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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
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    Los Angeles, CA
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    4

    Default Turn Prohibited by Posted Sign During Certain Hours

    My question involves a traffic ticket from the state of: California

    I've been cited under code 22107(d) vc at the corner of Berkeley and Glendale boulevard in Echo Park. A map of the intersection is below. Left turns are apparently prohibited after 4 PM from Berkeley onto Glendale boulevard.

    The note on the ticket appears to say (his handwriting is horrendous) "22107(c)vc OBsrvd dB Neg LT against (3) posed vigns" [sic]. Speed approach 15 max speed 35. All other information seems accurate and complete (if I ignore the ambiguities caused by his handwriting)



    As I approached the intersection at a safe rate of speed, the light turned green, and I signaled my left turn and followed the car in front of me who was turning left as well. An officer was watching and pulled over the car in front of me and signaled that I should follow.

    My car's clock read 3:59. It may run slow, because the officer wrote 4:06 on my ticket. He was talking to the car in front of me for at least 2-3 minutes before he approached my vehicle. I noticed that he did not appear to note the license plate number of the car in front of me, nor did he appear to ask them to sign the ticket, so I suspect that he may have let them off. I was cited, and he seemed to spend significantly less time making conversation with me, and more time taking notes on the make/model/license plate of my car. The officer asked whether I saw the three posted signs but made no mention of the time limit. I told him that I was unfamiliar with the area and the signs (I was visiting a home-bound client for the first time who lives further up Berkeley, and was just trying to make my way home).

    This was my first time through the intersection, and I didn't see a sign noting the prohibited times until I was half-way through the intersection in the middle of my turn. My car's clock, and the actions of the car in front of me led me to believe it was safe to make the turn to begin with. The officer said there were three signs, but I only noticed one. The car in front of me was honked at by another vehicle from opposing traffic during the turn, so I was occupied with assessing that situation and reacting appropriately to give them room. Also, the intersection itself is confusing (see map above); it was my first time through and I was occupied with assessing the angles involved, and how I needed to maneuver it to make it onto Glendale.

    Do I have an argument here?

    Also, I've never been cited for a moving violation before, in 20+ years of driving - the ticket says I must appear "on or before 8/26/13" - will they send me a more specific day/time for this? If I don't have an argument, can I just attend traffic school? How does that work?

    Thank you in advance.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
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    OH10
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    17,019

    Default Re: Turn Prohibited by Posted Sign During Certain Hours

    Sure you can make an argument. It will not be accepted as valid most likely. Arguing you were an inattentive driver is not the best idea. Request traffic school and go on with your life.

  3. #3
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    Sep 2010
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    19,901

    Default Re: Turn Prohibited by Posted Sign During Certain Hours

    I'm not sure why you think anything about the preceding car has any validity. He's free to cite or not to cite people. It has no bearing on your guilt. You seem to be unsure as to the accuracy of your car, so his testimony that you turned after it became 4PM will dominate in court (even if you said you were sure and your car was synce to the atomic clock at the National Bureau of Standards, you'd lose).

    Arguing that you weren't even aware that there was a restriction isn't going to help you either.

    Most CA jurisidictions will send the offer for traffic school with a courtesy notice, though you must not rely on the courtesy notice to let you know when you should appear. If you want to pay the ticket, do so before the date. If you want to request a TBWD, do so before the date. If you want to contest in trial, do so before the date (though you should contact the court to avoid wasting too much time there if the date changes).

    Traffic school ends up costing more money, but it avoids accumulating points for the violation.

  4. #4
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    Mar 2009
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    LA LA Land
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  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Location
    Los Angeles, CA
    Posts
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    Default Re: Turn Prohibited by Posted Sign During Certain Hours

    I appreciate the reply, thank you. I guess I'm annoyed that the officer did not seem to be consistent in issuing the citations, but I recognize that it's a non-issue here.

