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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
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    5

    Default Police Found Marijuana During a Pat Down Search

    My question involves criminal law for the state of: Arkansas

    I got snitched on by a stranger saying that I pulled out a knife and threatened him while I was walking past him, which I really didn't. The police then came and said that I was DETAINED. While I was detained (not arrested) the police conducted a pat down search on me and found marijuana in my pockets. Since I had already explained to the officer that it was a misunderstanding in that I was only going in my pockets to reach for my phone (the knife happened to be in the same pocket) and it was decided that I did not pull the knife on the stranger, the police then ARRESTED me for possession of marijuana. I would like to know: did the police have the legal right to do a pat down search on someone they are only detaining or do they only have the right to ask for identification of the person being detained??

    Thanks

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
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    OH10
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    17,019

    Default Re: Misdemeanor Possession of Marijuana

    They did nothing wrong. You on the other hand are screwed.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
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    19,901

    Default Re: Misdemeanor Possession of Marijuana

    As D. says, they did nothing wrong. They had way more than reasonable suspicion that there was a crime here. That's all they needed to have to stop you. They're free to do a quick frisk to look for weapons (which you apparently did have and you did display to the complainant).
    The drugs found during that frisk is certainly admissible. I'd definitely recommend a lawyer.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
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    Default Re: Misdemeanor Possession of Marijuana

    Police may detain a person on reasonable suspicion that the person is/has been engaged in criminal activity (commonly referred to as a “Terry” stop). The stranger pointing you out and claiming that you brandished a weapon provided the cops with reasonable suspicion for the stop. When conducting a Terry stop, cops are allowed to conduct an exterior “pat-down” search of the clothing for weapons, provided they can articulate a reasonable belief that the person detained may be armed or a threat to their safety. Again, the claim from the stranger that you were armed with a knife provides them with reasonable suspicion that you may be armed. If, during the pat-down, the cops feel anything that reasonably could be a weapon, they are allowed to retrieve the object (even if that means going into pockets, waistbands, etc.) to determine it’s nature. Since you admit that you were, in fact, armed with a knife, I assume that the cops went into your pocket (or where ever) and retrieved it. Up to that point, the cops were well within their authority.

    Now, the question in your scenario is how the cops found the weed. It is pretty hard to articulate a reasonable suspicion that a baggie of weed could be a weapon when felt in a pocket during an exterior “pat-down.” So, if not a weapon, the cop would have to be able to articulate that he/she knew exactly what it was, knew that it was contraband, upon immediate touch. That means he/she could not further manipulate it with their fingers, remove it, etc…he/she had to be able to say they felt the outside of the pocket and immediately recognized what was inside as a baggie of weed (or whatever the container was). That is a pretty hard sell to be believed (in my opinion, it borders on the impossible). So, if the cop felt the weed, went “Oh, what’s this?,” then pulled the baggie out, the weed may well be ruled inadmissible due to improper search.

    However, if as I suspect, the weed was in the same pocket with the knife (or any other object that could reasonably be a weapon), it would be pretty hard to retrieve that potential weapon without also discovering the weed. If that is what happened, the cops gotcha dead to rights.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
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    Default Re: Misdemeanor Possession of Marijuana

    Quote Quoting PTPD22
    View Post
    If, during the pat-down, the cops feel anything that reasonably could be a weapon, they are allowed to retrieve the object (even if that means going into pockets, waistbands, etc.) to determine it’s nature. Since you admit that you were, in fact, armed with a knife, I assume that the cops went into your pocket (or where ever) and retrieved it. Up to that point, the cops were well within their authority.
    The summary PTPD22 provided is important, as the law is more complex than "They legally detained you, so everything they find is fair game." A pat down to find weapons does not generalize into the right to remove and examine items within a person's clothing that the officer does not reasonably believe to be a weapon.
    Quote Quoting PTPD22
    That means he/she could not further manipulate it with their fingers, remove it, etc…he/she had to be able to say they felt the outside of the pocket and immediately recognized what was inside as a baggie of weed (or whatever the container was). That is a pretty hard sell to be believed (in my opinion, it borders on the impossible). So, if the cop felt the weed, went “Oh, what’s this?,” then pulled the baggie out, the weed may well be ruled inadmissible due to improper search.
    Agreed, although if the officer said, "Oh, what's this? Is it pot?" and the subject of a Terry stop says, "Yes", the calculation changes. Sometimes that's the way the office remembers things, even when the subject of the search is adamant that the officer simply pulled the item out of the pocket.
    Quote Quoting PTPD22
    However, if as I suspect, the weed was in the same pocket with the knife (or any other object that could reasonably be a weapon), it would be pretty hard to retrieve that potential weapon without also discovering the weed. If that is what happened, the cops gotcha dead to rights.
    And that's another very real possibility. Also, I've seen cases in which the subject had placed the marijuana inside of a hard container that could be reasonably articulated as potentially containing a weapon.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
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    5

    Default Re: Misdemeanor Possession of Marijuana

    The marijuana was found in another pocket of (cargo pants) and it was inside a medicine box (not saying that the marijuana is illegal anyways in Arkansas). After I explained the misinterpretation by the stranger to the cops, they determined that there was no threat used by the knife. The cops then went through all of the pockets of my clothing after retrieving the knife. They did not ask for consent NOR did I say "I do not consent to search" (we did not discuss consent throughout the entire encounter). I would like to know if I would be likely to win the case based on such circumstances. I have plead not guilty but should I go through a bench trial or jury trial. The only way I can think of winning the case is if the evidence (the weed) is inadmissible/suppressed.

    Thanks

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    38,867

    Default Re: Misdemeanor Possession of Marijuana

    After I explained the misinterpretation by the stranger to the cops, they determined that there was no threat used by the knife. The cops then went through all of the pockets of my clothing after retrieving the knife.
    so they didn't believe you but went; uh huh, simply to placate you while they continued their investigation.

    They did not ask for consent NOR did I say "I do not consent to search" (we did not discuss consent throughout the entire encounter).
    they didn't have to, either one.



    I would like to know if I would be likely to win the case based on such circumstances. I have plead not guilty but should I go through a bench trial or jury trial. The only way I can think of winning the case is if the evidence (the weed) is inadmissible/suppressed.
    it will be based completely on the admissibility of the weed and that is going to be based on the cops description of the situation. You and your lawyer can review the facts and evidence and make a call on the issue.

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