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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
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    5

    Default Stringing Caution Tape and Gas Marker Flags Along the Property Line

    I live in a culdesac in a rural, but private development with about 8 lots. We all have about 10 acres. I do not get along at all with my neighbor to my right, whose property buts up very close to my living area. I have put a line of trees close to the border to block out her dog kennel and maintain some privacy in my sideyard. The trees back up to the woods, which are visable to me...not to her. The property boundry runs through the woods on a diagonal. Yesterday, just to annoy me, she put red gas marker flags in the woods on the property line and strung bright yellow caution tape from boundry post to boundry post (about 75 feet into the woods, it could be farther). First off, my son plays close to the boundry line in the woods with his dog, as it is in our living area. I don't want these dangerous gas line flags that are nothing more than wires sticking out of the ground to injure him should he fall on one or step on one. Winter is coming and they may be masked by leaves and snow. Don't I have a right to take the flags out? They pose a danger in my opinion, as they are low to the ground. Don't I own the property line as well? Do I have a say as to what denotes the property line, being it is neutral territory? Having yellow caution tape up as well looks horrible. Do I have to put up with that? I live in Michigan in a residental-suburban zoned area. My township said they don't handle border disputes, although they will tell me what I can do concerning fences and such. Who do I go to to find out how the border can be marked and what is allowed? I don't want all this unsightly stuff draped through my woods. Thank you to all you reply.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    38,867

    Default Re: Stringing Caution Tape and Gas Marker Flags Along the Property Line

    the neighbor has a right to place whatever on their property as long as there in no law or ordinance restricting it. There is no "neutral territory" with property lines. The line is an immeasurable point where your property ends and the neighbors begins. You can place things on your side of the line and they can place things on their side of the line. You could place something in contact with the line but you cannot cross the line.

    If you believe the flags to be a health hazard and danger, you may try arguing that point with the police. Other than that you are relegated to going to court and asking the courts to order the removal of the flags.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Ohio
    Posts
    2,592

    Default Re: Stringing Caution Tape and Gas Marker Flags Along the Property Line

    Reading your post, I have the feeling that this is not a boundary dispute at all. You and your neighbor apparently agree as to the location of the boundary line. I would think that the tape and gas markers represent a symptom of something else. Have you asked her why she put them there? I would recommend that you do that before doing anything else. Are you sure that she is only doing this to annoy you?

    There is no "neutral territory" associated with a boundary line as it has no width.

    "Having yellow caution tape up as well looks horrible. Do I have to put up with that? "

    If it's on her property and there are no zoning or other restrictions, yes.

    I doubt that the township, the sheriff, or anyone else is going to fix this for free. I would suggest that in your mind you begin to put a dollar figure on this level of annoyance. How much are you willing to pay to make the annoyance go away or to effectively escalate it to the next level?

    Escalation could quickly involve attorneys and surveyors and a cost to you easily in the five figure range, without the least guarantee of an outcome which you might consider favorable to yourself.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Posts
    5

    Default Re: Stringing Caution Tape and Gas Marker Flags Along the Property Line

    Dear "JK" and "Landsurveyor"....these flags and caution tape are NOT INSIDE the property line...they are literally on it. Which means she is in a sense constructing a type of fence with the caution tape and flags. If these items were inside the line I wouldn't have a comment. We are having a surveyor come out tomorrow to check the corners for accuracy. They will mark the property line with a totalling station and we are going to construct a fence inside the property line (just off an inch or so)..that will be marked as well. We have already checked fencing requirements and have been told we can put it right on the property line and it is still ours, but we have chosen to offset it, like I said, just inside the line, therefore there will be no contention. Of course we will pull the necessary permit(s). I know she is doing this to annoy me, as we have already had a confrontation over other issues. This is definitely harrassment. I would much rather prefer to leave a fence off my property, but if she wants to draw attention to the boundries with tape and flags, I am inclined to check those boundries and fence off the legal line. I just feel that the tape and flags are unsightly and resemble "blight." As I said before, the red flags represented danger to me and my family, as they are on pokey wires. She has now put in snow sticks, which can stay there until tomorrow when the surveyor actually marks the line. Right now, all thats out there are approximate boundry markers running through the woods..and these are what she has her caution tape tied to. Any additional thoughts appreciated.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    38,867

    Default Re: Stringing Caution Tape and Gas Marker Flags Along the Property Line

    If you are having the surveyor out, I would suggest you do not know exactly where the line is so to claim she has placed these markers ON the line is a bit presumptious.

