Found in Possession of Hashish After Traffic Stop

[flyingron]

Arresting you for the hash is lawful. The only question is if the officer could articulate a reasonable suspicion for stopping the car in the first place.
They are not required to tell you why you are being stopped at the time of the stop.

[matt4200]

First the officer didn't even ask for registration or anything he asked who the owner is. My friend showed him the pink slip proving ownership. But when I asked him, I said Can I ask what you pulled us over for? He replied, Out of State Plates.

What makes the arrest for Hash lawful if I have a licensed physicians recommendation oral or written for the use of medicinal cannabis, which the attorney general himself included hash as being considered to be a part of.

Also, if the arrest was lawful, and the officer did not have a malicious intent I.E. he knew that I was not guilty of the crime but still arrest me. then why would the District Attorney reject the case?

[cdwjava]

The officer may have known my friend the passenger but definitely not the driver. And I suspect the hash was on the floor nearest me because as a reaction to getting pulled over my friend threw the hash under his seat and it sled towards me.

Nice friend. And I am going to wager that he is not willing to step up and admit the dope was his, is he?

And yes the driver did end up having a suspended license.

That's why there was a tow. He likely lost the car for 30 days as a result, so it could cost him around $3,000 to get it out when 30 days have passed.

It did have at least 20 days until the registration would expire then, if the law says my friend had 20 days to transfer it correct The tags say good til April 2013 though.

If the tags were good through April 2013 (and the FL DMV verified this), then that likely was not the reason for the stop. Without the report, you might never know.

If the stop wasn't lawful then the towing wan't lawful and if the stop and towing weren't even if I didn't have my medical marijuana recommendation from a physician the arrest wouldn't be lawful.

If the stop was not lawful, then everything else could be argued as "fruit of the poisonous tree" and tossed. If the stop was not lawful, then the arrest would go away. But, since the DA is not apparently pursuing the matter anyway, the issue is moot.

So was the arrest for hash lawful? The officer had a malicious intent. And knew that I did not commit the crime

So, the officer admitted his "malicious intent" and his knowledge that the hash was not yours? Really?

- - - Updated - - -

First the officer didn't even ask for registration or anything he asked who the owner is. My friend showed him the pink slip proving ownership. But when I asked him, I said Can I ask what you pulled us over for? He replied, Out of State Plates.

What he SAID does not mean that is the lawful reason he pulled you over. He could have said, "For a bad paint job." The response may have been flippant, but an answer is not lawfully required.

f he did pull your friend over solely because he was operating a motor vehicle with out of state plates, then the officer is a moron and needs to either be re-educated or find another career.

What makes the arrest for Hash lawful if I have a licensed physicians recommendation oral or written for the use of medicinal cannabis, which the attorney general himself included hash as being considered to be a part of.

How was the officer supposed to verify your recommendation? He can't. This is why the state issued cards that CAN be verified and why most counties (54 of the 58, I believe) allow for the application for these DHS cards through the Health Departments of those counties. You might have been fine and dandy with the state-issued card. As it is, your recommendation could very easily be printed from your home computer and bogus. What the status of these arrests is in your county, I can't say. In my county our DA has had zero compliance from doctors affirming them, we have discovered numerous phony recommendations, and as such, we tend to disregard them when we re dealing with misdemeanor or felony offenses.

Also, if the arrest was lawful, and the officer did not have a malicious intent I.E. he knew that I was not guilty of the crime but still arrest me. then why would the District Attorney reject the case?

Off the top of my head, the DA decided that your recommendation was sufficient and he opted not to pursue the matter. Or, he did not think he could prove beyond a reasonable doubt that the hash was yours and not someone else's from the crowded car.

The case could be not filed for many reasons, none of which might have anything to do with the actions or intent of the officer.

[matt4200]

Firstly, nowhere under my terms of probation does marijuana use or possession come into play. Nowhere is it mentioned nor will it ever even be considered as a part of my probation.

I don't know why the city attorney knows the status of my case, but when I called the city attorneys office, gave them all my information they said that the DA had chosen to reject the case.

A main point is the officer's malicious intent which led to my liberties being taken.

