Ticket for Disregarding a Stop Sign in Colorado

[Maria Lyentre]

Well, the officer behavior was rather strange. To me it looks as he is bipolar. Once I observed a lady, who was having her very first bipolar episode, and your description looks very similar to what I saw. So maybe by the time you'd get your day in court, the officer would be diagnosed, and then you'd be found innocent. If the officer health is ok, owl could be a very good defence anyway. Here's why:the officer was distracted by an owl, and was not able to pay an attention to the stop sigh. He was so distracted that he forgot to bring your driver license. Your only problem is, that, if the officer denies the owl story, you have no prove to make him to admit it. I would have requested his dash camera video, via discovery request. Hopefully he had dash camera, and it was running. Good luck! Please let us know how it ends up.

[thewiseone]

The concept of convincing a judge that an officer who has testified that he observed the defendant's vehicle, and saw that it failed to come to a complete stop before going through a stop sign, is cute. But it's an exceptionally weak argument to attempt in court.

Weak? Yes. "Exceptionally weak"? No. If you'd rather pay, go right ahead. On the other hand, if you want to challenge the ticket, and the cop shows up, you may as well try it. Do you have a better idea?

[free9man]

Well, the officer behavior was rather strange. To me it looks as he is bipolar. Once I observed a lady, who was having her very first bipolar episode, and your description looks very similar to what I saw. So maybe by the time you'd get your day in court, the officer would be diagnosed, and then you'd be found innocent. If the officer health is ok, owl could be a very good defence anyway. Here's why:the officer was distracted by an owl, and was not able to pay an attention to the stop sigh. He was so distracted that he forgot to bring your driver license. Your only problem is, that, if the officer denies the owl story, you have no prove to make him to admit it. I would have requested his dash camera video, via discovery request. Hopefully he had dash camera, and it was running. Good luck! Please let us know how it ends up.

What? Get outta here with this garbage.

[Maria Lyentre]

What? Get outta here with this garbage.

You are not only very rude, but you are not very bright too. Once I was able to beat a stop sign ticket because the officer forgot to testify he had a partner with him, a parntner he could have talket to and get distracted. I told the judge about the partner, and she believed me and dismissed an unfair ticket.
That officer behavior with owl is more than strange. Of course a good officer should notice evrything around him, everything and everybody who could violate a law. Owls are not the ones who could do it. Flashing a light on an owl, could be considered as animal abuse. OP has a great defence, if he would be able to prove his owl story.

So, free9man, I believe you have no idea what you are talking about, and probably should stop posting here.

[Taxing Matters]

Weak? Yes. "Exceptionally weak"? No. If you'd rather pay, go right ahead. On the other hand, if you want to challenge the ticket, and the cop shows up, you may as well try it. Do you have a better idea?

If this was the best defense I had then yes, I do have a better idea: show up, hope the prosecution is willing to amend the charge to some violation with a lesser fine that will not result in points on the license (or at least less than the 4 points for this violation if convicted) and if that doesn’t work, just pay the fine and move on. In order to have any shot at making this argument work you need expert testimony and an expert report, and that expert report has to be provided to the prosecution before trial, so they’ll know you plan to challenge the ticket with that argument and will be prepared for that. You’d have to have the expert there to testify (which you pay for) and you need to know how to get the witness certified as an expert and how to do the examination of the witness if you are going to do this pro se. If you don’t know how to do all that, you won’t get the expert testimony considered and the argument will go nowhere. Even if you do all that there is no guarantee the judge will agree with your argument. Your cost to do that will far exceed the cost of the ticket, so unless your insurance increase as a result of the points on the license justifies the expense I do not see this approach as worthwhile to pursue.

Here's why:the officer was distracted by an owl, and was not able to pay an attention to the stop sigh. He was so distracted that he forgot to bring your driver license. Your only problem is, that, if the officer denies the owl story, you have no prove to make him to admit it. I would have requested his dash camera video, via discovery request. Hopefully he had dash camera, and it was running. Good luck! Please let us know how it ends up.

Not likely to work. There is no evidence, even from the story told by the OP that supports a diagnosis of being bipolar and even if he was being bipolar does not mean that he could not see whether a vehicle made a complete stop.

As to the idea you raise above that the owl distracted him from seeing whether the car stopped, there is nothing to support that either. Bear in mind that while this noise (whether an owl or whatever) was heard while he was writing the ticket, it may not have occurred when he observed the violation and in any event there is no indication that the sounds could be heard from inside his patrol car. As arguments go, this is very weak indeed. Unless the officer seems very flustered on the stand I do not see this one as having any shot at success.

Note that if there is a dash cam and it caught the OP's car at the time of the alleged violation that might end up proving the matter one way or the other. That's the one avenue that might prove useful here. Or it might simply make the state’s case. But at least the OP would know one way or the other.

