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  1. #1
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    Feb 2019
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    Exclamation Solicitation of Prostitution in a Massage Parlor

    My question involves criminal law for the state of: Florida

    Robert Kraft and others were recently charged with solicitation of prostitution in a prostitution sting in south Florida. While I don't know the precise details, I can go by what I've heard through the news media.

    Kraft is alleged to have entered an establishment which from all outward appearances is a massage spa (or parlor). Kraft allegedly went inside the lobby area and paid an amount of somewhere from $59 to $79 at the reception area. He was then led to a room where a woman came in and stimulated his genitals. He then gave the woman some money and left the premises.

    I could be wrong, but it doesn't seem like he solicited prostitution. If he was paying for a massage, and they instead provided stimulation of his genitals - without him ever asking for anything special - after which he gave them money, how does that constitute solicitation of anything? What if a house cleaner comes to your house. You pay her $100 in advance to clean your house and instead of cleaning your house - without you ever asking for anything special - she stimulates your genitals, after which you give her another $100. Doesn't there have to be a clear request of sex in exchange for money for it to constitute solicitation?

    In another thread in this forum, someone said "Entrapment is where the police or an agent of the state induced a person to commit a crime they wouldn’t have otherwise done." If the police had enough to get a court order to install cameras inside the spa, then wouldn't that be enough for them to have the authority as well as the duty to at least temporarily shut the place down? So by not shutting it down when they had sufficient reason and duty to do so, haven't they committed entrapment?

    When one enters an establishment of that type, wouldn't there be a reasonable expectation of privacy? Is it actually legal for the police to place cameras inside a place of that type without posting a notice? It's a private place.

    Finally, if a third party forces a woman to have sex with a man against her will, the man is not told she is being forced and she acts as if it is consensual, how could the man she has sex with be charged with having non-consensual sex?

  2. #2
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    Default Re: Solicitation of Prostitution - the Robert Kraft Situation

    That's not the definition of legal entrapment (at least in Florida):

    777.201 Entrapment.—
    (1) A law enforcement officer, a person engaged in cooperation with a law enforcement officer, or a person acting as an agent of a law enforcement officer perpetrates an entrapment if, for the purpose of obtaining evidence of the commission of a crime, he or she induces or encourages and, as a direct result, causes another person to engage in conduct constituting such crime by employing methods of persuasion or inducement which create a substantial risk that such crime will be committed by a person other than one who is ready to commit it.
    (2) A person prosecuted for a crime shall be acquitted if the person proves by a preponderance of the evidence that his or her criminal conduct occurred as a result of an entrapment. The issue of entrapment shall be tried by the trier of fact.

    Note the bolded part. Anyhow, your conjecture that he got an unsolicited hand job is likely not going to stand up in the light of the testimony and other evidence.

  3. #3
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    Default Re: Solicitation of Prostitution - the Robert Kraft Situation

    Quote Quoting Vermont3
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    Kraft is alleged to have entered an establishment which from all outward appearances is a massage spa (or parlor). Kraft allegedly went inside the lobby area and paid an amount of somewhere from $59 to $79 at the reception area. He was then led to a room where a woman came in and stimulated his genitals. He then gave the woman some money and left the premises.

    I could be wrong, but it doesn't seem like he solicited prostitution. If he was paying for a massage, and they instead provided stimulation of his genitals - without him ever asking for anything special - after which he gave them money, how does that constitute solicitation of anything?
    I wasn't present and assume you weren't either. I haven't read the police report or spoken to any witnesses. Maybe you have. Regardless, I don't care to play "what if" games. Law enforcement obviously felt that probable cause for an arrest existed. Whether there's enough evidence for a conviction remains to be seen.


    Quote Quoting Vermont3
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    Doesn't there have to be a clear request of sex in exchange for money for it to constitute solicitation?
    Feel free to read the applicable law.


    Quote Quoting Vermont3
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    If the police had enough to get a court order to install cameras inside the spa, then wouldn't that be enough for them to have the authority as well as the duty to at least temporarily shut the place down?
    The authority? Probably? The duty? No, and it would be particularly silly to shut down the operation if the goal were to conduct a sting operation.


    Quote Quoting Vermont3
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    So by not shutting it down when they had sufficient reason . . . to do so, haven't they committed entrapment?
    No. Do you think that meets the definition you quoted (or the definition provided in "flyingron's" response)? How could law enforcement induce a person with whom they had absolutely no contact whatsoever?


    Quote Quoting Vermont3
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    When one enters an establishment of that type, wouldn't there be a reasonable expectation of privacy? Is it actually legal for the police to place cameras inside a place of that type without posting a notice?
    Yes to both questions, and requiring law enforcement to "post[] a notice" would be patently silly since it would completely defeat the purpose.


    Quote Quoting Vermont3
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    Finally, if a third party forces a woman to have sex with a man against her will, the man is not told she is being forced and she acts as if it is consensual, how could the man she has sex with be charged with having non-consensual sex?
    Perhaps the person filing the charges doesn't know all of the relevant facts.

