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  1. #51
    Join Date
    Sep 2018
    Location
    Ohio
    Posts
    377

    Default Re: State Lockdowns

    Quote Quoting Harold99
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    Update: This DA dropped the 'driving around' charge/citation.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rzqW6YgJ-ds
    Good, the cop had a stick up his craw. If "Social distancing" is the purpose of the ORDER(s), I would say driving ALONE would qualify as compliant with it, duh!

  2. #52
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    California
    Posts
    20,589

    Default Re: State Lockdowns

    Quote Quoting RJR
    View Post
    Good, the cop had a stick up his craw. If "Social distancing" is the purpose of the ORDER(s), I would say driving ALONE would qualify as compliant with it, duh!
    At my department we're averaging about one call a shift on perceived "violations" of social distancing. It's tedious, to say the least. And some people get absolutely incensed that we're not slamming people to the ground, arresting or citing "violators". We contact, advise, and clear. That's it.
    **********
    Retired Cal Cop Sergeant & Teacher

    Seek justice,
    Love mercy,
    Walk humbly with your God

    -- Courageous, by Casting Crowns ... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pkM-gDcmJeM

  3. #53
    Join Date
    Feb 2020
    Posts
    224

    Default Re: State Lockdowns

    Quote Quoting cdwjava
    View Post
    At my department we're averaging about one call a shift on perceived "violations" of social distancing. It's tedious, to say the least. And some people get absolutely incensed that we're not slamming people to the ground, arresting or citing "violators". We contact, advise, and clear. That's it.
    Those same people are so miserable they actually look for people to make a mistake on the road so they can honk and holler out their windows.

    Quote Quoting RJR
    View Post
    Good, the cop had a stick up his craw. If "Social distancing" is the purpose of the ORDER(s), I would say driving ALONE would qualify as compliant with it, duh!
    If social distancing was working we would never know.

    Now we are only testing the worst cases, say the 5's on a 1 - 5 scale. Once we test all the 5's we simply start testing all the 4's, then the 3's...

    As we perform more tests the cases will go up while we have no clue whether it is still spreading at the same rate. The data is flawed because we are constantly changing the metric at which we test. If all 330M people were tested every three days (which is impossible), then we'd know if social distancing is the silver bullet. As long as social workers and family members of the 80% that are non-hospitalized continue to come in contact with the infected, we will keep spreading it. IOW, we must agree on an acceptable spread rate.

    Tucker Carlson sees through a lot of this. The rest of the people will have to start catching on to take our power back from these drunk politicians and so called experts. People who have been on auto-pay their whole lives.

  4. #54
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    California
    Posts
    20,589

    Default Re: State Lockdowns

    I think that is the theory behind these orders. Slow the spread. In other words, "flatten the curve." Many of the experts seem to think that we are not going to prevent transmission, only delay it long enough to be manageable. The question then becomes, how long do we maintain this pseudo-lockdown in order to flatten that curve?

    One epidemiologist at Stanford said early on in this crisis that we simply don't have enough data to establish a definitive protocol. And, as you point out, only the most serious patients tend to get tested. My bro-in-law's 95 year old mom in an assisted living home developed symptoms and she was not tested. Both he and his wife (my wife's twin sister) developed symptoms, and THEY were not tested. I was living with them during my work week, and I did NOT develop symptoms yet our doctor told us to self-quarantine. My 18 year old nephew has now contracted symptoms and he is living at home. In all, 4 people developed symptoms with doctors saying they likely had COVID-19, 5 additional people were exposed, and zero have been tested. If they DID have COVID-19 and recovered then that changes the math and projections drastically.

    But, there is simply too little known to make effective policy. So, we react with knee-jerk - and often well-intentioned - policies of questionable legal standing.

    Unfortunately, the police are being put into the middle of this tug of war.
    **********
    Retired Cal Cop Sergeant & Teacher

    Seek justice,
    Love mercy,
    Walk humbly with your God

    -- Courageous, by Casting Crowns ... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pkM-gDcmJeM

  5. #55
    Join Date
    Feb 2020
    Posts
    224

    Default Re: State Lockdowns

    Quote Quoting cdwjava
    View Post
    I think that is the theory behind these orders. Slow the spread. In other words, "flatten the curve." Many of the experts seem to think that we are not going to prevent transmission, only delay it long enough to be manageable. The question then becomes, how long do we maintain this pseudo-lockdown in order to flatten that curve?

