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  1. #21
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Location
    Pennsylvania
    Posts
    806

    Default Re: Was I Profiled I Was Made Uncomfortable and Want Money

    Quote Quoting jk
    They do? Go ahead and site that law for me.
    In reference to Court facilities having to provide lockers -
    §913. Possession of Firearm or Other Dangerous Weapon in Court Facility

    "Facilities for checking firearms or other dangerous weapons.—Each county shall make available at or within the building containing a court facility by July 1, 2002, lockers or similar facilities at no charge or cost for the temporary checking of firearms by persons carrying firearms under section 6106(b) or 6109 or for the checking of other dangerous weapons that are not otherwise prohibited by law. Any individual checking a firearm, dangerous weapon or an item deemed to be a dangerous weapon at a court facility must be issued a receipt. Notice of the location of the facility shall be posted as required under subsection (d). (Chgd. by L.1999, Act 59, eff 2/15/00.)"

    Quote Quoting jk
    that is not the city and the city makes a HUGE difference.
    It is not in Philly, and Philly is the ONLY First Class City in PA which has different rules. Therefore, EVERY single other lcoation (other than Philly), is treated the same.

    Quote Quoting jk
    seriosly dude, you are going to argue about terminology? Your LTCF IS a CCP and even you have proven that by saying one is required if you wish to carry a weapon, dare I say it, CONCEALED?
    Words have meaning - ESPECIALLY in law. Can you tell me where the word "concealed" appears in "License to Carry Firearm"? That's right, it's not there. Do you think that was by accident? Think a bunch of legislators said "hey - let's change the name from Concealed Carry Weapons permit to Licenst To carry Firearms for no specific reason? There was a specific reason for the change. Why is irrelevant to this matter.

    Quote Quoting jk
    Beyond that, are you saying a private entity cannot prohibit you from possessing a gun in their property? I'll let you chase the laws and post the supporting law if you can find it.
    Yes. That is what I am saying. Let's say I am over at your house, JK, watching TV. You run out to the local 7-11 or whatever, and the cops come. They knock on the door and I answer the door, and they want to come inside and look around. Am I the authorized individual to grant or deny them permission? That's what I'm saying - the the individuals prohibiting me from exercising my rights were not the authorized individuals to make that demand.

  2. #22
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    Behind a Desk
    Posts
    98,846

    Default Re: Treated With Suspicion Because I Asked if I Could Bring a Gun to a Hearing

    Quote Quoting PADriver13
    View Post
    Can I get some money?
    No.
    Quote Quoting PADriver13
    I called the CareerLink office the day before by hearing. I called to ask if firearms were prohibited and if so, if they provided a secure way for legal carriers to secure their weapons while attending official business. I was hung up on and treated rudely by the secretaries, who would not give me any information.
    That's not illegal.
    Quote Quoting PADriver13
    Day of the hearing, I decided, against my own good judgement, to leave my firearm securely secured in my car.
    Perhaps you should sue yourself, then, because you were unarmed by choice.
    Quote Quoting PADriver13
    When I walked in and signed in, I was told to sit in a specific section of the waiting area.
    That's not illegal.
    Quote Quoting PADriver13
    At that point, 4 males came to where I was sitting and stood around, starring at me.
    That's not illegal.
    Quote Quoting PADriver13
    They kept looking at me and made me feel intimidated and like I was not supposed to be there. I kept getting more and more uncomfortable.
    That's not illegal.
    Quote Quoting PADriver13
    Than my lawyer (for the unemployment matter) showed up and took me outside of the building. He asked me if I had a gun on my and asked why on Earth I would bring a gun to an unemployment hearing?
    That's not illegal.
    Quote Quoting PADriver13
    He asked if I knew how many people took guns to unemployment offices to shoot them up (well, that's why I wanted to bring my gun...mr. lawyer). He tells me that I'm lucky that I wasn't arrested and that I'm lucky the cops weren't called.
    That's not illegal.
    Quote Quoting PADriver13
    We go back in and the "judge" asked me why I called and asked to bring a gun?
    That's not illegal.
    Quote Quoting PADriver13
    She basically tells me I am an idiot and that I should know guns can't be taken onto federal or state property.
    That's not illegal.
    Quote Quoting PADriver13
    Um, ok "judge". Your office is paying rent as a tenant to the building owner. CareerLink is not a State organization. This isn't a Post Office. I explain to the judge that I think she is mistaken, and that I think it is inappropriate to be discussing this prior to our unemployment hearing.
    It's not illegal to be mistaken.
    Quote Quoting PADriver13
    So again, I'm upset. I'm afraid to exercise my right to self preservation because of my persecution by all these antis.
    You weren't persecuted by anybody.
    Quote Quoting PADriver13
    I was intimidated by those 4 guys who stood with their arms cross starring at me.
    How sad for you.
    Quote Quoting PADriver13
    Do I have any damages?
    No.
    Quote Quoting PADriver13
    Can I get some money from those 4 guys that were intimidating me?
    No.
    Quote Quoting PADriver13
    How about money from the "judge" that decided to berate me without having an f*ing clue what she was talking about?
    No.
    Quote Quoting PADriver13
    Thanks!
    You're welcome.

