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  1. #21
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    Default Re: Would Being Prosecuted for a Red Light Camera Ticket Be a Violation of Civil Righ

    There is always someone to put on the stand believe it or not.

    In every criminal case there is someone

    Who are u to determine that that is irrelevant

    And you can ask how long he/she has been a technician if they are not an officer

  2. #22
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    Default Re: Would Being Prosecuted for a Red Light Camera Ticket Be a Violation of Civil Righ

    matt4200;670691]There is always someone to put on the stand believe it or not.
    If there is (and I tend to disagree with that claim), that doesn't mean whomever is put on the stand as a witness has anything to do with the evidence you wish to contest.

    evidence does not necessarily have to be addressed by a witness. The court or jury can come to their own conclusions simply by viewing the evidence.



    Who are u to determine that that is irrelevant
    the answer is irrelevant to the case. It does not affect the ability of the witness to testify. Now, if you wan to ask the witness how good their vision is, that would be relevant.

    And you can ask how long he/she has been a technician if they are not an officer
    So, what if I testified that it was obvious to me that a car, identified as yours due to the license plate, had violated the law. Then what would you do? You are attempting to make it seem as if an expert witness is required. For that to be necessary, you will have to show why an expert witness is required. That means you have to show a reason special training or experience is required to be able to testify to the facts at hand. It does not require an expert witness to testify to what they see.

  3. #23
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    Default Re: Would Being Prosecuted for a Red Light Camera Ticket Be a Violation of Civil Righ

    It doesn't require an expert witness but I still have the right to question whoever signed the affadavit for the ticket. His or her background and training and everything then can be questioned because he or she signed the affadavit.

    And it was not a vehicle registered to me that I got the ticket for.

    It's not necessarily always about refuting the evidence though that is an important part it's also about questioning the character and veracity of those making these charges against you.

  4. #24
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    Default Re: Would Being Prosecuted for a Red Light Camera Ticket Be a Violation of Civil Righ

    Quote Quoting matt4200
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    Yes but you can subpoena the officer who slapped the cuffs on your alleged murderer.... And in this case the officer who signed the affidavit for the red light camera ticket
    Someone will be required in traffic court to present the images as there is no prosecutor in traffic cases. If there were not a live body, then the defendant could object to their presentation due to a lack of foundation.

    In this case I would ask the witness questions such as..... How many tickets from this camera were given on the day in question? Were all of them found guilty? When did you watch the tape?
    The officer would likely not know the answer to those questions, and certainly would not know the answer to the number of convictions. And a court would likely rule your questions out of order as irrelevant to YOUR ticket.

    Where the cameras calibrated properly? Are you a certified video technician? Have you undergone any specific training for giving red light camera tickets? If so how much training? How long have you been an officer? How many red light ticket citations have you signed and how many of them were found to be actually guilty and how many we're found not guilty?
    Only some of these MIGHT be valid ... but, what would the point of it be? If you want to challenge the validity of the cameras, you would have to raise some other issues. There is ample case law on the issue, so you can search and see if your city's cameras fall into any of the traps set by prior law. But, aside from knowledge of the operation of the cameras, the rest of your litany orf questions may have no bearing on the case.

    All because a witness does not knwo the answer does not make you 'not guilty.'
    **********
    Retired Cal Cop Sergeant & Teacher

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  5. #25
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    Default Re: Would Being Prosecuted for a Red Light Camera Ticket Be a Violation of Civil Righ

    [QUOTE=matt4200;670704]It doesn't require an expert witness but I still have the right to question whoever signed the affadavit for the ticket.
    His or her background and training and everything then can be questioned because he or she signed the affadavit.
    no, it can't because it is not relevant to the issue. You get to ask relevant questions. You don't get to ask when they first had sex or when they bought their first car or if they have ever been to Russia. You get to ask questions that pertain to their ability to make the determination they have.

    And it was not a vehicle registered to me that I got the ticket for.
    then how did YOU get a red light camera ticket? Did the owner give you up?

    It's not necessarily always about refuting the evidence though that is an important part it's also about questioning the character and veracity of those making these charges against you.
    those are two very different and separate issues. Yes, you have to refute the evidence presented, if it puts you in a bad light (guilty).

    and again, you seem to think the person that is reviewing the video is whom is making the charge against you. They aren't, the state is. You see, there is no witness to the crime. The video or picture is proof of the crime. That can be thrown out on the floor and the state can say: look, there he is committing the crime.

    if it is evident, to the judge or jury (whomever is the trier of facts) that you are in fact committing the crime charged, then you can be found guilty. No witnesses, no cross examination.