    As stated before, there is no true line. You are either on your property or the neighbors property. Your property (and subsequent rights of control) go all the way to thier property and hers are exactly inverse. What many folks believe they can do is place a fence centered on the line but this would put part of your fence on the neighbors property. Not good in most states. In some, you can not only get away with it but you can even force the neighbor to pay for half the fence.

    I do understand about your concerns but with 10 acres a piece, one would think you could find a place for your child to play away from the unfriendly neighbor.

    Maybe it is that you child is crossing the line and the neioghbor simply wants to let you and your child know where the line is so your child will refrain from entering thier property.

    All in all, it does sound like a fence would be in the best interest of both parties though.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Ohio
    Posts
    2,592

    Default Re: Stringing Caution Tape and Gas Marker Flags Along the Property Line

    "If you are having the surveyor out, I would suggest you do not know exactly where the line is so to claim she has placed these markers ON the line is a bit presumptuous."

    I agree completely.

    "They will mark the property line with a totalling station ..."

    Actually it is a "total station" and, if you have not done so already, you have a requirement to inform your surveyor of ALL of the information you have posted here, and anything else pertaining, completely filling him/her (Michigan was the first state to license a woman Land Surveyor, Mary Feindt from Charlevoix. I am honored to have met her) of all of the particulars. A surveyor can not be an "advocate" for you in the same sense as an attorney and can only deal with facts as found.

    "I do understand about your concerns but with 10 acres a piece, one would think you could find a place for your child to play away from the unfriendly neighbor."

    I agree completely.

    As I said before, this "boundary dispute" is a symptom of something else altogether, not mentioned, which obviously predates it. I would suggest finding a local attorney, meaning "in your county". You may quickly need more particular legal advice. Keep your checkbook handy.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Posts
    5

    Default Re: Stringing Caution Tape and Gas Marker Flags Along the Property Line

    First I would like to say "thank you" to both JK and Landsurveyor for your expeditious and straightforward responses.

    I would like to clarify that the area in dispute is wooded, but only about 50 feet from my driveway. It is several hundred yards from the neighbor who is drawing attention to this. I do not have a problem with anyone wanting to make sure that everyone knows where the property lines are...but we have lived here close to 7 years, our 2 children of 12 (both boys) play together...sometimes in the woods. She doesn't have a problem with our 2 boys being friends, spending time at each other's homes, yet she wants to make sure my son, or anyone in our family doesn't put a foot over the wooded property line. There are already 2 tall green stakes about 25 feet from each other...you can see from one to the other (although, as I mentioned, they are not permanent markers and we will see if they are really designating the property line)....why put up yellow caution tape?? Doesn't this seem antagonistic to you both? What she doesn't realize...is that my tree line (set on the grass that backs up to the woods) is offset from those green posts about 2-3 feet inside, therefore, a strip of property behind them is mine! She is treating that area as hers....maintaining it, mowing it, etc. My husband and I have allowed that for about 2 years now...so she will have a rude of awakening when the fence goes up behind those trees. I would have left this alone, had she not forced our hand. Her living area and home are hundreds of yards away from this disputed location. Why she is obsessed with this, I don't know. My township told me they have never heard of anyone stringing caution tape along a boundry and then sticking snow sticks in them. It could constitute a sort of "fencing" and may require some sort of permit. I do know that you can not put anything on the boundry that resembles nails, barbed wire, or spikes. Therefore, anything dangerous sticking out of the ground....even if it were on her property and someone were to get hurt on it...would deem her liable. It's no different than an attractive nuisance. This is not an eccentric old lady we are talking about. It is another family (husband too, who supports all this stuff), who is trying to cause an issue. As you can tell from the vibe of my post, I am irritated. I well let you both know how all the surveying goes today. Thank you for clarifying "total station"....my husband understands all these things better than I, as he is a road contractor (builds highways). He tries to explain how things work, I don't always get the details. Again...thanks for your interest, comments and input.

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