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  1. #1
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    Sep 2010
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    Default Re: Ran Traffic Light. Off Duty Pulls Me Over

    Even if he was off duty it doesn't invalidate the citation. I used to hang out with an Baltimore (admittedly Baltimore County) police officer. Seen him write tickets "off the clock" a few times. Sometimes he's in uniform, sometimes not.

  2. #2
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    Sep 2005
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    Default Re: Ran Traffic Light. Off Duty Pulls Me Over

    Quote Quoting flyingron
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    Even if he was off duty it doesn't invalidate the citation. I used to hang out with an Baltimore (admittedly Baltimore County) police officer. Seen him write tickets "off the clock" a few times. Sometimes he's in uniform, sometimes not.
    For safety reasons, it's not too good an idea to conduct stops or make contacts when one is OFF duty as you tend to NOT have nifty little things like a vest, a radio, a Taser, handcuffs, etc. When we are off duty we may have a badge and a gun, but, that's about it. Most agencies discourage this or forbid it except in very limited cases, even if the law allows it. I can't speak for Baltimore, but, if this is commonplace for OFF duty officers, I have to scratch my head as to the "why" of it.

  3. #3
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    Default Re: Ran Traffic Light. Off Duty Pulls Me Over

    Off duty he still has his vehicle here and presumably all that stuff. The officer in the poster's question appeared to be driving an unmarked unit as it had lights.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Dec 2014
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    732

    Default Re: Ran Traffic Light. Off Duty Pulls Me Over

    go to court,, see if that cop who pulled you over to start with shows up, that's what I would do

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
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    New Jersey
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    Default Re: Ran Traffic Light. Off Duty Pulls Me Over

    Sounds like you're a prick but you do need some advise.

    When you go to court, the officer that issued you the citation must be present as well as the officer in the unmarked vehicle.

    If for some reason only the officer that wrote the citation is present, move for a dismissal under the grounds of hearsay.

  6. #6
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    Default Re: Ran Traffic Light. Off Duty Pulls Me Over

    Quote Quoting Who'sThatGuy
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    If for some reason only the officer that wrote the citation is present, move for a dismissal under the grounds of hearsay.
    Although if you confessed to the ticketing officer that you ran the light, the officer's recitation of that confession would not be hearsay.

  7. #7
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    Sep 2005
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    California
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    Default Re: Ran Traffic Light. Off Duty Pulls Me Over

    Quote Quoting flyingron
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    Off duty he still has his vehicle here and presumably all that stuff. The officer in the poster's question appeared to be driving an unmarked unit as it had lights.
    That is sooo bizarre! And a potentially HUGE liability for an agency! I wonder how many of those officers declare this huge benefit on their taxes??? You'd never see that out here. Unless you have a take-home vehicle and are headed to or from work, or on a work-related errand, you'd best leave the official ride at home. I have a take-home car as well, but, you'll never see me in it unless it's work-related. And, even then, if it's not full duty, I won't generally have a radio, vest, OC spray, or Taser. I'd have a gun and a badge in the car.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Quoting railslave
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    Yes whosthatguy, i am a prick. No denying that. And no changing that either. But i do appreciate the advice givin. As i always live to realize, there is always a bigger prick then i. I kept the story pretty short considering, but i promise you the off duty takes the prick cake in this who incedent.
    Says the guy who ran the red light ...

    As I mentioned, they could have been the bigger pricks if they wanted to. The fact that they did NOT order you out of the car when you played your little window game shows that they were professional enough not to bite and didn't let their egos get in the way. So, instead, they allowed you to retain the prick prize.

  8. #8
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    Sep 2010
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    Default Re: Ran Traffic Light. Off Duty Pulls Me Over

    I don't know how things are in California, but take home cars are not uncommon here. I don't know how much personal business one is allowed in them (which would be the only way they'd be a taxable benefit). There's a Sheriff's car parked behind my house most days of the week.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
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    Default Re: Ran Traffic Light. Off Duty Pulls Me Over

    Quote Quoting flyingron
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    I don't know how much personal business one is allowed in them (which would be the only way they'd be a taxable benefit).
    Take home cars have been all the rage in my area too. Agencies use them to justify not giving out pay increases, etc... I have seen them parked at an amusement park. We asked an officer one time and he said it was because he was on call 24/7 but he is there with his family. If he were to get called in, he'd either have to strand them at the park or take them to work. Not very family friendly options.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
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    California
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    Default Re: Ran Traffic Light. Off Duty Pulls Me Over

    Quote Quoting flyingron
    View Post
    I don't know how things are in California, but take home cars are not uncommon here. I don't know how much personal business one is allowed in them (which would be the only way they'd be a taxable benefit). There's a Sheriff's car parked behind my house most days of the week.
    Take home is not the same as free-to-use! Most everywhere I know of, to use your agency car for personal business would be a violation of policy and, quite possibly (in the extreme) an inappropriate use of department funds (i.e. embezzlement). If there is an MOU in place allowing the vehicle to be used for personal use even when not on duty, then those folks had best be declaring that to the IRS.

    Unless civil laws are vastly different in other states, an agency granting the personal use of an agency vehicle is opening themselves up to huge potential liability. Maybe there are agencies that do that. But, I would think that such a use is inappropriate, unwise, and unsafe even if they are contractually permitted to do so.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Quoting free9man
    View Post
    Take home cars have been all the rage in my area too. Agencies use them to justify not giving out pay increases, etc... I have seen them parked at an amusement park. We asked an officer one time and he said it was because he was on call 24/7 but he is there with his family. If he were to get called in, he'd either have to strand them at the park or take them to work. Not very family friendly options.
    That sort of an excuse is laughable unless the officer is part of a SWAT team or some special on-call assignment that is commonly subject to being called in. I wonder how often this really happens. And if he is on call 24/7 and subject to instantaneous response, I hope that he is adequately compensated for that particular inconvenience - especially since it would mean no drinking, no leaving town, etc.

    Look, I have heard all of these arguments. Maybe in other states they can get away with it until it comes back to bite the agency in the butt (like the family is involved in a collision in the city car), but, it's a weak argument in most cases.

    In way of perspective I am the #2 in my agency. I DO get called in to work with some frequency, yet, there is no expectation that I get to use my city owned vehicle for anything other than official business. If I am out of town, I take my personal car. If I have to come back to the city, the family is coming with me and I will get my city ride from the front of my house. And unless the officer in the amusement park scenario is so far from the office that it is a significant delay to not take his family home first, then maybe they should take two cars ... provided there's a realistic chance of a call-out. But, if he's an Admin. officer, that likelihood is theoretical only.

    I've known administrators in some agencies to do just this sort of tap dance and wink ... and I have also known a few to get dinged by the tax man for failing to disclose the benefit, especially if they also deduct mileage or some other portion of a personal ride.

    I stand by my contention that an agency vehicle being used for personal, off duty conduct is unsafe, unwise, and often inappropriate. And, in the extreme, can be malfeasance up to and including the criminal.

    The taxpayers out here go ballistic on the idea of take-home cars in the first place. If they were to see public employees taking their families out, going for dinner or an amusement park, etc., the screams would be heard all the way from Oregon to Baja! When the economy took a dump, most agencies out here got rid of take-home rides because of the expense. Ironically, the people with take-home cars often tend to be the people that least need them ... others have to go to the office, first, to get a car. In the long run, take home rides tend to be efficient, good for morale and the cars last longer. But, for personal errands? Uh ... no.

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