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  1. #61
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    Jul 2010
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    Default Re: Crossing Double White Line Where the Broken Line Only 50 Yards

    Quote Quoting Brian57
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    It is exactly the scope of my question when I said "I have been in traffic and small claims court about fifteen times fighting my own cases. I highly doubt your experience exceeds that."
    Yes, you have more experience defending yourself in court. I have far more experience seeing people defending themselves as well as general observation of how court works.

    Quote Quoting Brian57
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    People like to think they can express themselves by text and it does not reveal anything about the person doing the typing. Well, it can.
    Fixed that for you. It can reveal things but doesn't always. The interpretation can also be wrong, especially if the person doing the interpreting has an axe to grind.

    But I'm done now. You are not going to change my mind, I'm not going to change yours. We've had our penis measuring contest. It's time to move on.

  2. #62
    Join Date
    Jul 2016
    Location
    Paso Robles, California
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    492

    Default Re: Crossing Double White Line Where the Broken Line Only 50 Yards

    Quote Quoting Brian57
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    I have been in traffic and small claims court about fifteen times fighting my own cases. I highly doubt your experience exceeds that. But anything is possible on the internet.
    Quote Quoting free9man
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    It does exceed that. By a rather large margin.
    Quote Quoting Brian57
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    Oh really? Defending and representing yourself?
    15 times fighting your own cases, wow…you must be some kind of legal scholar. If that's what it takes to understand the law I think that there would be a lot of successful criminal defense attorneys that have very little understand of the legal issues while trying to defend their clients because they have never defended themselves. What a pathetic argument.

    I can tell you that nobody here is impressed by you 15 times in court. There are people in this forum that have more experience than you will ever come close to having. If you don't like the responses, go somewhere else.
    *****
    I may not always be right, but I am never wrong.

  3. #63
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
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    19,041

    Default Re: Crossing Double White Line Where the Broken Line Only 50 Yards

    The workers are diligent because it is their ass on the line if someone doesn't see them.

    It doesn't matter.
    MUTCD is not regulatory in California. As far as this charge is concerned, a technical violation of MUTCD is not exculpatory.

    However, I'd certainly argue that this section on the bridge is poorly marked both with regard to paint and the raised markers. It may not fly, but it's the most compelling defense seen here.

  4. #64
    Join Date
    Mar 2018
    Posts
    287

    Default Re: Crossing Double White Line Where the Broken Line Only 50 Yards

    Quote Quoting EJay
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    Also go check out Fight Your Ticket for your local library. Almost every library has a copy. It is free to do this and on page 150 he gives you a very good TBD example.
    The version "Fight Your Ticket and Win in California", also by David Brown, would be better for Californians. Excellent book!

  5. #65
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
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    19,041

    Default Re: Crossing Double White Line Where the Broken Line Only 50 Yards

    You notify the court of a TBD by filling out the TR-205 and submitting the bail before your appearance date.

  6. #66
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
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    19,041

    Default Re: Crossing Double White Line Where the Broken Line Only 50 Yards

    Again, you are misinterpretting the statute with regard to MUTCD.

    However, I still say there's a pretty good argument here. The paint is in terrible shape and SO ARE THE RAISED MARKERS. Frankly, if you didn't have an inkling there was supposed to be a double line there, the markers certainly wouldn't give you that idea. One would expect the markers to follow the stripes (i.e., that if you have a double line, you'd have double markers). Here, for most of the span there are a bunch of irregularly spaced single markers. On the few places where there is a marker on the ersatz second stripe, they aren't placed in a way that would lead you to believe there was a second stripe there.

  7. #67
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Northern California
    Posts
    832

    Default Re: Crossing Double White Line Where the Broken Line Only 50 Yards

    The problem with this whole argument is that if any of the posters here have ever driven SB 680 since the HOV/express lane was introduced you would know it is extremely well signed. Plenty on "conforming" black and white signs, electronic toll signs, etc tell motorists what that lane is about. Also, the enterences/exits are CLEARLY indicated and fit a specific pattern. So, if a driver would come across a concrete transition that has crappy markings, for only the short duration of the concrete span I would be extremely skeptical as that driver if that was an "exit". I surely wouldn't change lanes there, especially if a police officer was behind me.

    All you have to do is pass one of these enterences/exits to understand that "oh, that's how I get in and out of that lane."

    And for those who are stating that an incompetent engineer created this as an exit just stop. You can CLEARLY see the thermoplastic is not adhering to the concrete surface nearly as well as asphalt surface. When the read was engineered and built, there were no gaps in the markings as they were new. The engineer did their job completely at the time it was built. At the most, this is a maintenance issue with the concrete overpass spans that need restriping. Hell, I'm sending a message to DOT to have them put the sections on a restriping project so no one else gets confused.

    Still though, this OP is going to have a VERY difficult time with this specific case. The main problem is how the OP misinterpreted the blotchy, irregular pattern of white lines for distinct broken stripes that you see between lanes.

  8. #68
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
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    19,041

    Default Re: Crossing Double White Line Where the Broken Line Only 50 Yards

    Just because something was right when it was built doesn't change the fact that it is illegible and confusing now. Frankly, I'd take that photo to the TDN and state my case that it's impossible to tell it was a double yellow line. No matter what other signage they may put on place, this is NOT an HOV issue. He wasn't charged with that. He was charged with crossing a double white line which is no longer there.

  9. #69
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
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    7,604

    Default Re: Crossing Double White Line Where the Broken Line Only 50 Yards

    Quote Quoting flyingron
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    No matter what other signage they may put on place, this is NOT an HOV issue. He wasn't charged with that. He was charged with crossing a double white line which is no longer there.
    Based on OP's description of events: No, he isn't. He is charged with crossing the double white line where it does still exist while exiting the HOV lane.

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