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  1. #1
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    Default Ex Wife Frauding Child Support, Obtained Support Order, then Abandoned Children

    My question involves child support in the State of: Florida, Washington, Oregon.
    I,Dad, (NOT A DEADBEAT), am making this statement.

    I have been paying child support for 1st son,2nd son, and daughter for every year they were legally supposed to get support from me.

    1st Ex Fraud , a.k.a. 1st Ex Fraud , a.k.a. 1st Ex Fraud , a.k.a., 1st Ex Fraud and I divorced in the state of Washington in October 1992. She relinquished custody to me at that time because she could, (would), not wait for the judges' investigation of welfare fraud; she frantically called me after the judge informed us during our hearing that there would be a week recess while this fraud was being investigated.

    Also during this time that she was living in the “safe” house, she would bring the children to the apartment complex and drop them off with me while her and her boyfriend at that time would look for an apartment for her. She would then return to pick up the children before dusk, as that was when the “safe” house closed and would not allow her to enter.


    She signed over the children in question to me that night.

    1st Ex Fraud was to pay the minimum of $75.00 month after 2 years, or the adjusted rate depending on her employment. After 2 years I attempted to locate her to start getting support but had moved to the State of Oregon where they told me that it was not in their jurisdiction since the divorce was final in Washington. I then contacted Washington and was told that it was not in their jurisdiction because the children did not reside in Washington.

    We did not hear from 1st Ex Fraud for 3 years, except for an occasional phone call where she would tell the children that she lived in the state of Texas.

    In 1996, a mutual acquaintance of ours called me and informed me of an unusual encounter with 1st Ex Fraud , it seems that 1st Ex Fraud had come into her store and purchased an item and paid for it by check, but the check was under a different name,1st Ex Fraud . When asked by friend about the discrepancy, 1st Ex Fraud informed her that she was often mistaken for other people. Friend told her that she was NOT mistaken and asked about the children, whereas 1st Ex Fraud informed her that she had NEVER had children and then left the store. 1st Ex Fraud then returned and demanded her check back and paid for the item with cash and left the store. Friend had not had time to write down the address on the check but the city was Casitas Springs, CA. Friend’s store was located in Ventura, CA, approximately 15 miles away.

    1st Ex Fraud showed up in 1997 on mother's day and demanded that I release the children to her, she had shown up in the morning pounding on my door and our 2nd son, answered the door and came back into the kitchen, (where the children had made ME a Mother’s Day breakfast), and he was distraught, stating that a lady at the door claimed to be his mom. I then went to the door and was confronted by a screaming woman shaking a paper and claiming that she had a court order stating that she that she could take the children from me. I asked her for the paper and as she handed it to me, her “boyfriend” (2nd husband), was taping me on a video camera. I called Washington county, (OR), sheriff's department and was told that if I did not have sole custody of the children, I must let the mother take them for the day. I had noticed that the paper was just the parenting plan that stated that she was allowed to have the children on all Mothers Day dates. I let her take them after being informed by the Sheriff’s deputy that she had to return them by the end of the day, per the divorce decree.
    1st Ex Fraud returned the children at the end of the day stating that 1st son had "ruined" the day. The children were in tears. Apparently, 1st son had defended me on numerous occasions where 1st Ex Fraud had been rather derogatory and this caused some arguments.

    That summer she and 2nd husband demanded to have the children for her visitation in Kansas. I had to let them go.

    Then I was informed that it was MY responsibility to pick them up or forfeit them to her. I drove to Kansas to pick them up.

    Half way through the school year, (1998), I went for full custody to get child support and was told that the divorce paperwork had to be transferred to the state of Oregon since that is where the children resided.

    I transferred the paperwork and then was informed that 1st Ex Fraud had changed her name a few years earlier to 1st Ex Fraud and now she was 1st Ex Fraud since she had married 2nd husband.

    She had not informed the state of Oregon, nor Washington, or me of the name change until I wanted sole custody.

    We had to go to a court appointed counselor and determine where the children would be better cared for. That counselor informed the court that I was "on the edge" and could lose control and become violent at any time.

