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  1. #1

    Question Check Fraud Charges Over a Forged Check

    My question involves criminal law for the state of: Oklahoma & Colorado & maybe Texas

    My brother naively (and without asking advice from anyone first) loaned $700 to a friend. This friend supposedly has lost her ID and can't pay her rent with a check (why??), and without an ID she can't withdraw money from her bank account (and her bank is not local to boot, it's in Texas). The friend wrote my brother a check for the $700, he cashed it and gave her the money. Stupid, right?

    So, a few days pass and she fails to pay him back as promised. Then the check is returned to my brother as "Refer to Maker".
    She claims she is transferring her money to a new local bank. She writes/obtains a check for $800 (with her ex-husband's name on it) and deposits it into her new account. She sends my brother a photo (via Facebook) of a Notice of Hold (or something like that) from her new bank account to show him that that $800 will be available on March 25th. The notice says the $800 check is on an 11 day hold due to the account being less than 30 days old.

    So my brother calls the bank in Texas (where the check my brother has is from), they can not find any account with her name on it. They do find a closed account for her (with her first ex husband's last name) and her current boyfriend. The check has her current name (which is her 2nd ex husband's last name), her exhusband, and her current live-in boyfriend on it, as well as her current home address in Oklahoma. But the bank has no record of this account existing......Does that mean this check is fake? I'm assuming so.....

    So then my brother calls the bank in Oklahoma (the new account). They says there is not enough money in the account to cover a check for $800.....obviously.

    Now my brother is ready to contact the DA. I started googling her names (since there are 3 different last names with her) and sure enough she is wanted in Colorado for Failure to Comply (Theft).

    What action should my brother take next? Contact the local DA about this check fraud? Or contact the DA in CO? Any other advice......Thanks in advance.

    At least my brother isn't so naive anymore.......He says he won't ever loan money to friends again. I hope he's right.

  2. #2
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    Default Re: Check Fraud and Wanted in Colorado

    It would appear there may have a case, BUT, do not be surprised if the police see it as a civil matter because it was a "loan". I know that seems a little far-fetched, but I've seen it happen a time or two before.

    However, her writing a check knowing that the account(s) was closed is definitely fraud and quite possibly a felony.

    Your brother needs to go to his local police station and file a report. The case starts with the jusidiction of the victim. Also, she may quite possibly be in trouble with the bank being that she dropped a check on them.

    It's probably best to go to the station to do this rather than call a street cop to come visit you. If your brother does it during the daytime on a weekday he may get hooked up with a detective right then and there.

  3. #3
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    Default Re: Check Fraud and Wanted in Colorado

    I agree with Dave. It is time to put this girl to rest.

  4. #4

    Default

    Thanks for your advice.

    I just wanted to quickly point out that the check written to my brother is apparently a counterfeit check....would that not make this a criminal offense?
    The closed account is not related to the check as the check is not legitimate.

  5. #5
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    Default Re: Check Fraud and Wanted in Colorado

    Quote Quoting amberdawn723
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    Thanks for your advice.

    I just wanted to quickly point out that the check written to my brother is apparently a counterfeit check....would that not make this a criminal offense?
    The closed account is not related to the check as the check is not legitimate.
    Hence the reason he should contact police, file a report and pursue charges.

  6. #6
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    Default Re: Check Fraud Charges Over a Forged Check

    A counterfeit check is definitely a criminal offense! Does your brother have possession of the check, or does the bank have it? If the bank has it then he needs to see if they'll give him a copy to take with him when he does the police report.

    No worries if they won't, the detectives will get it eventually during their investigation.

  7. #7

    Default Re: Check Fraud Charges Over a Forged Check

    He just has the bank-provided copy since it was returned.

    What are the chances of him getting his money back at some point? Irregardless, he is going to report this; we're just curious about how/when/if someone gets their money back in a situation like this.

  8. #8
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    Default Re: Check Fraud Charges Over a Forged Check

    Quote Quoting amberdawn723
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    The friend wrote my brother a check for the $700, he cashed it and gave her the money. Stupid, right?

    So, a few days pass and she fails to pay him back as promised. Then the check is returned to my brother as "Refer to Maker".
    Quote Quoting souperdave
    View Post
    It would appear there may have a case, BUT, do not be surprised if the police see it as a civil matter because it was a "loan". I know that seems a little far-fetched, but I've seen it happen a time or two before.
    I agree with souperdave, that if you accept a check as security against a loan, and when you later deposit the check and it turns out to be NSF, the police are likely going to view it as a civil matter. But the original story is confusing - it suggests that a check for $700 was cashed by the broker, and that the cash was given to the friend who wrote the check, but that the friend still had to repay the brother. If he was simply cashing the check for her, there would be no expectation of repayment at that point in the story. He would ask her to repay the money after the check was dishonored, but there would be no repayment due before he knew the check was bad.
    Quote Quoting amberdawn723
    So my brother calls the bank in Texas (where the check my brother has is from), they can not find any account with her name on it. They do find a closed account for her (with her first ex husband's last name) and her current boyfriend....
    It's difficult to believe that the bank was this forthcoming with a complete stranger over the phone.