    One epidemiologist at Stanford said early on in this crisis that we simply don't have enough data to establish a definitive protocol. And, as you point out, only the most serious patients tend to get tested. My bro-in-law's 95 year old mom in an assisted living home developed symptoms and she was not tested. Both he and his wife (my wife's twin sister) developed symptoms, and THEY were not tested. I was living with them during my work week, and I did NOT develop symptoms yet our doctor told us to self-quarantine. My 18 year old nephew has now contracted symptoms and he is living at home. In all, 4 people developed symptoms with doctors saying they likely had COVID-19, 5 additional people were exposed, and zero have been tested. If they DID have COVID-19 and recovered then that changes the math and projections drastically.

    But, there is simply too little known to make effective policy. So, we react with knee-jerk - and often well-intentioned - policies of questionable legal standing.

    Unfortunately, the police are being put into the middle of this tug of war.
    You make my point. The people that are at home and coming in contact with suspected COVID-19 folks are the ones likely spreading it. Yet, the general public who has never come in contact with anyone with those symptoms are the ones being scolded to wear masks. If I was the governor I'd be directing most of my speeches to the folks who are knowingly coming in contact with the suspected infected. That would be family members, doctors, nurses, police, firemen and any social worker...bless their hearts and souls. They should be mandated to wear a big red hat and a hazmat suit when they go outside so we can see them from a mile away.

    Another point you make is the metric they use to test people. They can continue to report an increase in COVID-19 cases simply by testing the folks that they did not test before. It will show more cases and more of a spread rate when actually they are testing folks who had it before. IOW, they can statistically infer the spreading of this disease when it has not spread at all. They should admit the flaws in their data collection protocols because it is far less than scientific.

    The only data they cannot mislead or lie about is the death rate which is 25% of their projected death toll. So just how good are these 'experts?'

  6. #56

    Default Re: State Lockdowns

    Quote Quoting llworking
    View Post
    If you were one of the vulnerable people, like me, who would have a high chance of dying if you got the disease, you would likely think differently about the issue.
    I actually am in a somewhat "high-risk" category for this (or any respiratory pathogen), as a lot of people are. I have asthma, which is relatively mild. But still, it is a potentially predisposing respiratory illness. If I were to get it, it wouldn't necessarily be a death sentence. But if I were ever to get pneumonia from this or anything else, I'd definitely have a much higher chance of dying than I would otherwise. However, I still don't think it's justified to lock people up for taking a walk or having a friend over. This is America, and facing a somewhat more unsafe world in exchange for living in a free country is well worth it to me. Personally, I am being pretty careful with this, and I'm able to since I work remotely.

    I've even started getting groceries and other items delivered instead of going into stores. However, if my state started locking people up for spending time with a friend or taking a walk, I personally would be at those protests despite the risk. Because I think that the fact that using a virus that is not lethal to the majority of people who contract it as an excuse to turn the US into a "show me your papers" type of country instead of a free one is completely unjustified. If I were to get this disease, contract pneumonia as a result, and die of it (as I certainly could), my opinion from the afterlife would still be unchanged honestly. I certainly am far from invincible when it comes to this illness.

    Still, I feel like ensuring that the country remains a place where people have rights and aren't being locked up for taking a walk or something of the sort is an important priority during this difficult time. A lot of states have had success with using stay at home orders that are effectively voluntary, such as in Georgia where I live now and in New York. In Georgia and New York, no one has been locked up or even cited for taking a walk, having a friend over, or anything like that. Businesses have been closed, but they haven't taken to penalizing individuals. And the curve is being "flattened" in both of these areas. I am somewhat "at risk", but I still feel strongly that these stay at home orders need to be created in a sensible manner as opposed to a Michigan or Maryland like manner.

  7. #57

    Default Re: State Lockdowns

    How can someone 'agree with conspiracy theories' - this is basically like saying "I agree with fairy tales" - yea, good for you, you agree with someone's wildly inaccurate and unbacked by anything imagination.

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