  3. #23
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    38,734

    Default Re: Was I Profiled I Was Made Uncomfortable and Want Money

    "Facilities for checking firearms or other dangerous weapons.—Each county shall make available at or within the building containing a court facility by July 1, 2002, lockers or similar facilities at no charge or cost for the temporary checking of firearms by persons carrying firearms under section 6106(b) or 6109 or for the checking of other dangerous weapons that are not otherwise prohibited by law. Any individual checking a firearm, dangerous weapon or an item deemed to be a dangerous weapon at a court facility must be issued a receipt. Notice of the location of the facility shall be posted as required under subsection (d). (Chgd. by L.1999, Act 59, eff 2/15/00.)"
    bravo.


    It is not in Philly, and Philly is the ONLY First Class City in PA which has different rules. Therefore, EVERY single other lcoation (other than Philly), is treated the same.
    so you do understand inference. So, I suspect you really do know what I mean when I say; know what I mean?


    Words have meaning - ESPECIALLY in law. Can you tell me where the word "concealed" appears in "License to Carry Firearm"? That's right, it's not there. Do you think that was by accident?
    nope. WOrds are often not defined. When they are not, the common definition is used. THere is often case law clarifying it because many people ask the same questions.


    Think a bunch of legislators said "hey - let's change the name from Concealed Carry Weapons permit to Licenst To carry Firearms for no specific reason? There was a specific reason for the change. Why is irrelevant to this matter.
    but you don't need a license to carry, do you?

    When you figure out why any government does what they do, you win.



    Yes. That is what I am saying. Let's say I am over at your house, JK, watching TV. You run out to the local 7-11 or whatever, and the cops come. They knock on the door and I answer the door, and they want to come inside and look around. Am I the authorized individual to grant or deny them permission? That's what I'm saying - the the individuals prohibiting me from exercising my rights were not the authorized individuals to make that demand.
    yes, they were. You were in their facilty, you know, the one they rent?

    and btw: a person that answers my door is accepted to have the right to admit or deny somebody at the door. You really need to make your examples support your argument.

    - - - Updated - - -

    since you seem to have "cooled your jets" a bit, let me toss this in here;

    given the current problem with people "going postal" I suspect they perceived your question as a veiled threat. Maybe it was the tone of your voice or, if you were anything like you have shown here, your stubborn insistence of correctness which is almost assuredly going to be accompanied with a more powerful inflection, simply adding to their perception of your intent.

  4. #24
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    Nov 2013
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    Pennsylvania
    Posts
    806

    Default Re: Was I Profiled I Was Made Uncomfortable and Want Money

    Quote Quoting jk
    View Post
    since you seem to have "cooled your jets" a bit, let me toss this in here;

    given the current problem with people "going postal" I suspect they perceived your question as a veiled threat. Maybe it was the tone of your voice or, if you were anything like you have shown here, your stubborn insistence of correctness which is almost assuredly going to be accompanied with a more powerful inflection, simply adding to their perception of your intent.
    I will acknowledge that that is a possibility - but I won't try to explain how I was perceived by others. What I can say is that my initial phone call to CareerLink was professional and respectable. I would also submit that a reasonable person would not call to announce that they would be bringing a gun to perpetrate a mass shooting, etc. As I said initially, I had two options: 1) call and find out for sure what the procedures and accommodations were, or 2) take my gun and find out when I got there. The reasonable side of my brain decided it made sense to make a phone call and find out so that I would not be in a situation where I would have to leave my firearm in my car in a high crime area. I try to avoid having to secure my weapon in my car, since, well, cars aren't all that secure.