And I am going to wager that he is not willing to step up and admit the dope was his, is he?
Nope, because if he gets arrested he is here on a green card so he will be deported.


"So, the officer admitted his "malicious intent" and his knowledge that the hash was not yours? Really?"

Yes, he said I know he is guilty and that I did not do anything wrong, but that someone had to go to jail for it. He said, "You know how I know Timothy (my friend) is guilty? Why? Because I towed his car and he wasn't upset or anything he was happy I didn't take him to jail. I honestly believe that this is his hash not yours"

"How was the officer supposed to verify your recommendation? He can't. This is why the state issued cards that CAN be verified and why most counties (54 of the 58, I believe) allow for the application for these DHS cards through the Health Departments of those counties. You might have been fine and dandy with the state-issued card. As it is, your recommendation could very easily be printed from your home computer and bogus. What the status of these arrests is in your county, I can't say. In my county our DA has had zero compliance from doctors affirming them, we have discovered numerous phony recommendations, and as such, we tend to disregard them when we re dealing with misdemeanor or felony offenses."

There is a phone number and numerous websites in which police as well as other collectives or dispensaries can obtain verification of a recommendation.

It is my belief that the AG's official statement regarding the status of hash being considered under SB 420 and Prop 215 had a major impact on the DA or CA's view of the legality of my arrest/detainment.

- - - Updated - - -

Barron's Law dictionary: The arresting of a person on a criminal charge without probable cause , or with knowledge that that person did not commit the offense charged. See malicious prosecution. Compare false arrest.

[matt4200]

My question involves criminal law for the state of: California

My question involves a traffic ticket from the state of: California

Okay so here is what happened. Me and three friends are driving down the street I am seated in the back passenger seat my friend is in front of me his girlfriend is next to me and the driver is driving. So we are driving straight mind our own business, when we look to the left there is a police car on the other side of the street that sees us seeing him so immediately he makes a quick u-turn and gets behind us. We keep driving straight. We pull into a mall parking lot, because that's where we are going to eat. Right as we are parking he throws his lights on asks everyone to get out of the car. Handcuffs all of us. Searches all of us. (The searching part was somewhat legal I suppose, because I and my friend are on probation) When I ask him what we were being pulled over for he stated simply for having out of state license plates. My friend had purchased the vehicle 9 days earlier, from someone visiting CA from florida and it had Florida plates on it. The tags were good and I believe in CA you have 14 days to register it if I'm not mistaken.There was on the floor of the car near where I was sitting hash which my friend received from a Medical Marijuana Dispensary. Had about 1 gram. When the officer found this along with my Doctor's recommendation for the use of medical marijuana he immediately threw me in the back of his squad car. I repeatedly said it isn't mine please just check it my fingerprints aren't on it I swear It's not mine, because truthfully it wasn't. I had never touched the jar of hash and had no knowledge of it being in the car. The officer then called a towing company to tow the car. They towed the car. On the way to the police station the officer said, look I know that this isn't your hash I honestly believe you, but if I were to bring your friend to the police station (who's hash it actually was) my sergeant might tell me I need to let him go, because the hash was closest to you. I was then booked into the jail for a Felony of H&S 11357 Possession of Hash.

I bailed myself out the next day, and immediately went to my law professor at my college. He told me it is the duty of the police officer to know all state and local laws, prior to pulling someone over, or making an arrest.

The officer specifically told me, "I know it's not your hash, I honestly believe it is Tim's (my friend) but if I arrest him my sergeant might just cut him loose because you were closest to the hash."

Also, According to the attorney General of California his definition of cannabis under the guidelines of Prop 215 ( Which allows CA residents with a medical condition to use medical marijuana to treat their illness) is that Hash was, and is covered and you can use it without fearing of legal prosecution.

I called the City attorney of LA yesterday and she said that the District Attorney had rejected the case, because the officer clearly wasn't trained properly or up to date on what the HEAD STATE LAW ENFORCEMENT'S position was on medical marijuana.

Anyways what my question is, is was any of this legal or was it a false arrest, followed by false imprisonment?

