Page 1 of 7 1 2 3 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 63
  1. #1

    Default "In Presence" Requirement for Misdemeanor Arrests

    ok let me clear this up so you wont get bad advice.....mostly every state has what is called an "in presence" requirement in accordance to misdemeanors especially shoplifting charges. I would assume 300 bucks is a misdemeanor in Texas terms...but if youre not stopped or detained where the cops have seen the merchandise recovered..and it in their presence...most likely...nothing will be done...unless someone you know saw you....getting license plates are used for future references....when you come back into that store....when I used to get license plates....if the cops didnt stop you on the way from the scene..they basically you got away....cause the cops generally tend to want to recover the evidence for prosecution purposes...

    now that being said..dont take stupid risks like that again....

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Posts
    9,096

    Default Re: Shoplifitng from Fry's in Texas

    Quote Quoting dagreat1
    View Post
    ok let me clear this up so you wont get bad advice.....mostly every state has what is called an "in presence" requirement in accordance to misdemeanors especially shoplifting charges. I would assume 300 bucks is a misdemeanor in Texas terms...but if youre not stopped or detained where the cops have seen the merchandise recovered..and it in their presence...most likely...nothing will be done...unless someone you know saw you....getting license plates are used for future references....when you come back into that store....when I used to get license plates....if the cops didnt stop you on the way from the scene..they basically you got away....cause the cops generally tend to want to recover the evidence for prosecution purposes...

    now that being said..dont take stupid risks like that again....
    Two questions.

    One, if that were truly the case, why would shoplifting have a Statute of Limitations?

    Two, are you prepared to tell the OP that no one EVER has been tracked down and arrested for shoplifting after they left the store?

    How about for an item worth $300?

    I have repeatedly cautioned you on mixing what YOUR retailer did with the law. The points of the law differ tremendously.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Posts
    9,096

    Default Re: Shoplifitng from Fry's in Texas

    Quote Quoting dagreat1
    View Post
    in the truth of it all......cops dont have time to look a the footage of stores like they have nothing better. to do...unless the stop was made right then and there......and they have you in custody......if anything.....the exception would be.....if you were part of a theft ring and police investigators were trying to build a case......
    Again, are you prepared to state that this has NEVER happened? That LP has NEVER reviewed the day's tapes to see when a $300 item walked out the door and then turned that footage over to the police?

    If you cannot say that, please do NOT say that.

    The correct answer, then, would be that the likelihood is reduced, but the possibility exists.

    Which is what I stated in #3.

  4. #4

    Default Re: Shoplifitng from Fry's in Texas

    ok how many shoplifters do you know that get picked up at home on misdemeanor shoplifting. weeks or months after the fact??.....most crimes are required by law to have statue of limitations.... its a matter of public policy...as to their priority on being prosecuted its close to zero or zilch...on whether the state is willing to spend more resources to attempt to recover less than was taken....guaranteed if the case people would be getting picked up over stealing packs of chewing gum day day in and out

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Posts
    9,096

    Default Re: Shoplifitng from Fry's in Texas

    Here is the relevant statute...

