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  1. #1

    Default What Stipulations Should Be Included in a Custody Order

    My question involves a child custody case from the State of: California

    I’m including some stipulations/provisions on the custody-visitation order that I’d like to discuss in mediation. I have written some stipulations in relation to “if the father misses visits” or “if the child is ill.” And I want to be very fair to dad. But since I’m “mom” I have no idea what to stipulations I should consider in reference to me. Any father’s (or anyone) would like to suggest some stipulations you think mom should abide by?

    Thanks….

  2. #2
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    Default Re: Stipulations/Provisions on the Custody-Visitation Order for Mother to Adide by

    Can you give us a brief outline of what you're trying to do? The exact wording would help a great deal!

  3. #3

    Default Re: Stipulations/Provisions on the Custody-Visitation Order for Mother to Adide by

    Well here's one stipulation I thought of...


    • If mother and child relocate in-state, then “every other weekend” schedule should be automatically imposed


    • Location and time of pickup and drop-off will be at parents discretion
    • Each parent should travel half way of distance to drop-off/pick-up child





    Quote Quoting Dogmatique
    View Post
    Can you give us a brief outline of what you're trying to do? The exact wording would help a great deal!

  4. #4
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    Default Re: Stipulations/Provisions on the Custody-Visitation Order for Mother to Adide by

    Quote Quoting Needlegaladvice77
    View Post
    Well here's one stipulation I thought of...


    • If mother and child relocate in-state, then “every other weekend” schedule should be automatically imposed


    • Location and time of pickup and drop-off will be at parents discretion
    • Each parent should travel half way of distance to drop-off/pick-up child
    If you move and cause a distance between dad and child, while should dad be responsible for half of transportation? If dad moves would it be fair to you to pay and drive half way for his visits? California is a long state, what if you live in the very bottom and dad lives at the very top of the state? Distance could be huge and anything over 100 miles is often considered in many courts to be long distance and. Every other weekend you want the child to be a car if say the distance was a 5 hour drive each way?

    Not thinking dad is going to like this one.

    What's the ones you want to add if dad misses visits?

    - - - Updated - - -

    I went back and read some of your previous threads. Child is only 6 months old, unlikey your going to get dad to agree putting in stipulations if he misses visits, this is not a case where dad has been out of the childs life for some time. Your not going to get a court to agree to that to either, parenting time does not have to be used by the NCP.

  5. #5

    Default Re: Stipulations/Provisions on the Custody-Visitation Order for Mother to Adide by

    Well if dad misses visits on a frequent basis (not if its an emergency or rare occasasions) that perhaps the current phase in visitation stay as is until he can illustrate that he is able to visit with the child and has the time to partake in visits...?

    I'm open to your opinion, what provisions should I as mom be held accountable for?

    Quote Quoting gam
    View Post
    If you move and cause a distance between dad and child, while should dad be responsible for half of transportation? If dad moves would it be fair to you to pay and drive half way for his visits? California is a long state, what if you live in the very bottom and dad lives at the very top of the state? Distance could be huge and anything over 100 miles is often considered in many courts to be long distance and. Every other weekend you want the child to be a car if say the distance was a 5 hour drive each way?

    Not thinking dad is going to like this one.

    What's the ones you want to add if dad misses visits?

    - - - Updated - - -

    I went back and read some of your previous threads. Child is only 6 months old, unlikey your going to get dad to agree putting in stipulations if he misses visits, this is not a case where dad has been out of the childs life for some time. Your not going to get a court to agree to that to either, parenting time does not have to be used by the NCP.

  6. #6
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    Default Re: Stipulations/Provisions on the Custody-Visitation Order for Mother to Adide by

    Quote Quoting Needlegaladvice77
    View Post
    Well if dad misses visits on a frequent basis (not if its an emergency or rare occasasions) that perhaps the current phase in visitation stay as is until he can illustrate that he is able to visit with the child and has the time to partake in visits...?

    I'm open to your opinion, what provisions should I as mom be held accountable for?
    I agree with gam.

    Now. There's nothing stopping you from rewording things in a couple of years; something along the lines of either "If Father is more than 45 minutes late, he has forfeited the visit and there will be no make-up time awarded.

    If it were me, I'd say the forfeiture is applied for one visit only. If he can get your little 'un in the morning, the day after, he still has a shot...unless he's 45 minutes late for that one, too.

