road, that isn't a free pass to otherwise break the law on your own.

    For instance, the law doesn't give brownie points for previous goodness: saving a little old lady from a house fire today doesn't entitle me an equivalent right to murder someone tomorrow even though if I'm removed from the equation, the net death toll would have been equal.

    That said, and as Mr. Knowitall so well put it, when you're arguing that something is impossible, all that needs to be shown is that there is at least one situation which can happen that makes it possible.

    In other words, not that the burden is on the state to disprove any harebrained idea, all they would need to do is prove that you are capable of speeding. I'd imagine if your car has the power to drive around 5 adults (well, presumably 4 adults and yourself; I'll assume you're an adult), then it surely has the horsepower to go above 35 mph.

    Now, if you're aiming to prove that it's impossible for him to have caught you speeding, then that's a different kettle of fish. You'd only need to show that at no point in your approach and departure angles is it possible for a police officer to observe your car for a sufficient amount of time to actually determine your speed. For instance, if we're talking about .02 miles here, then that's not a great distance. If you assume the officer's speed as the base starting line (it's important not to concede he's right; else the rest is unimportant) for the sake of argument alone, then with some simple algebra and trigonometry you may be able to prove that the officer can't have seen/recorded what he claims he's seen/recorded.

    But that's up to you to do. I can, alas, not help with that inasmuch as I don't have access to the locations in question.

    For the record, "I stopped next to the police officer" types of reasoning aren't at all persuasive. Simply because to have stopped next to him implies that you were at some point approaching him. It is the logical inference that he would have clocked you before you stopped, not while you were stopped. Also, the amount of distance it takes for an officer to catch up can cut against you because simple algebra, again, can be used to figure out how fast you must have been going given we know how fast he traveled and how long it took to catch up.

    So, you may prevail if you're clever enough and the officer indeed was wrong, but if you're going to take that route, you'll have to be exceeding careful lest you give away by own your admission that which you're trying to prove contrary during the admission.

    1. Sponsored Links
       

Similar Threads

  1. Traffic Accidents: Injury Case, Did Defense Lawyer Blow the Statute of Limitations Defense
    By lefty in forum Accidents and Injuries
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 07-23-2011, 11:58 AM
  2. Assault & Battery: Gun Self Defense
    By MartinTravels in forum Criminal Charges
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 02-05-2010, 05:20 PM
  3. Assault & Battery: Self Defense or Not
    By GuyInTexas in forum Criminal Charges
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 04-10-2009, 09:03 PM
  4. Assault & Battery: Self Defense and the Law
    By rdonovan1 in forum Criminal Charges
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 11-08-2008, 12:17 PM
  5. Assault & Battery: Self defense and defense of others in New Jersey
    By USN in forum Criminal Charges
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 03-13-2006, 12:15 PM
 
 
Sponsored Links

Legal Help, Information and Resources