    Now remember, I've had the children for 6 years, and 1st Ex Fraud didn't contact us for 3 of those years, nor had she paid ANY child support. Also, I had never been accused of being violent except when 1st Ex Fraud made the accusation. Though I had signed and notarized statements from the residents where we were managers and they all stated that the only abuse that had been seen was from 1st Ex Fraud towards the children and me. At one time she had even told me that that was the only way she could receive immediate financial aid and be able to afford to move into another place. Apparently the county would even pay the deposit and a portion of rent.


    I learned that my children wanted to live with their mother and Greg. So I decided to give up my claim.

    Within a year I had married, (August 7th, 1999), and my wife was pregnant with my child,3rd son , born on January 27th, 2000.

    In December of 1999 I was celebrating my stepson's birthday and I got a call from 1st Ex Fraud telling me that I had better get to the Portland Oregon Airport as my "No Good Useless Rotten Brat" 1st son was already on the plane headed for Oregon. She also stated that I had ruined him and she never wanted to see him again. This was the second time she had done that with 1st son, the first time was when she had just moved into 2nd husbands house in Vancouver, WA. 1st son was 7 years old at the time.

    I picked 1st son up from the airport and then went to an attorney to get the support order modified.

    I was told that unless 1st Ex Fraud relinquished her custody in writing there was no way to modify the order. I was dumbfounded. I was living in Washington State at this time and had been informed that since the final decree was in the State of Oregon, they had no jurisdiction.

    In the summer of 2000, 1st Ex Fraud demanded I have the other 2 children visit me during their vacation, at my cost for the travel. Apparently, she and , (her 2nd husband), were having marital problems.

    I paid the airfare and they visited. 2nd son then asked if he could live with me because 1st Ex Fraud and 2nd husband were fighting and the reason 1st Ex Fraud demanded that I take them was because 2nd husband had hit her and she was going to divorce him.

    I called 1st Ex Fraud and informed her of what son had said and she accused me of forcing them to stay. I informed her that daughter wanted to return but son missed his brother, I had not said anything to sway him.

    During their visit they informed me that their mother and 2nd husband had bragged to them how they had paid the court appointed counselor $20,000.00 to say that I was unfit as a parent.

    I don't know if this is true, but 1st Ex Fraud WAS living with 2nd husband at the time of the Welfare Fraud mentioned by my attorney in our divorce back in 1992.

    I attempted again to try to get the support order modified but was told that 1st Ex Fraud still had to sign a form relinquishing her custody, as if she would ever do that.

    I found out that after 1st Ex Fraud divorced 2nd husband and moved to the State of Florida, she and daughter had a falling out when Daughter was 16 years old due to a conversation with 1st Ex Fraud in which she told daughter that " there is a good chance" that I was NOT Samantha's father. After that conversation Samantha had moved into a friend’s house and lived there until she graduated from Vernon High School. And her mother never gave her any money or any kind of support during this time, yet I was paying for her support. This put a lot of stress on my marriage because we just could not afford to pay to support children at 2 times the amount.

    So, you see, I've paid support, but you should call it, as it is; SPOUSAL SUPPORT!

    The State of Washington had garnished my wages until 2007 when I got a notice stating that the support order had been fully satisfied.

    I received nothing from the State of Florida until this notice arrived, but I somehow knew 1st Ex Fraud would attempt something.

    I know there are flaws in the system, and I tried to get an attorney, but due to my financial status, I just could not afford to pay even the retainer fee. (Having to support my family and my 2 stepsons whose father was not paying support for, along with my son from this second marriage, AND paying 1st Ex Fraud for 2 children who lived with me and my daughter who lived with friends).

    I do not have the legal knowledge to fight this, nor the financial means. AND, I am extremely frustrated that all it takes for 1st Ex Fraud is merely her word and the whole legal system comes to her beck and call without so much as looking to see if there is something amiss.

    I understand the "letter" of the law, but my family and I have been through extreme hardship solely due to the machinations of a woman who has had no concern for the well being of her own children.

    She had written them about her intentions on facebook and all 3 children informed me that they would sign and have notarized statements sent to me on my behalf, stating the facts. They had informed their mother, 1st Ex Fraud , of their intentions and she immediately cut off any contact with them after stating that she didn't care, that the law was on her side, haha!



    Talk about justice, I would really like you to check into the matter a little more and find out who truly is the one who is being the fraud, (or DEADBEAT), parent.

