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  1. #51
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    Default Re: Crossing Double White Line Where the Broken Line Only 50 Yards

    Quote Quoting Brian57
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    It is common sense that a motorist does not have to follow lines that are not there. As for the CVC that state when a person can disobey traffic control devices, well, I know it is there and know how it reads because I almost used it for defense of my left turn photo ticket. Besides, stating CVC is not the end all in a courtroom.
    I'll run with this one. You're right CVC isn't the end all in a courtroom. If you want the court to accept your interpretation of it, it's best to come with case law or other evidence supporting that interpretation to convince them.

    Quote Quoting Brian57
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    As I recall, the CVC states when a person can disregard traffic control devices.
    1) When an officer says you can.
    2) When an authorized traffic control company directs you to.
    3) When it is necessary to avoid a collision.

    There, go search it! Oh, I found it for you: CVC 21462.
    Good job! Evidence to back your assertion. See, it's not MY job to do the googling. If you come in here and say a law or regulation exists, it is on you as the person asserting it to provide evidence of it.

    Too bad this isn't the one I was talking about. If you go back and re-read what I've posted here, you'd see I was referring to your assertion that a. there is a law that says the law sniper posted doesn't apply and b. that double markers are required to stand in for double white lines when that isn't what the law says.

  2. #52
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    Default Re: Crossing Double White Line Where the Broken Line Only 50 Yards

    Quote Quoting free9man
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    I'll run with this one. You're right CVC isn't the end all in a courtroom. If you want the court to accept your interpretation of it, it's best to come with case law or other evidence supporting that interpretation to convince them.



    Good job! Evidence to back your assertion. See, it's not MY job to do the googling. If you come in here and say a law or regulation exists, it is on you as the person asserting it to provide evidence of it.

    Too bad this isn't the one I was talking about. If you go back and re-read what I've posted here, you'd see I was referring to your assertion that a. there is a law that says the law sniper posted doesn't apply and b. that double markers are required to stand in for double white lines when that isn't what the law says.
    I am not sure what your position on this citation is but even a grade schooler could talk his way out of it. No case law needed, just a photo of the bridge and a closeup of the pavement. Also, if you told the officer why his citation is bogus, he will likely not even show up to lose. But it would be a cold day in **** for him to do the right thing and drop the charges.

    All you need is a judge who is awake while you are presenting your case.

  3. #53
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    Default Re: Crossing Double White Line Where the Broken Line Only 50 Yards

    Quote Quoting Brian57
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    I am not sure what your position on this citation is
    Seriously? 6 pages and you haven't figured that one out? OP broke the law. The cite is legit. I will stipulate that there is some razzle dazzle that could be used to bluff his way out of it.

    Quote Quoting Brian57
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    but even a grade schooler could talk his way out of it.
    I don't know about that.

    Quote Quoting Brian57
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    No case law needed, just a photo of the bridge and a closeup of the pavement.
    No, that's not all you need. You have to be able to explain why those pictures prove you didn't do what you clearly did or justify it in some way. I'd also like to see someone get those pics safely without getting more citations for blocking the roadway.

    Quote Quoting Brian57
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    Also, if you told the officer why his citation is bogus, he will likely not even show up to lose.
    Officers are held accountable to for blowing off court so I doubt that. Plus, it's no skin off the officer's back if he loses.

    Quote Quoting Brian57
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    But it would be a cold day in **** for him to do the right thing and drop the charges.
    There is no reason to drop the charges.

    Quote Quoting Brian57
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    All you need is a judge who is awake while you are presenting your case.
    No, you have to convince the judge your version is worthy of a not guilty finding.

  4. #54
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    Default Re: Crossing Double White Line Where the Broken Line Only 50 Yards

    Quote Quoting free9man
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    Seriously? 6 pages and you haven't figured that one out? OP broke the law. The cite is legit. I will stipulate that there is some razzle dazzle that could be used to bluff his way out of it.

    I don't know about that.

    No, that's not all you need. You have to be able to explain why those pictures prove you didn't do what you clearly did or justify it in some way. I'd also like to see someone get those pics safely without getting more citations for blocking the roadway.

    Officers are held accountable to for blowing off court so I doubt that. Plus, it's no skin off the officer's back if he loses.

    There is no reason to drop the charges.