    Now, you can attempt to refute the evidence but it won't be by examining some witness.



    let me give you a simple scenario that might help (back to the murder situation):


    there is a video discovered along side the road. It is found by some person and reviewed. They don't want to get involved with anything so they anonymously send it to the police with a note: you have to watch this. It is a video of you shooting another person at close range with the bullet apparently entering the left temple.

    Shortly thereafter a body is discovered. It is the person you were videotaped shooting.

    You are identified and arrested. The prosecution has a very short presentation. They present the medical examiners statement and have him testify to the accuracy of the official statement that the person died from a gunshot from close range to the left temple. End of testimony. They play the video tape and make the statement: it is obvious matt is the murderer. Prosecution rests.

    So, just what witness are you going to cross examine?

    The medical examiner is not a witness to the crime. He is only a witness to the means used to cause the death. You can cross examine him concerning his report but you cannot examine him concerning the video, especially since he has never seen it.

    so, tell me, where are your rights being abrogated?

  6. #26
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    Default Re: Would Being Prosecuted for a Red Light Camera Ticket Be a Violation of Civil Righ

    I'm not expecting the witness to not know the answer I am hoping that he or she will have an answer that would make me not guilty ... An example would be when an officer is using a radar gun to catch an individuals speed...(A) When radar is used, the arresting officer has successfully completed a radar operator course of not less than 24 hours on the use of police traffic radar, and the course was approved and certified by the Commission on Peace Officer Standards and Training.

    I've seen officers state in court that they've only completed 18 hours of training in this area and because of the officers testimony about himselfNot the evidence the charges were dismissed.


    Just saying

  7. #27
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    Default Re: Would Being Prosecuted for a Red Light Camera Ticket Be a Violation of Civil Righ

    I just want to give a shout out to the regulars here, who patiently, over and over, give legal answers to the questions being asked, only to be ignored, snubbed, ridiculed and argued with. (not implying the OP did this, necessarily, but did this question REALLy require three pages?) *lol*

  8. #28
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    Default Re: Would Being Prosecuted for a Red Light Camera Ticket Be a Violation of Civil Righ

    Haha not necessarily but some states have different laws I guess and some people just don't understand that for every crime that goes to trial there is always going to be a witness to cross examine always.

  9. #29
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    Default Re: Would Being Prosecuted for a Red Light Camera Ticket Be a Violation of Civil Righ

    Quote Quoting matt4200
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    I'm not expecting the witness to not know the answer I am hoping that he or she will have an answer that would make me not guilty ... An example would be when an officer is using a radar gun to catch an individuals speed...(A) When radar is used, the arresting officer has successfully completed a radar operator course of not less than 24 hours on the use of police traffic radar, and the course was approved and certified by the Commission on Peace Officer Standards and Training.

    I've seen officers state in court that they've only completed 18 hours of training in this area and because of the officers testimony about himselfNot the evidence the charges were dismissed.


    Just saying
    but again, you are claiming there is some training involved with watching a video of you committing crime. Just what would you suggest a person must be trained to do here?

    and the reason a case is dismissed if the officer is not properly trained is because he cannot testify to the validity of the evidence. That isn't the case with a video of you breaking the law. With the speeding issue, it is the cop making the determination that you were speeding. If he was not properly trained, as the law requires, he is not a qualified expert witness and cannot claim that he was operating it properly. With your case, the trier of facts makes that determination.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Quoting matt4200
    View Post
    Haha not necessarily but some states have different laws I guess and some people just don't understand that for every crime that goes to trial there is always going to be a witness to cross examine always.
    again, I disagree but even if there is a witness, they may have nothing to do with the evidence presented. In the situation I described, that is exactly the case. You would not be able to examine the witness about the video. The video is simply evidence that stands for itself. You would have to attack the validity of the video. That is where you could end up with a witness to cross examine but unless you structure your case properly, it will never be an issue you would have to deal with.

  10. #30
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    Default Re: Would Being Prosecuted for a Red Light Camera Ticket Be a Violation of Civil Righ

    Name a criminal case for which u believe there could be not one single person to put on the stand...

    The radar gun tells the speed not the officer btw.... And I could question the officers character, there may be a training requirement I am still researching ( I know there is a training requirement for officers working with surveillance equipment which may include red light camera but still researching)

    There a numerous questions that can be asked

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