    OR you can just follow through with the "letter" of the law. I cannot fight. I cannot win. I've been told this. But think for a second, read the statements, consider that Cildren from 1st marriage,Child from 2nd marriage, 2 (stepsons), have actually had to suffer because of 1st Ex Fraud's greed and selfishness. I've lost a marriage because the financial strain put on it was too much, and barely making ends meet because my money was going out to support ALL my children and those who did not support theirs.

    As for abuse, what do you think about taking money from the children to satisfy the whims of a woman who at one time declared to a mutual family acquaintance after her name change, that the acquaintance was mistaken, 1st Ex Fraud had NEVER HAD CHILDREN!!
    And the states involved willingly disregard the welfare of the children in spite of the evidence?

    Justice isn't always given through the "letter" of the law. Sometimes you HAVE to go with the "SPIRIT" of the law. My children are hurt in many ways because of the actions of Nicole, and the combined states involved, with this travesty and severe miscarriage of justice.

    Because of this, my children have never had the opportunity to grow up as a family, as they have been split up and living across an entire continent. My children talk to each other and me, but it is not the same as it should be.

    I just wonder how you would feel if it were YOUR family?

    My heart is broken, and I’m, in essence, rewarding 1st Ex Fraud for her negligence.

    Thank you for your time.

    Sincerely,




    UPDATE:

    I called Yamhill County District Attorneys’ Office on June 2nd; 2011and left a message pertaining to a Child Support Order issued attaching my unemployment benefits. On June 22nd, 2011 I received a call back and spoke with Oregon ADA, who informed me that since I hadn’t disputed the order within 20 days, I had no case.

    I informed him that it was stated that the only way that I could dispute the order was if, #1: The amount was incorrect, (technically, because no one would take jurisdiction, it is correct), #2: I’m not the person named on the order, (which I AM).

    The order further states that actual custody doesn’t matter, therefore I could NOT dispute.

    ADA, OR informed me that I could have disputed at that time and it would not have cost me anything. I became exceedingly frustrated, since this attitude has been what I have had to deal with since 1994, (when I originally attempted to get child support enforced BEFORE the children went to “live” with their mother).

    ADA, OR, informed me that I had NEVER attempted to do anything, but then backtracked and stated that in 1999, I HAD, indeed, asked for modification and they had reduced the support to $160.00 per month, (this was the time when I only had Matt returned to me by Nicole), but it had been dropped because I lived in Washington, therefore, it was out of their jurisdiction, even after I had informed them that Washington had stated that the jurisdiction belonged to Oregon.

    I do believe I have a right to being a tad exasperated.

    ADA, OR, then informed me that it was now in the jurisdiction of the state of Florida, and that I would have to hire an attorney and attempt to persuade them to hear my case.

    A little bit of history here. I had a job that paid $2900.00 a month, out of that I brought home $1200.00, ($587.00 child support for my frauding ex $286.00 + medical insurance; $185.00 for son from 2ndmarriage per month). HOW CAN I AFFORD AN ATTORNEY!!??!!

    Now, currently unemployed, my benefit was $396.00 a week; my actual weekly check is $258.00 that means that 35% of my benefit is being garnished. My credit is shot; I haven’t any credit cards, or family that can help. And I “made” too much for legal aid assistance.

    As I stated before; I am on unemployment. I was “laid off” due to the economy, but I was informed by an inside source that I was chosen due to my “situation” because of the nature of my work. I was a field agent/ asset repossession agent and, even acknowledging my integrity, my company works with several financial institutions that require their employees/contractors to not be in a state of financial distress.

    I have gone to several job interviews and have had no success because of my credit. I do have some minor issues but mostly, (I suspect), they consider me a deadbeat parent and, of course, can I blame them? Ethically, and morally, and financially, I have taken care of them. But because no one will claim jurisdiction, even with proof, I cannot get this taken care of.

    All this and people are STILL amazed that I won’t let it get me too “down”.

    The reasons for that are extremely simple.

    Reason #1-4; My Children

    No matter if you put me out, living out of a shopping cart, getting scraps from behind restaurants, I STILL HAVE 4 CHILDREN who love me, mainly because they KNOW beyond a shadow of ANY doubt, that I LOVE them and have ALWAYS been there for THEM.