    Could I argue that I acted in good faith, thinking I was within the law? As I approached the intersection, the light turned green (I got lucky), so I did not have to stop at all for cross traffic. I did not see the sign on the far right, my focus was on the traffic and turn to my left. I did not see the sign in the far distance on the opposite side of the intersection, since I was not stopped for any amount of time to take in my surroundings. I did see the sign on the median, at which point I was already engaged in the turn. I had to make a split second decision based on my clock, the fact that the car preceding me seemed to think it was ok, and the fact that swerving back to my right might disrupt other cars negotiating the intersection. Clearly I made the wrong decision, and it's one that I'll be more cognizant of moving forward. However, I felt it was a fair decision given the circumstances.

    Also, I've heard that if I go to court and the officer does not appear, the ticket will be dismissed. Is there any truth to that? Does it happen often?

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
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    Default Re: Turn Prohibited by Posted Sign During Certain Hours

    There's no mens rea required for traffic offenses. You do not get points for lack of intent.
    The officer is not required to be at the arraignment. At the trial, if a continuance has not been previously granted and he's a no show, you may get a dismissal. However the trial is scheduled for the officer's convenience so it's unlikely he will not just randomly not show. Furhter, by the time you get around to realizing the officer isn't there, traffic school may no longer be on the table.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Location
    Los Angeles, CA
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    4

    Default Re: Turn Prohibited by Posted Sign During Certain Hours

    Thank you for your response too, I appreciate the help.

    Do the LA Metro court judges tend to show any leniency on these sorts of things, or are they generally strict? I haven't received any notice of the bail amount, but I understand it's high. If I were to show up and admit guilt but explain that I was trying my best to comply with the law, would they be willing to reduce it and possibly also offer traffic school?

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
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    LA LA Land
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    9,170

    Default Re: Turn Prohibited by Posted Sign During Certain Hours

    Quote Quoting CountingBeans
    View Post
    Thank you for your response too, I appreciate the help.

    Do the LA Metro court judges tend to show any leniency on these sorts of things, or are they generally strict? I haven't received any notice of the bail amount, but I understand it's high. If I were to show up and admit guilt but explain that I was trying my best to comply with the law, would they be willing to reduce it and possibly also offer traffic school?
    Leniency at a trial, not likely to occur. You can only be found guilty or not guilty. And the facts as well as the officer testifying in support of his reasoning to issue a citation, you'll likely be found guilty.

    If instead you mean leniency at the arraignment, you can almost be sure you'll see some fine reduction if you were to opt to plead guilty or no contest. Metro happens to be the busiest courthouse in the county, possibly the state, and any incentive offered to you to plead out and get your name crossed off calendar is incentive for that judge as one less trial to have to handle. The fine amount for a 22101(d) should be approximately $238. Once the citation is filed in court -typically within 3-4 weeks after it was issued- a courtesy notice is automatically generated and mailed to you notifying you of your options, the fine amount, the appearance date, a telephone number for automated information 213-742-1884, and a website where you can search for the citation in the court's record, and choose the same options outlines in the notice.

    As for traffic school, you certainly will be automatically eligible for it as long as you can afford the $60 additional fee. You would want to request it at the time you see the judge but at that point and under the circumstances, its a matter of choice; your choice.

    Good luck!

    Edited to add: please double check the code section number you were cited for. It should be 22101(d) as there is no 22107(d)... Let us know what you find.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Location
    Los Angeles, CA
    Posts
    4

    Default Re: Turn Prohibited by Posted Sign During Certain Hours

    Edited to add: please double check the code section number you were cited for. It should be 22101(d) as there is no 22107(d)... Let us know what you find.
    You're correct, it appears to be 22101(d). Again, his handwriting is atrocious, it could be interpreted as a 1 or a 7.

    Sounds like a plea of no contest at arraignment is my best bet, and I'll hope for a fine reduction + traffic school to keep my insurance premiums down. Thanks again!

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