    PENAL CODE

    TITLE 7. OFFENSES AGAINST PROPERTY

    CHAPTER 31. THEFT

    Sec. 31.01. DEFINITIONS. In this chapter:
    (1) "Deception" means:
    (A) creating or confirming by words or conduct a false impression of law or fact that is likely to affect the judgment of another in the transaction, and that the actor does not believe to be true;
    (B) failing to correct a false impression of law or fact that is likely to affect the judgment of another in the transaction, that the actor previously created or confirmed by words or conduct, and that the actor does not now believe to be true;
    (C) preventing another from acquiring information likely to affect his judgment in the transaction;
    (D) selling or otherwise transferring or encumbering property without disclosing a lien, security interest, adverse claim, or other legal impediment to the enjoyment of the property, whether the lien, security interest, claim, or impediment is or is not valid, or is or is not a matter of official record; or
    (E) promising performance that is likely to affect the judgment of another in the transaction and that the actor does not intend to perform or knows will not be performed, except that failure to perform the promise in issue without other evidence of intent or knowledge is not sufficient proof that the actor did not intend to perform or knew the promise would not be performed.
    (2) "Deprive" means:
    (A) to withhold property from the owner permanently or for so extended a period of time that a major portion of the value or enjoyment of the property is lost to the owner;
    (B) to restore property only upon payment of reward or other compensation; or
    (C) to dispose of property in a manner that makes recovery of the property by the owner unlikely.
    (3) "Effective consent" includes consent by a person legally authorized to act for the owner. Consent is not effective if:
    (A) induced by deception or coercion;
    (B) given by a person the actor knows is not legally authorized to act for the owner;
    (C) given by a person who by reason of youth, mental disease or defect, or intoxication is known by the actor to be unable to make reasonable property dispositions;
    (D) given solely to detect the commission of an offense; or
    (E) given by a person who by reason of advanced age is known by the actor to have a diminished capacity to make informed and rational decisions about the reasonable disposition of property.
    (4) "Appropriate" means:
    (A) to bring about a transfer or purported transfer of title to or other nonpossessory interest in property, whether to the actor or another; or
    (B) to acquire or otherwise exercise control over property other than real property.
    (5) "Property" means:
    (A) real property;
    (B) tangible or intangible personal property including anything severed from land; or
    (C) a document, including money, that represents or embodies anything of value.
    (6) "Service" includes:
    (A) labor and professional service;
    (B) telecommunication, public utility, or transportation service;
    (C) lodging, restaurant service, and entertainment; and
    (D) the supply of a motor vehicle or other property for use.
    (7) "Steal" means to acquire property or service by theft.
    (8) "Certificate of title" has the meaning assigned by Section 501.002, Transportation Code.
    (9) "Used or secondhand motor vehicle" means a used motor vehicle, as that term is defined by Section 501.002, Transportation Code.
    (10) "Elderly individual" has the meaning assigned by Section 22.04(c).

    Acts 1973, 63rd Leg., p. 883, ch. 399, Sec. 1, eff. Jan. 1, 1974. Amended by Acts 1975, 64th Leg., p. 914, ch. 342, Sec. 9, eff. Sept. 1, 1975; Acts 1985, 69th Leg., ch. 901, Sec. 2, eff. Sept. 1, 1985; Acts 1993, 73rd Leg., ch. 900, Sec. 1.01, eff. Sept. 1, 1994; Acts 1997, 75th Leg., ch. 165, Sec. 30.237, eff. Sept. 1, 1997; Acts 2003, 78th Leg., ch. 432, Sec. 1, eff. Sept. 1, 2003.


    Sec. 31.03. THEFT. (a) A person commits an offense if he unlawfully appropriates property with intent to deprive the owner of property.
    (b) Appropriation of property is unlawful if:
    (1) it is without the owner's effective consent;