    No, you have to convince the judge your version is worthy of a not guilty finding.
    OMG, you have got to be kidding. You must not get out of the house very much, and have never set foot in a courtroom.

    We are not responsible for incorrect road markings or signage. End of story.

  5. #55
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    Default Re: Crossing Double White Line Where the Broken Line Only 50 Yards

    Quote Quoting Brian57
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    OMG, you have got to be kidding. You must not get out of the house very much, and have never set foot in a courtroom.
    I've spent plenty of time in a courtroom. Probably far more than you. Known a few judges too.

    Quote Quoting Brian57
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    We are not responsible for incorrect road markings or signage. End of story.
    No, it's not. But we'll have to agree to disagree on that one.

    Since neither side is going to budge on this disagreement, I would say it's time to walk away. Don't you agree?

  6. #56
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    Default Re: Crossing Double White Line Where the Broken Line Only 50 Yards

    Quote Quoting free9man
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    I've spent plenty of time in a courtroom. Probably far more than you. Known a few judges too.

    No, it's not. But we'll have to agree to disagree on that one.

    Since neither side is going to budge on this disagreement, I would say it's time to walk away. Don't you agree?
    I have been in traffic and small claims court about fifteen times fighting my own cases. I highly doubt your experience exceeds that. But anything is possible on the internet.

    As for signage and markings, citations are dropped all the time when proven in error. Why do you suppose roadside workers are so diligent about getting their signage and cones right and in accordance to the MUTCD? Hint: Because it matters!

    I have a serious question for you. What do you get out of telling people that they are guilty and have no case?

  7. #57
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    Default Re: Crossing Double White Line Where the Broken Line Only 50 Yards

    Quote Quoting Brian57
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    I have been in traffic and small claims court about fifteen times fighting my own cases. I highly doubt your experience exceeds that. But anything is possible on the internet.
    It does exceed that. By a rather large margin.

    Quote Quoting Brian57
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    I have a serious question for you. What do you get out of telling people that they are guilty and have no case?
    I get nothing out of it. Not a single thing. Why do I need to be getting something out of it when I point out to people that they did, in fact, break the law and should accept the consequences for doing so? As to having no case, in many cases that is simply the cold hard truth. If the officer broke the law, misinterpreted the law or there was some other malfeasance, I'm all for someone fighting their case. Otherwise, I am firmly in the "take your lumps" crowd.

  8. #58
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    Default Re: Crossing Double White Line Where the Broken Line Only 50 Yards

    Quote Quoting free9man
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    It does exceed that. By a rather large margin.
    Oh really? Defending and representing yourself?

    I get nothing out of it. Not a single thing. Why do I need to be getting something out of it when I point out to people that they did, in fact, break the law and should accept the consequences for doing so? As to having no case, in many cases that is simply the cold hard truth. If the officer broke the law, misinterpreted the law or there was some other malfeasance, I'm all for someone fighting their case. Otherwise, I am firmly in the "take your lumps" crowd.
    Oh you get something out of it. Kinda like someone who drives around screaming and pointing out stupid drivers.

  9. #59
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    Default Re: Crossing Double White Line Where the Broken Line Only 50 Yards

    Quote Quoting Brian57
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    Oh really? Defending and representing yourself?
    No but then that wasn't the scope of your inquiry. I have seen lots of people defend themselves. Some won, many lost.

    Quote Quoting Brian57
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    Oh you get something out of it. Kinda like someone who drives around screaming and pointing out stupid drivers.
    So now you know me? You know my mind, my heart, my spirit? I don't think so. You are also completely wrong. Now, as I mentioned earlier, why don't we walk away from this since it is getting no one anywhere?

  10. #60
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    Default Re: Crossing Double White Line Where the Broken Line Only 50 Yards

    Quote Quoting free9man
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    No but then that wasn't the scope of your inquiry. I have seen lots of people defend themselves. Some won, many lost.
    It is exactly the scope of my question when I said "I have been in traffic and small claims court about fifteen times fighting my own cases. I highly doubt your experience exceeds that."

    So now you know me? You know my mind, my heart, my spirit? I don't think so. You are also completely wrong. Now, as I mentioned earlier, why don't we walk away from this since it is getting no one anywhere?
    People like to think they can express themselves by text and it does not reveal anything about the person doing the typing. Well, it does.

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