  2. #2

    Default Re: Ex Wife Frauding Child Support, Obtained Support Order, then Abandoned Children

    Honestly? Most VOLUNTEERS aren't going to read through a life story. Is there some SPECIFIC question in all of that?

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    McMinnville OR
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    Default Re: Ex Wife Frauding Child Support, Obtained Support Order, then Abandoned Children

    Thank you Catherine;
    You don't seem to realize that I've done a brief statement/question before and got the "Get an Attorney" response. I've had to put up with 20 years of every state telling me that it is NOT their jurisdiction. The attorneys that I've contacted, in some cases paid, tell me that I can't do anything. My question is; WHY DO I HAVE TO PAY THIS WOMAN WHO ABANDONED HER CHILDREN AFTER SHE GOT THE ORDER AND EVERY SINGLE SOLITARY STATE OR MEALY MOUTHED LEGAL "ATTORNEY" ALLOWS THIS CRAP TO HAPPEN!?!!

    Sincerely yours!

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
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    Somewhere near Canada
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    35,894

    Default Re: Ex Wife Frauding Child Support, Obtained Support Order, then Abandoned Children

    Because you're ordered to do so.

    Now, if you want to keep the emotion out of things and note the basic facts THEN ask your legal question, we may be able to help you further.

  5. #5

    Default Re: Ex Wife Frauding Child Support, Obtained Support Order, then Abandoned Children

    Attorneys don't allow or disallow anything. The judge's role is to allow, disallow, or otherwise craft orders. Why one or more judges have ruled the way they have we can't possibly know. We can attempt to speculate - but as much as the answer might chagin you, the legal reality is that there's a court order in place, and the court expects the order to be followed until it is either dropped or modified. ONLY an attorney, with a full set of facts in front of them (meaning BOTH sides of the story, including all filings related to the case, who brought the motion, on what grounds, what the motion specifically asked the court for, and any commentary from the judges in the matters) is in a position to assist in attempting to get that order addressed. Even if we 100% agreed with you on moral and ethical grounds, the answer is the same.

    There are some things that stand out as being "questionable", at least potentially regarding how well you understand the circumstances, such as:

    She signed over the children in question to me that night.
    Only a JUDGE can assign custody. Whatever mom signed was probably legally worthless.


    paper was just the parenting plan that stated that she was allowed to have the children on all Mothers Day dates. I let her take them after being informed by the Sheriff’s deputy that she had to return them by the end of the day, per the divorce decree.
    Ok, so she had a parenting plan that assigned Mother's Day to her, and the sheriff, who is an officer of the court, enforced the plan.

    After 2 years I attempted to locate her to start getting support but had moved to the State of Oregon where they told me that it was not in their jurisdiction since the divorce was final in Washington. I then contacted Washington and was told that it was not in their jurisdiction because the children did not reside in Washington.
    This is where a motion regarding venue should have occurred, to nail down jurisdiction due to all the moving, forcing one court or the other to "domicile" the case. Did that happen?

    That summer she and 2nd husband demanded to have the children for her visitation in Kansas. I had to let them go.
    Did the parenting plan require that visitation take place in any specific place or state?

    Then I was informed that it was MY responsibility to pick them up or forfeit them to her. I drove to Kansas to pick them up.
    Informed by WHO that it was your responsibility to pick them up? Children don't get "forfeited", even when a parenting plan isn't followed.

    Half way through the school year, (1998), I went for full custody to get child support and was told that the divorce paperwork had to be transferred to the state of Oregon since that is where the children resided.
    That's correct - it's that same jurisdictional issue again. The proper court to hear a case is generally the one where the children are residents - if the children get moved around a lot, it can be a real pain moving the case from court to court, which is why having restrictions on moving the children unless there is convincing evidence that the move is in the children's best interest is pretty common.

    I transferred the paperwork and then was informed that 1st Ex Fraud had changed her name a few years earlier to 1st Ex Fraud and now she was 1st Ex Fraud since she had married 2nd husband. She had not informed the state of Oregon, nor Washington, or me of the name change until I wanted sole custody.
    She's the same person, there's really no reason she'd need to make notifications. People get married all the time, it's not going to be seen as an attempt to defraud.