    (2) the property is stolen and the actor appropriates the property knowing it was stolen by another; or
    (3) property in the custody of any law enforcement agency was explicitly represented by any law enforcement agent to the actor as being stolen and the actor appropriates the property believing it was stolen by another.
    (c) For purposes of Subsection (b):
    (1) evidence that the actor has previously participated in recent transactions other than, but similar to, that which the prosecution is based is admissible for the purpose of showing knowledge or intent and the issues of knowledge or intent are raised by the actor's plea of not guilty;
    (2) the testimony of an accomplice shall be corroborated by proof that tends to connect the actor to the crime, but the actor's knowledge or intent may be established by the uncorroborated testimony of the accomplice;
    (3) an actor engaged in the business of buying and selling used or secondhand personal property, or lending money on the security of personal property deposited with the actor, is presumed to know upon receipt by the actor of stolen property (other than a motor vehicle subject to Chapter 501, Transportation Code) that the property has been previously stolen from another if the actor pays for or loans against the property $25 or more (or consideration of equivalent value) and the actor knowingly or recklessly:
    (A) fails to record the name, address, and physical description or identification number of the seller or pledgor;
    (B) fails to record a complete description of the property, including the serial number, if reasonably available, or other identifying characteristics; or
    (C) fails to obtain a signed warranty from the seller or pledgor that the seller or pledgor has the right to possess the property. It is the express intent of this provision that the presumption arises unless the actor complies with each of the numbered requirements;
    (4) for the purposes of Subdivision (3)(A), "identification number" means driver's license number, military identification number, identification certificate, or other official number capable of identifying an individual;
    (5) stolen property does not lose its character as stolen when recovered by any law enforcement agency;
    (6) an actor engaged in the business of obtaining abandoned or wrecked motor vehicles or parts of an abandoned or wrecked motor vehicle for resale, disposal, scrap, repair, rebuilding, demolition, or other form of salvage is presumed to know on receipt by the actor of stolen property that the property has been previously stolen from another if the actor knowingly or recklessly:
    (A) fails to maintain an accurate and legible inventory of each motor vehicle component part purchased by or delivered to the actor, including the date of purchase or delivery, the name, age, address, sex, and driver's license number of the seller or person making the delivery, the license plate number of the motor vehicle in which the part was delivered, a complete description of the part, and the vehicle identification number of the motor vehicle from which the part was removed, or in lieu of maintaining an inventory, fails to record the name and certificate of inventory number of the person who dismantled the motor vehicle from which the part was obtained;
    (B) fails on receipt of a motor vehicle to obtain a certificate of authority, sales receipt, or transfer document as required by Chapter 683, Transportation Code, or a certificate of title showing that the motor vehicle is not subject to a lien or that all recorded liens on the motor vehicle have been released; or
    (C) fails on receipt of a motor vehicle to immediately remove an unexpired license plate from the motor vehicle, to keep the plate in a secure and locked place, or to maintain an inventory, on forms provided by the Texas Department of Transportation, of license plates kept under this paragraph, including for each plate or set of plates the license plate number and the make, motor number, and vehicle identification number of the motor vehicle from which the plate was removed;
    (7) an actor who purchases or receives a used or secondhand motor vehicle is presumed to know on receipt by the actor of the motor vehicle that the motor vehicle has been previously stolen from another if the actor knowingly or recklessly:
    (A) fails to report to the Texas Department of Transportation the failure of the person who sold or delivered the motor vehicle to the actor to deliver to the actor a properly executed certificate of title to the motor vehicle at the time the motor vehicle was delivered; or
    (B) fails to file with the county tax assessor-collector of the county in which the actor received the motor vehicle, not later than the 20th day after the date the actor received the motor vehicle, the registration license receipt and certificate of title or evidence of title delivered to the actor in accordance with Subchapter D, Chapter 520, Transportation Code, at the time the motor vehicle was delivered;
    (8) an actor who purchases or receives from any source other than a licensed retailer or distributor of pesticides a restricted-use pesticide or a state-limited-use pesticide or a compound, mixture, or preparation containing a restricted-use or state-limited-use pesticide is presumed to know on receipt by the actor of the pesticide or compound, mixture, or preparation that the pesticide or compound, mixture, or preparation has been previously stolen from another if the actor:
    (A) fails to record the name, address, and physical description of the seller or pledgor;
    (B) fails to record a complete description of the amount and type of pesticide or compound, mixture, or preparation purchased or received; and
    (C) fails to obtain a signed warranty from the seller or pledgor that the seller or pledgor has the right to possess the property; and
    (9) an actor who is subject to Section 409, Packers and Stockyards Act (7 U.S.C. Section 228b), that obtains livestock from a commission merchant by representing that the actor will make prompt payment is presumed to have induced the commission merchant's consent by deception if the actor fails to make full payment in accordance with Section 409, Packers and Stockyards Act (7 U.S.C. Section 228b).
    (d) It is not a defense to prosecution under this section that:
    (1) the offense occurred as a result of a deception or strategy on the part of a law enforcement agency, including the use of an undercover operative or peace officer;
    (2) the actor was provided by a law enforcement agency with a facility in which to commit the offense or an opportunity to engage in conduct constituting the offense; or
    (3) the actor was solicited to commit the offense by a peace officer, and the solicitation was of a type that would encourage a person predisposed to commit the offense to actually commit the offense, but would not encourage a person not predisposed to commit the offense to actually commit the offense.
    (e) Except as provided by Subsection (f), an offense under this section is:
    (1) a Class C misdemeanor if the value of the property stolen is less than:
    (A) $50; or
    (B) $20 and the defendant obtained the property by issuing or passing a check or similar sight order in a manner described by Section 31.06;
    (2) a Class B misdemeanor if:
    (A) the value of the property stolen is:
    (i) $50 or more but less than $500; or