[free9man]

So, free9man, I believe you have no idea what you are talking about, and probably should stop posting here.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHA. No. You are saying the officer was bipolar. That is not something you are qualified to say. You getting lucky with a dumbass judge is just that, luck. You are aware that people are capable of imitating owls, yes? Flashing a light at an owl being abuse? Again, get outta here with this nonsense.

[thewiseone]

In order to have any shot at making this argument work you need expert testimony and an expert report, and that expert report has to be provided to the prosecution before trial, so they’ll know you plan to challenge the ticket with that argument and will be prepared for that. You’d have to have the expert there to testify (which you pay for) and you need to know how to get the witness certified as an expert and how to do the examination of the witness if you are going to do this pro se. If you don’t know how to do all that, you won’t get the expert testimony considered and the argument will go nowhere. Even if you do all that there is no guarantee the judge will agree with your argument. Your cost to do that will far exceed the cost of the ticket, so unless your insurance increase as a result of the points on the license justifies the expense I do not see this approach as worthwhile to pursue.

The question "do you have a better idea" was not to you, as is obvious from the quote in my post asking it. But thanks again for the funnies.

[free9man]

The question "do you have a better idea" was not to you, as is obvious from the quote in my post asking it. But thanks again for the funnies.

While it is obvious, that doesn't stop anyone from replying to it. It's a free board.

[Taxing Matters]

The question "do you have a better idea" was not to you, as is obvious from the quote in my post asking it. But thanks again for the funnies.

Of course it was apparent that you were replying to Mr. Knowitall. But I thought you or the OP might like to hear the ideas of others, too. Even if you knew the rules for getting scientific evidence before a Colorado court the OP might not, and understanding what is involved and that it is not cheap is important to making an informed decision about what things might actually be worth trying. I trust you do not disagree with that.

[Maria Lyentre]

If this was the best defense I had then yes, I do have a better idea: show up, hope the prosecution is willing to amend the charge to some violation with a lesser fine that will not result in points on the license (or at least less than the 4 points for this violation if convicted) and if that doesn’t work, just pay the fine and move on. In order to have any shot at making this argument work you need expert testimony and an expert report, and that expert report has to be provided to the prosecution before trial, so they’ll know you plan to challenge the ticket with that argument and will be prepared for that. You’d have to have the expert there to testify (which you pay for) and you need to know how to get the witness certified as an expert and how to do the examination of the witness if you are going to do this pro se. If you don’t know how to do all that, you won’t get the expert testimony considered and the argument will go nowhere. Even if you do all that there is no guarantee the judge will agree with your argument. Your cost to do that will far exceed the cost of the ticket, so unless your insurance increase as a result of the points on the license justifies the expense I do not see this approach as worthwhile to pursue.



Not likely to work. There is no evidence, even from the story told by the OP that supports a diagnosis of being bipolar and even if he was being bipolar does not mean that he could not see whether a vehicle made a complete stop.

As to the idea you raise above that the owl distracted him from seeing whether the car stopped, there is nothing to support that either. Bear in mind that while this noise (whether an owl or whatever) was heard while he was writing the ticket, it may not have occurred when he observed the violation and in any event there is no indication that the sounds could be heard from inside his patrol car. As arguments go, this is very weak indeed. Unless the officer seems very flustered on the stand I do not see this one as having any shot at success.

Note that if there is a dash cam and it caught the OP's car at the time of the alleged violation that might end up proving the matter one way or the other. That's the one avenue that might prove useful here. Or it might simply make the state’s case. But at least the OP would know one way or the other.

Well, here is a quote from op

it almost seemed as if the cop had taken something or might have been loopy from exhaustion or something. When he approached my car to bring my ticket, instead of addressing me, he was shining is flashlight into the treeline and staring intently. I waited for a moment, but he continued and said nothing to me. He then told me he heard an owl and he was looking for it. He then ran back to his car, it turns out he forgot to bring my license back to me. When he finally handed me the citation and gave me the normal speech this is what you did, this is your court date, etc. he stopped at least 2 or 3 times to listen for the owl and tell me how distracting it was. Very disconcerting that this man is "protecting" our streets.

As you see OP writes it looked as "the cop has taken something". So I suggested it might have been a bipolar episode because that description looks very similar to what I observed once. I am not saying the cop is bipolar. I only saying that maybe he is. When, a few years ago I observed a lady behaving similarly, I knew nothing about bipolar. I simply thought she was strange, but In a few days she ended up in a hospital, and got her diagnosis.
Also OP says that cop himself said the owl call was distracting. Remember, OP should not prove the officer was not distraced, when pooled him over, he only should introduce a reasonable doubt, and the cop himself claiming the owl calls were distracting is that reasonable doubt. I am sure that if OP would be able to prove the owl story, and if a judge is fair, he should win.