Barron's Law Dictionary: The arresting of a person on a criminal charge without probable cause , or with knowledge that that person did not commit the offense charged. See malicious prosecution. Compare false arrest.

[cdwjava]

Firstly, nowhere under my terms of probation does marijuana use or possession come into play. Nowhere is it mentioned nor will it ever even be considered as a part of my probation.

Unless your probation is informal for something like a traffic offense, most standard conditions include a waiver of your Fourth Amendment rights allowing the police or probation to conduct a search even without cause.

I don't know why the city attorney knows the status of my case, but when I called the city attorneys office, gave them all my information they said that the DA had chosen to reject the case.

It could be that the DA sends notice to the City Attorney when they choose not to file on a case in case the city wants to take it up instead as a misdemeanor.

A main point is the officer's malicious intent which led to my liberties being taken.

His subjective intent would be largely irrelevant provided he had lawful cause for the stop and the search. The stop is the only thing in question here as the suspended license would give him cause to search as a pre-impound inventory.

Nope, because if he gets arrested he is here on a green card so he will be deported.

Not really a smart thing to do ... be here as a guest and then break the law. Brilliant. The time to think about these things is BEFORE you commit a crime, not after.

Yes, he said I know he is guilty and that I did not do anything wrong, but that someone had to go to jail for it. He said, "You know how I know Timothy (my friend) is guilty? Why? Because I towed his car and he wasn't upset or anything he was happy I didn't take him to jail. I honestly believe that this is his hash not yours"

That does not imply malicious intent at all. What it says is that while he believes the dope might have belonged to your pal, he had the probable cause to arrest you for it and not him. My guess is that he was trying to get you to roll over on your friend or admit that you knew the dope was there.

There is a phone number and numerous websites in which police as well as other collectives or dispensaries can obtain verification of a recommendation.

I have yet to find any that verify it for an individual. I can buy a burner phone, put a message on it that says I am Dr. Feelgood and if you are calling the number the person whose card the officer has is a legitimate patient. Sorry, but those are unreliable, not uniform, and often phonied up.

Again, what the standard is for the officer's agency or in your county, I can't say. In some counties they have a blanket policy that anyone who shows a recommendation for any infraction or misdemeanor is given a pass ... others, like mine, there is no such practice or policy.

Again, I ask, why not get the state-issued DHS card to avoid ANY negative consequences in the future?

It is my belief that the AG's official statement regarding the status of hash being considered under SB 420 and Prop 215 had a major impact on the DA or CA's view of the legality of my arrest/detainment.

And that's just grand. But, it still does not mean that the officer acted unlawfully or even outside of agency policy in arresting you.

You do have the option of making a personnel complaint to the officer's agency should you choose. If he did make a stop SOLELY for out of state plates, they'd like to know it! Believe me! That could cause them a lot of liability in the future, and lose them good cases. And, if he is misinterpreting agency policy on marijuana recommendations, then they might also like to know that for much the same reason.

[cdwjava]

Please keep this on one thread. Since you have pertinent details already on your other thread, you will lose a lot of ground by continuing it here. Having multiple threads on the same topic is a good way to lose out on possible answers ... and it is considered bad form (poor etiquette).

[matt4200]

The officer had no other reason than the out of state plates to pull us over we were driving perfectly. I honestly didn't know the hash was there, and the officer did know it was not mine. This is the definition of malicious arrest which is illegal: The arresting of a person on a criminal charge without probable cause , or with knowledge that that person did not commit the offense charged.

Also, there is a website that dispensaries use it costs them I think $10 a month and they can make sure all recommendations are legit same with cops, but I think they have a more pricey one in Los Angeles County. Not sure of the specific url. I will ask next time I go to a dispensary

[matt4200]

Sorry I've never used this site before, Just wanted to get a 2nd opinion.

[cdwjava]

Everyone can see your original thread, and if they didn't, this one will draw them to it. Sometimes people have nothing more to add of value or just don't know the issues at hand. Very often it might take a few days for everyone to have the opportunity to see a thread and decide whether they have anything worth positing to it or not.

Original thread:

http://www.expertlaw.com/forums/showthread.php?t=148221