    (ii) $20 or more but less than $500 and the defendant obtained the property by issuing or passing a check or similar sight order in a manner described by Section 31.06; or
    (B) the value of the property stolen is less than:
    (i) $50 and the defendant has previously been convicted of any grade of theft; or
    (ii) $20, the defendant has previously been convicted of any grade of theft, and the defendant obtained the property by issuing or passing a check or similar sight order in a manner described by Section 31.06;
    (3) a Class A misdemeanor if the value of the property stolen is $500 or more but less than $1,500;
    (4) a state jail felony if:
    (A) the value of the property stolen is $1,500 or more but less than $20,000, or the property is less than 10 head of cattle, horses, or exotic livestock or exotic fowl as defined by Section 142.001, Agriculture Code, or any part thereof under the value of $20,000, or less than 100 head of sheep, swine, or goats or any part thereof under the value of $20,000;
    (B) regardless of value, the property is stolen from the person of another or from a human corpse or grave;
    (C) the property stolen is a firearm, as defined by Section 46.01;
    (D) the value of the property stolen is less than $1,500 and the defendant has been previously convicted two or more times of any grade of theft;
    (E) the property stolen is an official ballot or official carrier envelope for an election; or
    (F) the value of the property stolen is less than $20,000 and the property stolen is insulated or noninsulated wire or cable that consists of at least 50 percent:
    (i) aluminum;
    (ii) bronze; or
    (iii) copper;
    (5) a felony of the third degree if the value of the property stolen is $20,000 or more but less than $100,000, or the property is:
    (A) 10 or more head of cattle, horses, or exotic livestock or exotic fowl as defined by Section 142.001, Agriculture Code, stolen during a single transaction and having an aggregate value of less than $100,000; or
    (B) 100 or more head of sheep, swine, or goats stolen during a single transaction and having an aggregate value of less than $100,000;
    (6) a felony of the second degree if the value of the property stolen is $100,000 or more but less than $200,000; or
    (7) a felony of the first degree if the value of the property stolen is $200,000 or more.
    (f) An offense described for purposes of punishment by Subsections (e)(1)-(6) is increased to the next higher category of offense if it is shown on the
    Notice the lack of any language that says if you get it home that you cannot be prosecuted.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Posts
    9,096

    Default Re: Shoplifitng from Fry's in Texas

    Quote Quoting dagreat1
    View Post
    ok how many shoplifters do you know that get picked up at home on misdemeanor shoplifting. weeks or months after the fact??.....
    Are you prepared to say there are none?

