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  1. #31
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
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    Default Re: Company Not Paying Until Other Employees Arrive

    Quote Quoting llworking
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    The employee showed up on time. Started working (prepping the truck) and then was told that we would not be paid until his late coworker showed up. The employer is in the wrong here.
    Get on the same page as everybody else. Nobody is arguing the isn’t due pay for the situation you describe.

    Quote Quoting budwad
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    The Federal Court said that he has to be advised in advanced or the situation. How does the employer advise the employee in advance when his partner will show up?
    Now he has been advised in advance. Nobody is disputing he is owed for the day he prepped the truck prior to being told his work day doesn’t start until his work partner is there.

    telling him he can’t clock in until his work partner shows up is no different than situations where a construction employees clock time doesn’t start until the rain stops falling and telling them they can go home and write off the day if they don’t want to stick around for when it does stop raining.

  2. #32
    Join Date
    Mar 2019
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    5

    Default Re: Company Not Paying Until Other Employees Arrive

    Quote Quoting jk
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    Now he has been advised in advance. Nobody is disputing he is owed for the day he prepped the truck p
    telling him he can’t clock in until his work partner shows up is no different than situations where a construction employees clock time doesn’t start until the rain stops falling and telling them they can go home and write off the day if they don’t want to stick around for when it does stop raining.
    I still haven't been advised in advance. This generally only happens when the other employee is going to be more than 15 minutes late and even then it's decided on a case by case basis. We are also expected to be out of the yard by 7:15, so if we don't start working right at 7 we don't make it.

  3. #33
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    Jan 2006
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    38,867

    Default Re: Company Not Paying Until Other Employees Arrive

    Quote Quoting Weiner69
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    I still haven't been advised in advance. This generally only happens when the other employee is going to be more than 15 minutes late and even then it's decided on a case by case basis. We are also expected to be out of the yard by 7:15, so if we don't start working right at 7 we don't make it.
    You stated here you have been told your work day doesn’t start until your work partner shows up so either you weren’t honest when you said that or you have been advised of the contingency.

    obviously if you don’t start working until, as a random time, 7:30 due to your work partner being late you can’t be out of the yard by 7:15. If your employer has a problem with that, it’s there problem. Of course you could use that as a bargaining chip to attempt to start your pay at 7:00 even if your work partner hasn’t shown up. You tell the boss that you obviously can’t do 15 minutes prep work and leave before 7:15 if you aren’t able to start at 7:00. The ball is in their court and they decide which way they want it.

  4. #34
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Posts
    6,662

    Default Re: Company Not Paying Until Other Employees Arrive

    Quote Quoting jk
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    Get on the same page as everybody else. Nobody is arguing the isn’t due pay for the situation you describe..
    I'm on the same page. You ignore the Oregon rule, the case law and continue to hold that the employer can do what they chose to do. Not so under the circumstances.

    The OP is waiting for work (not waiting to be engaged) for the benefit of the employer. It is for the benefit of the employer because if OP didn't show up or went home, the employer looses a crew for the day.

    The Supreme Court has held that time spent waiting for work is compensable if the waiting time is spent "primarily for the benefit of the employer and his business." Armour & Co. v. Wantock, 323 U.S. 126, 132, 65 S.Ct. 165, 168, 89 L.Ed. 118 (1944) (citation omitted). "Whether time is spent predominately for the employer's benefit [is] dependent upon all the circumstances of the case." Id. at 133, 65 S.Ct. at 168; accord Skidmore v. Swift & Co., 323 U.S. 134, 140, 65 S.Ct. 161, 164, 89 L.Ed. 124 (1944). For example, facts may show that the employee was "engaged to wait," which is compensable, or they may show that the employee "waited to be engaged," which is not compensable. Skidmore, 323 U.S. at 137, 65 S.Ct. at 163.
    https://scholar.google.com/scholar_c...en&as_sdt=6,31

    Whether he does work or not (because he has to wait for his partner) he gets paid. He is not on call waiting to be engaged under the rule or the case law. He can just sit in his truck and wait for his partner to show up and get paid for waiting.


    Quote Quoting jk
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    Now he has been advised in advance. Nobody is disputing he is owed for the day he prepped the truck prior to being told his work day doesn’t start until his work partner is there. .
    He has been advised of what? He would have to be advised each and every day whether or not to show up for work based on if his partner is going to show up for work. How is that possible?