  5. #25
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    38,734

    Default Re: Was I Profiled I Was Made Uncomfortable and Want Money

    When you called to ask about something you should have already known the legal truth to the matter, it did nothing more than cause them to hear:

    there is a guy with a gun and he said something about bringing it here.


    If it is legal, as you basically bragged about, you carry or not as you wish. It is when you make a point of: I HAVE A GUN, regardless of your intent, it is not going to be accepted well by most others.
    So, the onus is on your to research the laws and abide by them. That way, if you enter a place you are lawfully allowed to carry and are rebuffed, you know there is no basis for an arrest although a private entity does have a right to refuse you entry or demand you leave at their discretion. You should know enough to make no more than a calm question of a possible misunderstanding of the law on your part or if they simply do not want you to carry on their property and if they still want you to leave, leave.


    never ever raise your voice or become so insistent as to appear threatening. You simply leave and put the weapon in your car or take it home and come back another time.

    anything else will put you in jeopardy of arrest, especially due to the weapon.

  6. #26
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Posts
    15,661

    Default Re: Was I Profiled I Was Made Uncomfortable and Want Money

    Quote Quoting PADriver13
    View Post
    I will acknowledge that that is a possibility - but I won't try to explain how I was perceived by others. What I can say is that my initial phone call to CareerLink was professional and respectable. I would also submit that a reasonable person would not call to announce that they would be bringing a gun to perpetrate a mass shooting, etc. As I said initially, I had two options: 1) call and find out for sure what the procedures and accommodations were, or 2) take my gun and find out when I got there. The reasonable side of my brain decided it made sense to make a phone call and find out so that I would not be in a situation where I would have to leave my firearm in my car in a high crime area. I try to avoid having to secure my weapon in my car, since, well, cars aren't all that secure.
    The reasonable side of your brain should have told you that this was one time that you should have left the gun at home...without saying a word to anyone.

    Seriously, no matter how someone feels about guns and gun control, it was sheer stupidity to not realize that taking your gun somewhere where people have a reason to be scared of someone "going postal" is just stupid. Even your attorney said so.

  7. #27
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    Nov 2013
    Location
    Pennsylvania
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    806

    Default Re: Was I Profiled I Was Made Uncomfortable and Want Money

    Quote Quoting llworking
    View Post
    The reasonable side of your brain should have told you that this was one time that you should have left the gun at home...without saying a word to anyone.
    Excuse me - but the survivalist side of my brain said "you're an idiot for not carrying in this City, at this location". It's a high crime area - 3rd highest city in murders in the State. What is perceived as more threatening? A guy calling and asking if there is a lockbox available for his gun...or a gun actually walking into the place with a gun and asking the same question? Or how about if I had carried it in, concealed, no questions, etc. and while sitting in the hearing room, the referee glances over and asks "what's that under your jacket"? I wouldn't want to be in that situation.

    But to say "this is one time to not have taken your gun" is just being ignorant of the surroundings. There'd be no other time I'd be in the City without my weapon, so why would this be any different? The responsible thing to do was to call and inquire before finding one's self in a situation like I just described.

  8. #28
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    OH10
    Posts
    17,019

    Default Re: Was I Profiled I Was Made Uncomfortable and Want Money

    I suggest you move to a safer city.

  9. #29
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Location
    Pennsylvania
    Posts
    806

    Default Re: Was I Profiled I Was Made Uncomfortable and Want Money

    Quote Quoting Disagreeable
    View Post
    I suggest you move to a safer city.
    The way you people on these forums assume things is just silly. Did I ever SAY I lived in this city? This is where the hearing was located. I live 25 minutes away. And when something requires me to travel in or to this city, I travel armed.

  10. #30
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Michigan
    Posts
    28,906

    Default Re: Was I Profiled I Was Made Uncomfortable and Want Money

    This thread has more than run its course.

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