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  1. #11
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
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    38,867

    Default Re: Rented Defective Boom Lift, Got a Chargback, but Company is Sending to Collection

    I dont believe he cant take any action.
    You misunderstood what I said. I said YOU cannot take any action. I did not address what your father may or may not be able to do. You did ask what YOU could do. I answered that.

    after being chastised for asking questions, questions that are quite relevant to your problem, I have no desire to provide any further assistance. Maybe somebody else is willing to risk your abrasive attitude and offer help. As for me, I'm quite finished.

  2. #12
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
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    Behind a Desk
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    98,846

    Default Re: Rented Defective Boom Lift, Got a Chargback, but Company is Sending to Collection

    Your father is free to argue his case to the rental company, or make his case in court if and when they sue him.

    The charge isn't "made up" - it's based on a contract.

  3. #13
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Posts
    9

    Default Re: Rented Defective Boom Lift, Got a Chargback, but Company is Sending to Collection

    Quote Quoting jk
    View Post
    You misunderstood what I said. I said YOU cannot take any action. I did not address what your father may or may not be able to do. You did ask what YOU could do. I answered that.

    after being chastised for asking questions, questions that are quite relevant to your problem, I have no desire to provide any further assistance. Maybe somebody else is willing to risk your abrasive attitude and offer help. As for me, I'm quite finished.
    In the original post i said "What can HE do? Does he have to wait till its in collections?"

    YOU have a reading comprehension problem.

    Its quite obvious im asking for advice on his behalf this whole time so whats the point of your non sequitur? Why couldn't you have given usefull advice for him?

  4. #14
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Posts
    179

    Default Re: Rented Defective Boom Lift, Got a Chargback, but Company is Sending to Collection

    Hmm.. They are trying to help you... They are not grilling you. Don't be so defensive.

    http://smallbusiness.chron.com/bill-...ncy-56231.html

    Looks that after it goes to collection you do have the right to dispute.

    Also google the topic. You'll get more info.

    But you do owe 1/10th at least. The machine worked 3 out of 30 days. I don't see how a court would rule otherwise. It's always best to try to work it out with the vendor. I'd call them and offer to pay them 10% for the 3 days that it did work. It is in your interest to work it out with them too. If you end up taking a wrong turn during the collection it can bite you...

    Also check your rental agreement. Look if it talks about mediation and what not. Honestly not sure if most do or don't but something to look for....

  5. #15
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Posts
    9

    Default Re: Rented Defective Boom Lift, Got a Chargback, but Company is Sending to Collection

    Quote Quoting Mr. Knowitall
    View Post
    Your father is free to argue his case to the rental company, or make his case in court if and when they sue him.

    The charge isn't "made up" - it's based on a contract.
    What if they send it to collections instead of court, how does he fight that and win? He already won with the credit card company and that didnt stop anything. What court would they send it too? The bills have been coming from texas. He doesnt have alot of money for lawyers or anthing. Arguing with the rental company is like hitting your head on a brick wall. This was his first time using this specific company. They were cheaper, now i see why.

    It might not be entirely made up but they broke the contract not him.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Quoting mihamih
    View Post
    Hmm.. They are trying to help you... They are not grilling you. Don't be so defensive.

    http://smallbusiness.chron.com/bill-...ncy-56231.html

    Looks that after it goes to collection you do have the right to dispute.

    Also google the topic. You'll get more info.

    But you do owe 1/10th at least. The machine worked 3 out of 30 days. I don't see how a court would rule otherwise. It's always best to try to work it out with the vendor. I'd call them and offer to pay them 10% for the 3 days that it did work. It is in your interest to work it out with them too. If you end up taking a wrong turn during the collection it can bite you...

    Also check your rental agreement. Look if it talks about mediation and what not. Honestly not sure if most do or don't but something to look for....
    They never sent him money for that half tank of diesel.

    They never sent him for that 4+hrs on the phone.

    They certainly didn sent him money for all the production he lost.