    The way you verify whether an account exists (or existed) is by the account number written on the check.

    A normal check from a normal checking account is professionally printed, has account numbers printed in magnetic ink, and has light grey printing on the back that is designed to foil scanners and photocopiers. Some checks have more advanced security features. It is difficult for me to picture how this person could forge a convincing check, on paper of appropriate weight, such that it would fool your brother, let alone the bank to which he initially made the deposit. Further, if the check were not associated with an account at all, it's difficult to believe that the check (and your brother) wouldn't have ended up being investigated by the bank(s) involved, as opposed to their returning the check to him.
    Quote Quoting amberdawn723
    What action should my brother take next? Contact the local DA about this check fraud? Or contact the DA in CO? Any other advice......Thanks in advance.
    As souperdave indicated, he would contact the police (not the prosecutor) in the jurisdiction where he received the check.
    Quote Quoting amberdawn723
    View Post
    I just wanted to quickly point out that the check written to my brother is apparently a counterfeit check....would that not make this a criminal offense?
    If the police investigate the check and determine that it is counterfeit, that can result in serious felony charges.
    Quote Quoting souperdave
    View Post
    A counterfeit check is definitely a criminal offense! Does your brother have possession of the check, or does the bank have it? If the bank has it then he needs to see if they'll give him a copy to take with him when he does the police report.
    As the check was returned, marked "Refer to Maker", the brother should have it. He would take the original to the police - and should make a copy for his own records beforehand.

    Many police departments have steps they require somebody to take in a NSF case, to try to collect the money without police involvement, before they will ask a prosecutor to authorize charges. There would be no similar prerequisite for forgery, assuming that occurred.

  9. #9

    Default Re: Check Fraud Charges Over a Forged Check

    Quote Quoting Mr. Knowitall
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    I agree with souperdave, that if you accept a check as security against a loan, and when you later deposit the check and it turns out to be NSF, the police are likely going to view it as a civil matter. But the original story is confusing - it suggests that a check for $700 was cashed by the broker, and that the cash was given to the friend who wrote the check, but that the friend still had to repay the brother. If he was simply cashing the check for her, there would be no expectation of repayment at that point in the story. He would ask her to repay the money after the check was dishonored, but there would be no repayment due before he knew the check was bad.
    I think I misspoke...yes, he wasn't expecting repayment until after the copy of the check was returned marked "Refer to Maker" and then he gave her a few days to pay him in cash, but she failed to pay.

    Quote Quoting Mr. Knowitall
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    It's difficult to believe that the bank was this forthcoming with a complete stranger over the phone.

    The way you verify whether an account exists (or existed) is by the account number written on the check.

    A normal check from a normal checking account is professionally printed, has account numbers printed in magnetic ink, and has light grey printing on the back that is designed to foil scanners and photocopiers. Some checks have more advanced security features. It is difficult for me to picture how this person could forge a convincing check, on paper of appropriate weight, such that it would fool your brother, let alone the bank to which he initially made the deposit. Further, if the check were not associated with an account at all, it's difficult to believe that the check (and your brother) wouldn't have ended up being investigated by the bank(s) involved, as opposed to their returning the check to him.
    I never saw the actual check so I have no idea what it looked like in real life. All he has now is a gray/white copy from the bank. It would seem hard to fool a bank upon deposit, but I worked as a teller for 3 years and never once thought I had received a fake check from a customer....though I may have as checks are sent on to the check proofing at some point. I don't know what the procedures are for check proofing and returned checks as far as investigations go. The bank the check is written through, simply stated that the account number on the check does not exist. The lady then proceeded to attempt to locate any accounts associated with the names printed on the check. Only one such account was found and she would only say it was closed. No further details were given. I assume it is a counterfeit/altered check because of the information the bank gave him during the phone call....but we don't really know for sure.

    Quote Quoting Mr. Knowitall
    View Post
    As souperdave indicated, he would contact the police (not the prosecutor) in the jurisdiction where he received the check.

    If the police investigate the check and determine that it is counterfeit, that can result in serious felony charges.

    As the check was returned, marked "Refer to Maker", the brother should have it. He would take the original to the police - and should make a copy for his own records beforehand.

    Many police departments have steps they require somebody to take in a NSF case, to try to collect the money without police involvement, before they will ask a prosecutor to authorize charges. There would be no similar prerequisite for forgery, assuming that occurred.
    As I stated just beforehand, he only has the bank copy of the check. He's reluctantly decided to wait until the 25th passes to see if she can pay him back......Unfortunately some people in this world suck, and some people like my brothers are suckers. I'm hoping she pays him back, but I have a feeling it's not going to happen.

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