    Therefore, the possibility exists.

    most crimes are required by law to have statue of limitations.... its a matter of public policy...
    All crimes have a stated or implied statute of limitations.

    as to their priority on being prosecuted its close to zero or zilch...on whether the state is willing to spend more resources to attempt to recover less than was taken....guaranteed if the case people would be getting picked up over stealing packs of chewing gum day day in and out
    However, that does not mean that, tomorrow, a gung ho DA with a bug up his butt won't start.... or that the economy forces stores to really apply themselves to their LP... or that someone didn't see him, or know him... or, or, or....

    Again, your experience may or may not be what the law states.

    Please refrain from making broad "if you get it home you are free to steal again" claims.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Posts
    9,096

    Default Re: Shoplifitng from Fry's in Texas

    Quote Quoting dagreat1
    View Post
    thats very right tapes surely can....be turned over to the cops...if for whatever reason it was that serious for them to do it.....but realistically that rarely happens unless violence occurs during the stop....
    Or, say, an item worth $300 was stolen, right?

  8. #8

    Default Re: Shoplifitng from Fry's in Texas

    what are you serious...thats not what Im saying....the people on here asked what is likely to happen....key word...likely to happen..not what possible to happen.....everyone on here knows the penalty for shoftlifting if not Im sure they can google it.........I have yet to hear someone ask you the the legal penalty.for shoplifting....they are asking you whats likely to happen...and when you sit around saying the this is very possible based on the law....youre right and wrong at the same time....if you dont know VS. someone who used to prosecute these things on a daily basis....why dont you just say so....

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Posts
    9,096

    Default Re: Shoplifitng from Fry's in Texas

    Quote Quoting dagreat1
    View Post
    what are you serious...thats not what Im saying....the people on here asked what is likely to happen....key word...likely to happen..not what possible to happen.....everyone on here knows the penalty for shoftlifting if not Im sure they can google it.........I have yet to hear someone ask you the the legal penalty.for shoplifting....they are asking you whats likely to happen...and when you sit around saying the this is very possible based on the law....youre right and wrong at the same time....if you dont know VS. someone who used to prosecute these things on a daily basis....why dont you just say so....
    so now you were a prosecutor? I thought you were currently in your third year of law school.

    Notice, again, that I have said what was likely and what was possible. The difference in our approaches is that you seem to be unable to state that the law gives the retailers more than the moment of theft to apprehend the thief.

    And, believe it or not, people come to "expert law" to understand the legal aspects of their question. That is kinda what we do.

  10. #10

    Default Re: Shoplifitng from Fry's in Texas

    300 dollar item...dont know....was it misdemeanor or a felony....thats what you need to look at.... if 499 dollars of stuff was taken and a felony is 500 then guess.....what.....its still treated with the priority of a misdemeanor....
    also....do yourself a favor and look up the in presence requirement for warrantless arrests concerning misdemeanors and how they are applied to shoplifting charges

    1. Sponsored Links
       

Page 1 of 7 1 2 3 ... LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Expungement and Sealing: Is There Any Way to Get a Class B Misdemeanor "Sealed" or "Set Aside" in Texas
    By Betty Cruz in forum Criminal Records
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 03-21-2011, 09:37 PM
  2. Debt Collectors: Can a Collection Agency Try to Collect a "Debt" if I Wrote "Paid in Full" on a Bill
    By tipper369 in forum Debts and Collections
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: 12-27-2010, 11:02 AM
  3. Eviction Process: Oral Lease With No Money Paid nor Proof of Residency. Can I "Evict" This "Tenant"
    By trashyvocabmom in forum Landlord-Tenant Law
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 11-19-2010, 04:24 AM
  4. Defamation: Do Big Businesses Ever Press Charges or Claim "Harassment" to "Save Their Backside"
    By shafted in forum Defamation, Slander And Libel
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 05-24-2010, 10:03 PM
  5. Naturalization: Do Paid Speeding or Parking Tickets Count As "Charged" or "Convicted" on N-400
    By WhoRunTings in forum Permanent Residency and Naturalization
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 03-02-2009, 06:47 AM
 
 
Sponsored Links

Legal Help, Information and Resources