    They want way more than 5% of the money. He doesnt think he owes them anything.

    Do they prorate the weekends too even thoough we dont work those?

    He had no desire to do 1/10 of the work in the first 3 days. Another thing is these companies do not prorate that way themselves on their pricing so if something breaks down on week 3 and you had to call another company for 1 week. The other company would have charged the 1 week price which is several times higher per day than the month price. You'd be screwed. Heck with the delivery charge the 1 day price is absolutely insane.

    If it had rained and he had not used it at all those first 3 days? Would he still owe them? What if there were no replacement booms available anywhere to rent at that time and he had to do it by ladder? Would he pay money for zero use? It usually wont rain for a full month though.

    Why should he prorate that way when they dont?

    If you throw away the larger amount of money lost in production speed it basically is a wash after they pay him for his diesel and time on the phone if you use less than 1/10.

  6. #16
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Posts
    179

    Default Re: Rented Defective Boom Lift, Got a Chargback, but Company is Sending to Collection

    I understand your arguments. But (please don't get defensive), they seem one sided to me and I don't think you are looking at this objectively. What seems fair to me is that he pays 1/10th.

    Look up how to deal with the collection if you disagree.

    Also check your contract and see if it says that they are not liable for any damages to you that exceed the amount that you paid them. If it does not say this (I get the feeling it would though), try this: Call up he rental place and give them all the arguments above and threaten to sue them for all that. Even attach some numbers to your "losses." Maybe you'll scare them enough so they don't turn you over to collections and they just write it off....

  7. #17
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    38,867

    Default Re: Rented Defective Boom Lift, Got a Chargback, but Company is Sending to Collection

    You need to step back. Your father has no right to claim lost production. He was required to mitigate his damages and he did not do that...which brings up the question: how did he finish the job?


    He owes, at least, the 10% because :

    . After a couple of days and small number of hours use he filled it it up. Unfortunately the machine was designed for gasoline and propane so it didnt work after that
    so, he was obviously able to use it those three days because he did use it for those 3 days. How much he used it is irrelevant unless he was being charged an hourly use fee.




    They never sent him money for that half tank of diesel.
    so? did they take the diesel with them after they drained it from the tank? If so, why did your father allow them to take HIS diesel fuel with them?


    They want way more than 5% of the money. He doesnt think he owes them anything.
    well, from what you have posted, dad is wrong.



    Since you refused to answer the rest of my questions, I can offer nothing more.



    and if you come back and act like a jerk again, what I gave you here is all you will get from me.

  8. #18
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Posts
    9

    Default Re: Rented Defective Boom Lift, Got a Chargback, but Company is Sending to Collection

    J/k they drained his diesel because it was mixed halfway with gasoline that was in that tank and was therefore useless.

    At the time i thought he should have left theyre boom there and have gottten a boom from another company and did the work quickly like he planned but he was nervous and didn't want to get charged for two booms. He would have gotten another job done last year.

    He did a lot of ladder work.

    When my dad talked to the guy he said that his boss wanted him to collect a majority of the $2000. Thats absurd.

    3 days prorated from the monthly rate is $200. Its common for us to only use the boom a little in the begining because of still preping and setting up the job, getting used to the boom if its a different style etc. We believe we got 1.5 days use but we are flexible to make this go away.

    My dad is owed $40 for the diesel and should get $100 for all the times he called on the phone only to get hung up on. It should have been 1 phone call instead of 12. We could have kept calling but he gave up.

    Theres no way hes pay $1600 or anything.

    We do have pictures and a credit card decision on our side.

    I think we should probably send another email or letter.

    I nervous of disputing with the credit agencies when it goes to collections because i've hear horror stories of them ignoring the consumers evidence.

    - - - Updated - - -

    My dad was also nervous that if he did go and order a boom from a second company that the first might stop ignoring his calls and randomly send him a working boom any day and then' hell have two.

    - - - Updated - - -

    If he had mitigated his damages by calling another company for a boom they would have charged him for a full month too and not only 27 days. If he had go another boom i suppose he wouldnt have had to pay for even 3 days use.