    That being said, the more flexible you are the less likely Dad will throw a hissy fit. Not making a big deal about it will work in your favor and most importantly, little 'uns favor. This also doesn't mean that you have to sit by the door waiting - maybe you can contact him after 30 minutes for a "Hey, it's only me...give me a call if you still want to pick up kiddo; we've got a couple of chores to do but if you want, you can just send me a quick text and we can arrange a different meeting place"

    I have one HUGE caveat though (surprise! ) and that is if he misses regular visitation on a ridiculous level...for example, Dad gets an overnight every week but he's used only one or two in the past 6 months, you may wish to think about modifying to include a clause about 'if Dad misses 6 consecutive visits, Mom has the right to allow visitation at her discretion".

    Make sense?

    There are several ways you can play with the wording. I do think gam's right though - the court isn't likely to act just yet.

  7. #7
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    Default Re: Stipulations/Provisions on the Custody-Visitation Order for Mother to Adide by

    Agreeing with what Dog said. It takes 6 months to a year of missing visits on a regular basis for most courts to take time from the current schedule.

    I would have a stip that says if either party is more then 30 minutes(just depends some go for an hour)late the other party does not have to wait. Courts also like to see that partial time is better then no time, so say its a weekend visit and he does not show for Fri night, if he calls and still wants time working something out for pickup on Sat is what they like to see.

    See how you word it if either party is more then x amount late. What applies to one parent should also apply to another. Bottom line if your the CP plan on getting stuck, because again they don't have to take their time. If it starts happening on a regular basis, then you can take it to court. If dad cancels time without making arrangements with you, you don't have to give make up time, but they do expect you attempt to work something out. Understand though that if you as CP cancel time, you owe him that time back and you should not make a regular practice of that. You must work with dad and get his permission to change the schedule.

    You can ask the court to require you guys to use a site like Family Wizard to do all communicating. It helps in cases where communication is lacking and it keeps record of the communication. Make sure for now you do all contact through email.

    When your in mediation, you just got to kind of feel out the mediator. You don't want to come off like your controlling or trying to micromanage dad. To the court you felt dad was fine to have a child with and 6 months after having the child now he is not a good parent.

    If your moving you should plan on paying for the travel, best you can hope for is it is split in half. You also need to discuss that in mediation and have something in there allowing you to move. CA tends to allow moving, but there are still rules to it, so you need to find out what those are in CA and you would be wise since your going through court to make sure this is brought up.

    How far are you planning on moving? What you put in your order depends on how far this move is and how often the visits can be. I would have set days and times for distance in the order, it rarely works not having it specific. My one daughter has had nothing but messes with a long distance schedule that does not have specifics. It has required her to go back to court a few times to get more specific wording, because dad does as he pleases and she gets stuck way to often. In her case the court didn't want to look at his pattern prior to the order, they made them start fresh and he has done exactly what she told the court he would. Even with specifics in the order, he rarely follows it, you never know until last minute if he is showing and he rarely is on time. If they want to be a pain they will be.

  8. #8

    Default Re: Stipulations/Provisions on the Custody-Visitation Order for Mother to Adide by

    Thank you so much Dogma! You’re always so kind to me and you give me sensible advice! My issue is the wording of what I’d like to have as a stipulation or clause… I guess I was using the wrong word, “clause” is a better term. So since the baby is only 6 months and the father hasn’t established a relationship with him yet and there is no order that’s been established nor broken, you think that the mediator and/or judge will think it’s ridiculous to place any clauses/stipulations?

    BTW – I like the clause that is dad misses regular visits like 6 times in 6 months that mom has a right to allow visitation at her discretion! (I know, not exact wording!) lol
    Quote Quoting Dogmatique
    View Post
    I agree with gam.

    Now. There's nothing stopping you from rewording things in a couple of years; something along the lines of either "If Father is more than 45 minutes late, he has forfeited the visit and there will be no make-up time awarded.

    If it were me, I'd say the forfeiture is applied for one visit only. If he can get your little 'un in the morning, the day after, he still has a shot...unless he's 45 minutes late for that one, too.

    That being said, the more flexible you are the less likely Dad will throw a hissy fit. Not making a big deal about it will work in your favor and most importantly, little 'uns favor. This also doesn't mean that you have to sit by the door waiting - maybe you can contact him after 30 minutes for a "Hey, it's only me...give me a call if you still want to pick up kiddo; we've got a couple of chores to do but if you want, you can just send me a quick text and we can arrange a different meeting place"

    I have one HUGE caveat though (surprise! ) and that is if he misses regular visitation on a ridiculous level...for example, Dad gets an overnight every week but he's used only one or two in the past 6 months, you may wish to think about modifying to include a clause about 'if Dad misses 6 consecutive visits, Mom has the right to allow visitation at her discretion".

