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  1. #1

    Default Washington Speeding Ticket

    My question involves a speeding ticket from the State of: WA

    I received my discovery materials, posted below. My actual speed was less than 65. I was on a motorcycle traveling on the right side of the left lane. I was being passed by a van in the middle lane. There were 3 vehicles in front of me at a distance of approximately 400-500 feet.

    I don't see anything that can help me. The officer says that he clocked me at a range of 430 feet, which means there were 3 vehicles between him and me. Also, I was being passed by a van less than 3 feet to my right, but at a 430 feet range, the beam probably isn't big enough to claim a scope error, unless you combine the obstruction of the cars ahead with the rocking that the wind from their passing would cause. The LIDAR's beam would be approximately 18" while my front fairing is 25".

    This is frustrating....I wasn't speeding!








  2. #2
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Posts
    616

    Default Re: Washington Speeding Ticket

    Any reason not to put this in the thread you already have for this same citation?

  3. #3

    Default Re: Washington Speeding Ticket

    Quote Quoting adam_
    View Post
    Any reason not to put this in the thread you already have for this same citation?
    Yeah, figured it'd be easier for folks to have a thread that starts out with the useful stuff like the discovery materials instead of a question about how well a lidar gun can pick out a motorcycle.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
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    1,383

    Default Re: Washington Speeding Ticket

    You know, I actually got a kick out of this when I read the memo. The State Patrol seems to get lazier and lazier.

    Here's what you're missing or failed to put up:
    In the memo, the authors state that there is a certification entitled "Lidar Certifications." Try and get a hold of that document and post it up. I have a feeling that something will be different and unsatisfactory with that.

    Lastly, no one can read the affidavit as it is too small. Try and post it a little bigger.

    Brendan

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Posts
    616

    Default Re: Washington Speeding Ticket

    It seems this memo is becoming popular in WA.

    How does one "get past" this? Is it necessary to provide a "proof of a request on a separate pleading" to get the actual calibration records???

    A

  6. #6

    Default Re: Washington Speeding Ticket

    Quote Quoting BrendanjKeegan
    View Post
    Here's what you're missing or failed to put up:
    In the memo, the authors state that there is a certification entitled "Lidar Certifications." Try and get a hold of that document and post it up. I have a feeling that something will be different and unsatisfactory with that.

    Lastly, no one can read the affidavit as it is too small. Try and post it a little bigger.
    Brendan
    OK, I resized the affidavit--was trying to keep things reasonable. I have the certificate, but it is four pages long and the board allows only 4 images per post. Again, trying to be good. Below are the four pages of certification.

    Barring any technical errors, I'll have to fall back on arguing SMD usage errors, which I know is a huge uphill battle. They mention scope calibration at 100ft, but no mention is made of what the +/- of the scope is at a given range.








  7. #7

    Default Re: Washington Speeding Ticket

    If the scope is say, +/- 1 degree, that error correlates to +/- 7.5' at a range of 430'. (I used the calculator here: http://www.cleavebooks.co.uk/scol/calsect.htm) Given the proximity of another vehicle passing me less than 3' to my right...you see where I'm going here. Problem is, there's no scope tolerance given in the certification, just that it was calibrated.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
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    CT & IL
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    5,273

    Default Re: Washington Speeding Ticket

    Steen Nickleson needs to get more training. His certification has errors.
    1) states it is his opinion that the unit will be accurate (an opinion is not OK as an affidavit??)
    2) Operational test "LASER is compared to RADAR is an issue...as it does not state it passed this test
    3) Never claims the RADAR unit was itself calibrated (NHSTA requirement)
    4) Never claims he performed any test per manufacturer's recommendation
    5) Nothing in his statement fully supports he is qualified to perform LIDAR calibrations

    Cop's statement is also an issue as he never states he tested or used the unit per the manufacturer's instructions.

    If you wanted to, you could check on other things to, if you are willing to "go the distance" and perform an investigation

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Posts
    23

    Default Re: Washington Speeding Ticket

    The beam is 3 ft by 3 ft wide at 1,000 ft (your have ProLaser III), so at 430 ft it would be less than 1.5 ft by 1.5 ft. Manufacturer-stated precision is +- 1mph.

    Why not subpoena an SMD expert and the trooper? If one of them doesn't appear, case would be dismissed.

    Quote Quoting Gravity
    View Post
    If the scope is say, +/- 1 degree, that error correlates to +/- 7.5' at a range of 430'. (I used the calculator here: http://www.cleavebooks.co.uk/scol/calsect.htm) Given the proximity of another vehicle passing me less than 3' to my right...you see where I'm going here. Problem is, there's no scope tolerance given in the certification, just that it was calibrated.

  10. #10

    Default Re: Washington Speeding Ticket

    I'd rather not rely on a subpoena no-show to win my case. It'd be nice to know the tolerance of the aiming reticle ahead of time, but that information isn't provided. I've searched for pro-laser III manuals, but to no avail. I could always wait until trial date and ask the officer. If he doesn't know, than he's not properly trained. If he does know and the tolerance is low enough to be a non-issue, then I'm wasting my time.

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