  4. #4
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    Default Re: Solicitation of Prostitution - the Robert Kraft Situation

    Quote Quoting Vermont3
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    While I don't know the precise details, I can go by what I've heard through the news media.
    Therein lies the problem. When something is reported in the media, one must go over the story with a divining rod to find the truth of the matter.

  5. #5
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    Default Re: Solicitation of Prostitution - the Robert Kraft Situation

    Quote Quoting Vermont3
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    In another thread in this forum, someone said "Entrapment is where the police or an agent of the state induced a person to commit a crime they wouldn’t have otherwise done." If the police had enough to get a court order to install cameras inside the spa, then wouldn't that be enough for them to have the authority as well as the duty to at least temporarily shut the place down? So by not shutting it down when they had sufficient reason and duty to do so, haven't they committed entrapment?

    When one enters an establishment of that type, wouldn't there be a reasonable expectation of privacy? Is it actually legal for the police to place cameras inside a place of that type without posting a notice? It's a private place.
    An affidavit to secure a search warrant does not necessarily mean there is enough evidence for a criminal charge to be brought, and permitting it to remain open is not entrapment, as one element of that is resistance to prior coercion by LE.

    I remember reading a case once where the govt. repeatedly tried to persuade a man to buy child pornography, or some such set up.

    They kept hounding him, of course pretending to be a distributor or such, and there was refusal after refusal. Finally after so many requests, he gave in. He was charged. The defense proffered an argument that it was Entrapment due to repeated houndings. The Court agreed.


    Finally, if a third party forces a woman to have sex with a man against her will, the man is not told she is being forced and she acts as if it is consensual, how could the man she has sex with be charged with having non-consensual sex?
    If the woman admits to your facts you outline, he can't be, or should I say, he won't be convicted if some Prosecutor has an ego problem and charges him, the defense would move for an immediate dismissal.

  6. #6
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    Default Re: Solicitation of Prostitution - the Robert Kraft Situation

    Quote Quoting pg1067
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    The authority? Probably? The duty? No, and it would be particularly silly to shut down the operation if the goal were to conduct a sting operation.
    So the goals of the police department trump the lives of these sex slaves. They have reasonable suspicion that sex slaves are being housed there - such that they can get a court order to install cameras - but they'll let the sex slaves continue to be enslaved. Is there not an ethical dilemma here?

  7. #7
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    Default Re: Solicitation of Prostitution - the Robert Kraft Situation

    Quote Quoting Vermont3
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    So the goals of the police department trump the lives of these sex slaves. They have reasonable suspicion that sex slaves are being housed there - such that they can get a court order to install cameras - but they'll let the sex slaves continue to be enslaved. Is there not an ethical dilemma here?
    Evidence of such is criminally a very serious offense, and pales in comparison to voluntary work for hire.

  8. #8
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    Default Re: Solicitation of Prostitution - the Robert Kraft Situation

    Quote Quoting Vermont3
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    They have reasonable suspicion that sex slaves are being housed there - such that they can get a court order to install cameras - but they'll let the sex slaves continue to be enslaved. Is there not an ethical dilemma here?
    Reasonable suspicion is not enough to prosecute, convict and hold accountable those operating the presumed sex slave operation. It is only enough to get permission to collect more evidence towards that end. If they tried to shut it down with only reasonable suspicion, it would likely not hold up and the owners would either continue to operate or relocate the operation, neither of which would help the victims who likely would not be freed.

  9. #9
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    Default Re: Solicitation of Prostitution - the Robert Kraft Situation

    The OP brings up the question of reasonable doubt. The prosecutor will bear the burden of proof and must be proven to the extent that there could be no "reasonable doubt" in the mind of a "reasonable person" that the defendant is guilty. There can still be a doubt, but only to the extent that it would not affect a reasonable person's belief regarding whether or not the defendant is guilty.

    Unfortunately for Kraft, he will have to prove "unreasonable doubt" and prove his innocence. Granted, this is not how the justice system is designed, but what it has been morphed to. Pretty much like a speeding ticket. You get a ticket, you have to prove your innocence instead of the police proving your guilt.

    In Kraft's case - he's guilty. Let's face it, none of us will believe it was by accident or he didn't consent in some way. The sorry part is, with his money - why did he get caught? There are plenty of ways to put buffers up to assure this? Unbelievable that he didn't take precautions.

  10. #10
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    Default Re: Solicitation of Prostitution - the Robert Kraft Situation

    Quote Quoting Guybrush
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    ...The sorry part is, with his money - why did he get caught? There are plenty of ways to put buffers up to assure this? Unbelievable that he didn't take precautions.
    I just finished reading a book (fiction) in which one of the lead characters, a wealthy and famous man in LA, gets into legal and reputational doo-doo after he's caught having sex-for-hire in sleazy low-class B-girl joints. He acknowledged that he could have easily paid more for high-quality escort services that would have provided him with much more protection from the law, but admitted that the sleaze of the B-girl joints was an integral part of the thrill for him.

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