  9. #19
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    38,867

    Default Re: Rented Defective Boom Lift, Got a Chargback, but Company is Sending to Collection

    mikeeee;704085]J/k they drained his diesel because it was mixed halfway with gasoline that was in that tank and was therefore useless.
    There is a basis for seeking compensation for it but given their reactions to the situation, I suspect the only way to attempt to get the money would be if it went to court. It would be based on the presence of the diesel sticker and your father relying on that. Due to their error, he was damaged the amount of the cost of he diesel fuel.

    At the time i thought he should have left theyre boom there and have gottten a boom from another company and did the work quickly like he planned but he was nervous and didn't want to get charged for two booms. He would have gotten another job done last year.
    hindsight is great but that is exactly what he should have done once it was apparent the issue with their boom was not going to be resolved. Due to him not doing that, he really has no claim for lost productivity because he did not mitigate his damages (make an effort to minimize them as much as possible. Even without that he most likely would not have a claim for lost productivity. The contract may even address the issue and waive any liability on the part of the rental agency.




    3 days prorated from the monthly rate is $200. Its common for us to only use the boom a little in the begining because of still preping and setting up the job, getting used to the boom if its a different style etc. We believe we got 1.5 days use but we are flexible to make this go away.
    I work a job where boomlifts are common. I understand how they can be useless one day and priceless the next. The fact remains, he did have those 3 (I believe you said) days use.

    My dad is owed $40 for the diesel and should get $100 for all the times he called on the phone only to get hung up on. It should have been 1 phone call instead of 12. We could have kept calling but he gave up.
    I can agree with the diesel costs but the time on the phone is simply the cost of doing business.



    We do have pictures and a credit card decision on our side.
    the credit card situation neither helps or hurts you. The credit card company makes decisions based on their rules. Those rules are not based on the law.

    I think we should probably send another email or letter.
    send it certified. It makes it look a bit more serious.


    I nervous of disputing with the credit agencies when it goes to collections because i've hear horror stories of them ignoring the consumers evidence.
    the problem with this is you would lose a dispute with the credit reporting agencies. Their statement will be that the contract your father signed required him to pay $XXXX and he didn't. The CRAs (Credit reporting agencies) are not going to determine if there was a breach of contract or not. They will accept it that unless/until a court determines otherwise, the contract is valid.

    so, the questions I asked previously are important to your argument with the rental company. It will help determine if they have any true claim for payment or if your father has a valid right to refuse payment.

    One of the most important questions is (and I may not have asked it previously); when was the last time your father used the lift (in regards to the beginning date of the contract)

    If he used it throughout the contract period, the company is going to argue that while it may not have been 100% functional, it was obviously working well enough such that your father continued to use it.


    and if this company is part of a bigger company, look for a contact for somebody in a district, regional, or some level above the local yokels. You may be able to get them to put some pressure on the local guys from that end, if they agree with you.

  10. #20
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Posts
    9

    Default Re: Rented Defective Boom Lift, Got a Chargback, but Company is Sending to Collection

    Funny thing is i got a letter there is a class action against them for overcharging on various fees.

    I'm going to have to find the contract. If there is a mediator clause can we start that? Maybe we should write a letter to an executive.


    He did use it to get a few area that could not be reached with his 40ft ladder. But on the propane workaround it took 20 minuts to drive around the driveway of a big house. It was ultra slow motion. You could walk laps around it. A light kept blinking too and it sounded quite bad. Thats not counting the long time waiting for the ice to disipate on the tank so he could get it up in the air. Once time he got stuck on the machine for a long while and climbed down over a roof. The ladder work was slow and dangerous as usual.

    He is so frustrated that he didnt get anything close to what he ordered, and now hes being harassed. Hanging up on a customer who calls 12 times over 3 days without a single answer other than someone will call you back click. 3 times they did call back only to transfer him to someone who would hang up also. I wish he could charge for that. He had no clue what was even going on.

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