    We had to go to a court appointed counselor and determine where the children would be better cared for.
    Yep, that's standard.

    That counselor informed the court that I was "on the edge" and could lose control and become violent at any time.
    We're in no position to comment on why the counselor thought that. We didn't do the evaluation.


    Now remember, I've had the children for 6 years, and 1st Ex Fraud didn't contact us for 3 of those years, nor had she paid ANY child support.
    What filings occurred as attempts to ENFORCE child support?

    Also, I had never been accused of being violent except when 1st Ex Fraud made the accusation.
    It's the "except" part that's important. Even one accusation gets attention. How did your attorney respond to this accusation?

    Though I had signed and notarized statements from the residents where we were managers and they all stated that the only abuse that had been seen was from 1st Ex Fraud towards the children and me.
    I can almost guarantee that those went right into the trash. Courts talk to WITNESSES, in court, where they can be questioned by BOTH sides and by the judge. Did your attorney subpoena any of these witnesses into court?

    I learned that my children wanted to live with their mother and Greg. So I decided to give up my claim.
    So you agreed to allow mom to become the custodial parent, right? That generally means that you'd be expected to pay child support.

    I picked 1st son up from the airport and then went to an attorney to get the support order modified.
    If the basis for modification of support is that the child no longer resides with the CP, then the custody order would have to be amended first, THEN the support order - both might have been done in the same day, but it's an important procedural step.

    I was told that unless 1st Ex Fraud relinquished her custody in writing there was no way to modify the order. I was dumbfounded.
    The correct procedure would have been to ask the court to declare you the CP, based on mom sending the child to you aka "kicked out". Again, custody is an issue that gets decided by a JUDGE, not by parents signing the children over back and forth when they feel like or don't feel like parenting.

    I was living in Washington State at this time and had been informed that since the final decree was in the State of Oregon, they had no jurisdiction.
    Goes back to my question at the beginning about if the case was ever properly domiciled.

    This was the second time she had done that with 1st son, the first time was when she had just moved into 2nd husbands house in Vancouver, WA. 1st son was 7 years old at the time.
    Did you seek to become custodial parent that time?

    In the summer of 2000, 1st Ex Fraud demanded I have the other 2 children visit me during their vacation, at my cost for the travel.
    Is that what your parenting plan said? If so, then you follow the plan. If not, you tell mom "no", and THEN follow the plan. Who cares what mom demands. Mom isn't in charge, unless you LET her be.

    During their visit they informed me that their mother and 2nd husband had bragged to them how they had paid the court appointed counselor $20,000.00 to say that I was unfit as a parent.
    Got proof that such a payment ever occurred? Do you really think a person making better than $100k a year in a cushy day job (much more in some areas) would risk their career, licensure, and criminal charges for $20K? Think mom might be playing head games with the children? Just a little?

    [quoteI don't know if this is true, but 1st Ex Fraud WAS living with 2nd husband at the time of the Welfare Fraud mentioned by my attorney in our divorce back in 1992.[/quote]

    Was mom ever convicted of welfare fraud? If so, what kind of sentencing did she receive? If she wasn't then drop the welface fraud issue, because it now a NON-issue.

    [quoteI attempted again to try to get the support order modified but was told that 1st Ex Fraud still had to sign a form relinquishing her custody, as if she would ever do that.[/quote]

    I'd love to know who kept telling you that mom had to sign anything. What the JUDGE signs is what matters, and the judge doesn't need to wait for mom, nor need mom's ok to reassign custody. It might have been EASIER or FASTER if mom was willing to cooperate and simply modify the parenting plan, but that's NOT the same as a legal reassignment of custody.

    Samantha had moved into a friend’s house and lived there until she graduated from Vernon High School.
    Did you seek to become the CP at this point?

    And her mother never gave her any money or any kind of support during this time, yet I was paying for her support.
    Child support doesn't get handed to the child just because they live somewhere else. Morally, mom should have been turning over the child support payments you were making (less things she still paid for, like for example, health insurance, that were expenses incurred regardless of living situation) to the family she was living with. But that's an issue between mom and the friend's parents. Unless you were seeking to become custodial parent, you wouldn't have paid any less, you would have just paid the friend's family instead of to mom.