    Make sense?

    There are several ways you can play with the wording. I do think gam's right though - the court isn't likely to act just yet.
    - - - Updated - - -



    Gam, I just noticed your response! Thank you so much for the thoroughness! It really clears up a lot of pending questions! And I agree 100% that I don’t want to come off as controlling AT ALL with the mediator. The other day I called to ask if it was appropriate to bring in a visitation plan to discuss with dad, and the mediator on the phone said it was perfectly fine. But your right that I need to get a feel for how the mediator’s personality is like beforehand so my intentions aren’t misconstrued or misinterpreted by her/him.

    I plan to move about 175-200mi’s away. Dad parent’s live in the vicinity where I’m planning to relocate to, so I know that he’s up there quite often (not that I am relying on that). But I wouldn’t be oppose to paying half of the travel costs, especially b/c I will no longer have a car once I move to the city so I know it’s a big sacrifice on his end. I was thinking having one weekend-off and one weekend-on to visit with dad but it might make better sense to visit every two weekends? What do you think? What sounds fair in this instance?
    Quote Quoting gam
    View Post
    Agreeing with what Dog said. It takes 6 months to a year of missing visits on a regular basis for most courts to take time from the current schedule.

    I would have a stip that says if either party is more then 30 minutes(just depends some go for an hour)late the other party does not have to wait. Courts also like to see that partial time is better then no time, so say its a weekend visit and he does not show for Fri night, if he calls and still wants time working something out for pickup on Sat is what they like to see.

    See how you word it if either party is more then x amount late. What applies to one parent should also apply to another. Bottom line if your the CP plan on getting stuck, because again they don't have to take their time. If it starts happening on a regular basis, then you can take it to court. If dad cancels time without making arrangements with you, you don't have to give make up time, but they do expect you attempt to work something out. Understand though that if you as CP cancel time, you owe him that time back and you should not make a regular practice of that. You must work with dad and get his permission to change the schedule.

    You can ask the court to require you guys to use a site like Family Wizard to do all communicating. It helps in cases where communication is lacking and it keeps record of the communication. Make sure for now you do all contact through email.

    When your in mediation, you just got to kind of feel out the mediator. You don't want to come off like your controlling or trying to micromanage dad. To the court you felt dad was fine to have a child with and 6 months after having the child now he is not a good parent.

    If your moving you should plan on paying for the travel, best you can hope for is it is split in half. You also need to discuss that in mediation and have something in there allowing you to move. CA tends to allow moving, but there are still rules to it, so you need to find out what those are in CA and you would be wise since your going through court to make sure this is brought up.

    How far are you planning on moving? What you put in your order depends on how far this move is and how often the visits can be. I would have set days and times for distance in the order, it rarely works not having it specific. My one daughter has had nothing but messes with a long distance schedule that does not have specifics. It has required her to go back to court a few times to get more specific wording, because dad does as he pleases and she gets stuck way to often. In her case the court didn't want to look at his pattern prior to the order, they made them start fresh and he has done exactly what she told the court he would. Even with specifics in the order, he rarely follows it, you never know until last minute if he is showing and he rarely is on time. If they want to be a pain they will be.

  9. #9
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    Default Re: Stipulations/Provisions on the Custody-Visitation Order for Mother to Adide by

    You want to move the child that far away and put such strict stipulations on his visits? I don't think you're going to have very good luck with that. Remember that dad is as much of a parent as you are. He's not lesser than in terms of making rules or deciding what happens with your (plural) child.

  10. #10

    Default Re: Stipulations/Provisions on the Custody-Visitation Order for Mother to Adide by

    Well no, the stipulations would apply if/when I'm near dad... but if/when I move, then those stipulations wouldn't apply... See, when going into mediation, I'd like to have variations on visitation plans, like what would happen when/if I move away... (which is what I'm planning to do once my job agreement is complete)... IDK, it was one example of what I saw in the mediation video...

    Quote Quoting mmmagique
    View Post
    You want to move the child that far away and put such strict stipulations on his visits? I don't think you're going to have very good luck with that. Remember that dad is as much of a parent as you are. He's not lesser than in terms of making rules or deciding what happens with your (plural) child.

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