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  1. #1
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    Default Re: No Security Deposit, Dispute on Damage Amount, Landlord Threatening Collections

    Quote Quoting jk
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    of others is quite clear. You cannot be others. There is no ambiguity there.
    So now you're agreeing with the interpretation of the eavesdropping statute? If you record your own conversation, it's not the conversation of others?
    Quote Quoting jk
    Wile the case cited does state that, I do not agree that is what the statute is saying.
    And the original trial court agreed with you. However, your attempt to reconstruct the statute seems less compelling to me than position taken by the Court of Appeals - yours requires ignoring the stated purpose of the statute and eliding from the interpretation the references to security deposits that support the position ultimately adopted by the Court of Appeals. It is reasonable in context to interpret "All claimed damages" as "all damages claimed against the security deposit", even before considering the precedent relied upon by the court in relation to the statutory modification of periods of limitation. There are plenty of reasons to believe that the legislature would treat differently a circumstance where the landlord was holding onto somebody else's money, versus where the landlord was not. I would be more sympathetic to your argument if the landlord in the case we're discussing held a security deposit.

    Your comment on MCL 554.613 reflects more bad drafting, and it becomes necessary to read into the language an effective stay of the 45 day rule once litigation has been commenced. An argument can be made (and has been by the Michigan Supreme Court) that it's not the court's job to fix legislative mistakes of this type, although I'm not sure how diligently they adhere to that principle, and I haven't tried to determine if that particular tension has actually been litigated.

  2. #2
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    Default Re: No Security Deposit, Dispute on Damage Amount, Landlord Threatening Collections

    Mr. Knowitall;740566]So now you're agreeing with the interpretation of the eavesdropping statute? If you record your own conversation, it's not the conversation of others?
    you can record your conversation all you want. You cannot record the conversation of others without permission and that person you are having a conversation with is "another". If you can figure out how to record only your part of the conversation, then by all means, go for it. I'm just having a hard time figuring out how to actually do that though.

    I would be more sympathetic to your argument if the landlord in the case we're discussing held a security deposit.
    well, of course since that is the basis of your position.

    I just read the statute as applying to damages regardless of whether it is countered by a deposit or not. Obviously, unless I end up in court for such a matter, my perspective is truly irrelevant and I must accept the current standing of the law, regardless of whether I agree with it or not.


    I do appreciate the corrections though and especially your explanations and listening to my attempts to defend my position.

    Your comment on MCL 554.613 reflects more bad drafting, and it becomes necessary to read into the language an effective stay of the 45 day rule once litigation has been commenced. An argument can be made (and has been by the Michigan Supreme Court) that it's not the court's job to fix legislative mistakes of this type, although I'm not sure how diligently they adhere to that principle, and I haven't tried to determine if that particular tension has actually been litigated.
    has anybody thought about trashing the entire MCL and starting over? I understand a courts position in clarification but dang, many of these are so muddy to start with, a court, in my opinion should start sending bills to the guys that drafted some of that stuff due to the time required to fix their messes.

  3. #3
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    Default Re: No Security Deposit, Dispute on Damage Amount, Landlord Threatening Collections

    Quote Quoting jk
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    you can record your conversation all you want. You cannot record the conversation of others without permission and that person you are having a conversation with is "another". If you can figure out how to record only your part of the conversation, then by all means, go for it. I'm just having a hard time figuring out how to actually do that though.
    I can see why the Court of Appeals chose not to torture the language of the statute in that manner. Given a poorly drafted statute, although they arguably picked 'bad', it's better than picking 'worse'.
    Quote Quoting jk
    has anybody thought about trashing the entire MCL and starting over?
    I believe that would involve, oh... what is it called.... something that legislatures find to unduly interfere with meeting with lobbyists, fund raising, and the like....

    Oh yes...

    It would involve work.

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