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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
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    25

    Default Rules for What is Considered Transmutation of Assets

    My question involves estate proceedings in the state of: California
    My wife recently passed away. I am in a legal battle with her son from a prior marriage. She owned a vehicle that was her separate property before we got married, but after we were married, she went to the dmv and changed ownership to both of us on the registration and pink slip. I also did the same with my vehicle, but it was sold while we were married and before she passed away. We both assumed that this was all that was needed in order for joint ownership. She had a will that left the vehicle to her son and he is saying the transmutation was not properly done. Do I have spousal survivorship rights to this vehicle, or does the son have rights because he was named in the will? Or is the value to be split between us? I thought that if title is legally changed to include both husband and wife that it becomes a jointly owned asset, but now I am confused. Thank you so much.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
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    OH10
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    Default Re: Rules for What is Considered Transmutation of Assets

    How exactly does the title read, it matters? Generally a jointly titled vehicle is owned by both parties. She could only bequeath her ownership interest.
    Coownership Registration

    4150.5 . Ownership of title to a vehicle subject to registration may be held by two (or more) coowners as provided in Section 682 of the Civil Code, except that:

    (a) A vehicle may be registered in the names of two (or more) persons as coowners in the alternative by the use of the word "or." A vehicle so registered in the alternative shall be deemed to be held in joint tenancy. Each coowner shall be deemed to have granted to the other coowners the absolute right to dispose of the title and interest in the vehicle. Upon the death of a coowner the interest of the decedent shall pass to the survivor as though title or interest in the vehicle was held in joint tenancy unless a contrary intention is set forth in writing upon the application for registration.

    (b) A vehicle may be registered in the names of two (or more) persons as coowners in the alternative by the use of the word "or" and if declared in writing upon the application for registration by the applicants to be community property, or tenancy in common, shall grant to each coowner the absolute power to transfer the title or interest of the other coowners only during the lifetime of such coowners.

    (c) A vehicle may be registered in the names of two (or more) persons as coowners in the conjunctive by the use of the word "and" and shall thereafter require the signature of each coowner or his personal representative to transfer title to the vehicle, except where title to the vehicle is set forth in joint tenancy, the signature of each coowner or his personal representative shall be required only during the lifetime of the coowners, and upon death of a coowner title shall pass to the surviving coowner.

    (d) The department may adopt suitable abbreviations to appear upon the certificate of registration and certificate of ownership to designate the manner in which title to the vehicle is held if set forth by the coowners upon the application for registration.
    http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/vctop/d03/vc4150_5.htm

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Posts
    25

    Default Re: Rules for What is Considered Transmutation of Assets

    So from what I am reading and understanding,, If the vehicle is titled using the word "and" then it passes upon death to the other person on the title. But if it uses the word "or" then there has to be other special wording to make it automatically pass to the other owner. The title uses the word "or" between our names. Thanks for your help.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
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    OH10
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    17,019

    Default Re: Rules for What is Considered Transmutation of Assets

    So it appears the issue is what if anything was presented on the registration application. It appears based on a bit of research, it is illegal to designate him as the TOD recipient on the title app, with joint ownership. It appears the law clearly gives you ownership by statute.
    http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/reg_hdbk/ch11/ch11_15.htm
    11.070 Transfer on Death (TOD) Beneficiary

    The sole registered owner of a vehicle/vessel may designate a transfer on death (TOD) beneficiary to whom ownership of the vehicle/vessel may be transferred upon death of the owner.

    The TOD beneficiary is not a registered owner and the signature or consent of the beneficiary is not required for any transaction involving the vehicle/vessel during the lifetime of the registered owner.
    Only one registered owner and one designated TOD beneficiary can be shown on the vehicle/vessel title.
    The TOD beneficiary may be an individual, corporation, trust, partnership, association, or other entity.
    A fee to add, delete, or change a TOD beneficiary is due in addition to any other fees.

    Quote Quoting gguubb
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    So from what I am reading and understanding,, If the vehicle is titled using the word "and" then it passes upon death to the other person on the title. But if it uses the word "or" then there has to be other special wording to make it automatically pass to the other owner. The title uses the word "or" between our names. Thanks for your help.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Posts
    25

    Default Re: Rules for What is Considered Transmutation of Assets

    This stuff sure is confusing, to say the least.. He was not named at TOD beneficiary on the title.. But he was named in the will. I guess it all comes down to the fact of how the wording of "and" or "or" is used on title. I have another question.. We also had some assets with the wording of "and/or" between our names on the registration papers for some fairly valuable assets that are not vehicles...they are breeding livestock. If the will leaves 1/2 of community assets to him, how will title to these affect the ownership upon death? Is it assumed that these are "jointly owned" or "tenants in common" ownership? I have been doing research on California presumption and sometimes it says that "joint tenants" is presumed and some say "tenants in common is presumed". Are there any statutes to show ownership is "joint" in these circumstance? All of these assets were bought while we were married, except for one. The one that was owned by her was put into both our names right before we were married. Does that also constitute a transmutation thanks again!

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
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    OH10
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    Default Re: Rules for What is Considered Transmutation of Assets

    It sounds like you have ownership in entirety which means the moo cows belong to you now. I'm sure someone with better info on CA law will jump in.

    See CA civil code 682.1 and 683.

    http://www.leginfo.ca.gov/cgi-bin/di...0&file=678-703

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