    This put a lot of stress on my marriage because we just could not afford to pay to support children at 2 times the amount.
    Where did 2 times the amount suddenly come from?

    (Having to support my family and my 2 stepsons whose father was not paying support for, along with my son from this second marriage, AND paying 1st Ex Fraud for 2 children who lived with me and my daughter who lived with friends).
    Yep, life would be better for ALL of these children if their parents had made their marriages work, with BOTH parents raising and supporting the children together in unity. Ultimately, the system can't fix that, no matter how hard it tries.

    I do not have the legal knowledge to fight this, nor the financial means. AND, I am extremely frustrated that all it takes for 1st Ex Fraud is merely her word and the whole legal system comes to her beck and call without so much as looking to see if there is something amiss.
    I'm missing the part where the world was handed to mom on a plate. Are we to deduce that mom at some point brought a motion and the court awarded her custody and child support?

    She had written them about her intentions on facebook and all 3 children informed me that they would sign and have notarized statements sent to me on my behalf, stating the facts.
    Get off the whole notarized statements thing. Notarized statements are USELESS.


    They had informed their mother, 1st Ex Fraud , of their intentions
    Intentions regarding WHAT? To come live with you again?

    and she immediately cut off any contact with them after stating that she didn't care, that the law was on her side, haha!
    It might be, but I'm unclear what you're referring to at this point. Is the CURRENT state of affairs that mom has the kids back, with a court order making her the custodial parent, and you paying support? And that although you initially had custody, mom was later awarded custody after an allegation of abuse? And mom still has custody and you have a child support obligation? Is that were we are today?

    I've lost a marriage because the financial strain put on it was too much, and barely making ends meet because my money was going out to support ALL my children
    Yes, ALL of your children deserve your support.

    and those who did not support theirs.
    You are not legally responsible for anyone's children but your own. Marrying people who already have children always means the risk of putting yourself in the position to feel obligated to support children that aren't yours. Those are choices that have consequences, and often not pleasant ones.

    And the states involved willingly disregard the welfare of the children in spite of the evidence?
    Evidence of WHAT? Children ever beaten? Physically abused? Starved? Anything ever reported to CPS or police? What was the outcome of those investigations?

    Because of this, my children have never had the opportunity to grow up as a family, as they have been split up and living across an entire continent.
    No. Your children aren't growing up as a family because you and mom didn't keep your marriage intact. Then another marriage and children. The government/courts didn't CAUSE the problem, and ultimately, isn't in a position to FIX the problem either (realistically). The courts can address specific issues as they arise, but that's about it. And for the courts to do that, the right types of cases have to be brought in the right courts, asking for things within the court's power to grant, and with enough preponderence of evidence, including LIVE witnesses, to convince a court to grant the motion in question as being in the best interests of the children. It's a long, complicated, and laborious process - it can be frustrating and expensive. Marriages take work. Divorces take work. Custody of children and child support issues take work. Unless you've got a time machine to go back and rescue your marriage, this is the process you're stuck with now. Having an attorney makes the process better, but isn't EVER a guarantee that the court will see things the way you want it to. Having a really good, experienced attorney can increase your chances, but gets exponentially more expensive.

    Timliness seems to be a theme throughout - in that the wall you keep hitting has "jurisdiction" written all over it, and that by the time a motion or action occurs, a different court is involved. Even for people with some level of competency in understanding jurisdictional issues, it's one of the most complicated parts and although I wish there was better news for you, really NEEDS the services of an attorney experienced in multi-state custody/support - and more importantly, that attorney needs to enter the picture QUICKLY upon changes of the children from one state to another or one parent to the other - some of the complications could have been handled better/quicker/smoother if timely action had commenced, but that's water under the bridge now.

    Now that your income has been reduced to unemployment level, it's time to consider AGAIN a modification of the support order. Being involuntarily out of work IS a situation that the court can consider. Mom's counter-arguement is likely to be that you should be imputed an income (asking the court to base your support amount on what you COULD be making, not just what you're actually bringing in from unemployment compensation). If you're not able to afford the services of an attorney, then educating yourself about the many facets of family law can't hurt - and you can check around any law schools in your area to see if they have programs where students (overseen by a licensed attorney) can assist you in preparing and filing motions.

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