    Quote Quoting jk
    View Post
    telling him he can’t clock in until his work partner shows up is no different than situations where a construction employees clock time doesn’t start until the rain stops falling and telling them they can go home and write off the day if they don’t want to stick around for when it does stop raining.
    Companies that have permanent crews pay their workers (may not be full pay) when there is a rain-out.

  5. #35
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    Jan 2006
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    Default Re: Company Not Paying Until Other Employees Arrive

    You’ve never worked non union construction, have you? I have known many such people and with many of the companies, if it’s raining when the crew shows up, it goes precisely as I’ve described. The union guys often have a show up pay clause so they get something but the non union guys, nada unless the boss is being generous.

    and since I work construction and have spoken with literally thousands of construction workers, both union and not, and have seen what I described in action, I think I really do know a bit more about this than you. It’s part of my every day life.

    as to your; the guy is waiting. He is NOT waiting at the behest of the employer. He is waiting to see if the partner will show up so he can go to work. As far as the employee is concerned, ol can do whatever he wants. That is not being engaged to wait.

    so I’ve said my peace and you’ve had your say. I’m not going to belabor the issue any longer. If op believes he is due pay for waiting and doesn’t get it, he can file a wage claim or sue the company. I think he will lose (based on the description of the situation here). You think he’ll win. Hopefully the op doesn’t have to go that far but if he does, hopefully he will return and tell us how it went.

    to weiner69

    you need to have this sort of issue addressed in your union contract. I would make sure the union leaders consider this for your next contract renewal. I believe you should be getting paid at the report time but I don’t believe the labor laws support that argument. It needs to be addressed in your contract.

  6. #36
    Join Date
    Oct 2016
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    3,557

    Default Re: Company Not Paying Until Other Employees Arrive

    Quote Quoting budwad
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    Companies that have permanent crews pay their workers (may not be full pay) when there is a rain-out.
    That may be true of some companies but know where close to true of all.

  7. #37
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
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    6,662

    Default Re: Company Not Paying Until Other Employees Arrive

    Quote Quoting jk
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    as to your; the guy is waiting. He is NOT waiting at the behest of the employer. He is waiting to see if the partner will show up so he can go to work. As far as the employee is concerned, ol can do whatever he wants. That is not being engaged to wait.
    You can repeat your opinion all you like and it is still incorrect according to the law. OP is waiting for his partner at the behest of the employer.

    According to the regulations interpreting the FLSA, a stenographer who reads a book while waiting for dictation, a messenger who works a crossword puzzle while awaiting assignments, [a] fireman who plays checkers while waiting for alarms and a factory worker who talks to his fellow employees while waiting for machinery to be repaired are all working during their periods of inactivity. Since these employees are unable to effectively use the time spent waiting for their own purposes, the time essentially belongs to and is controlled by the employer. Accordingly, in all of these examples, the time spent waiting is an integral part of the job. As such, the employees are engaged to wait, and are therefore entitled to be compensated for their time.
    Want to read the full article?

    https://www.thehumanequation.com/en/...on-do-you.aspx

    If you don't understand it by now nothing I can post will explain it to you.

    Op has already posted that wait time is not addressed in his contract and therefore, his union can't help.

  8. #38
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
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    38,867

    Default Re: Company Not Paying Until Other Employees Arrive

    Quote Quoting budwad
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    You can repeat your opinion all you like and it is still incorrect according to the law. OP is waiting for his partner at the behest of the employer.



    Want to read the full article?

    https://www.thehumanequation.com/en/...on-do-you.aspx

    If you don't understand it by now nothing I can post will explain it to you.

    Op has already posted that wait time is not addressed in his contract and therefore, his union can't help.
    You’re back to being a douche.

    you say I’m wrong. I’ve read everything you’ve provided and don’t see it saying you’re right.

    but keep on with the ad nauseum attacks. It’s your style.

    and obviously you can’t read because I suggested to the op that he propose this sort of issue gets addressed in their next contract.


    now I remember why I stopped posting. Your a f’n jerk with a superiority complex that cannot accept he’s ever wrong.

  9. #39
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Posts
    6,662

    Default Re: Company Not Paying Until Other Employees Arrive

    Nice reply. That's your style. When you are wrong on the law this is how your respond rather than admit that maybe, just maybe you could be wrong. You posted nothing to prove you are correct and I am incorrect except your opinion. I give you law and statutes and give me this. So you are left with this as your only answer. A personal attack.


    Who is being a douche?

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