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  1. #1
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    Default Re: Is a Stop Payment on a Check for Services Rendered Illegal in Pa

    Quote Quoting office507work
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    I don't think I'm threatening criminal prosecution, but I could be wrong. Here's what I want to include: "my research revealed that in the state of Pennsylvania a stop payment on a check for services rendered can be considered a crime. Don’t you think your possibly criminal actions would be a factor in a magistrate’s decision? I do." Originally, I had written "my research revealed that in the the state of Pennsylvania it is illegal to put a stop payment on a check for services rendered. Don’t you think your illegal actions would be a factor in a magistrate’s decision? I do." But after I received a few answers here, I realized there might not be a law on the books for that particular situation and I might be using too strong of a wording and changed illegal in both sentences. In the sentence before that, I say my research indicated the law is on my side and I could leave it at that, but she has been a total b___ about it and in her letter to us she attacks the business's reputation by saying we are doing things illegally and have a special relationship with the magistrate to ensure decisions go our way. She also attacked my reputation by saying I was irate with her when I wasn't.
    But your research, at least here, hasn't shown that "a stop payment on a check for services rendered can be considered a crime". It is an empty threat. That said she may not know that it isn't a crime. So the simple sentence that includes "legal action will be taken to collect the debt" is a true statement in that you may sue and it may make her think the police are going to show up.

    I just realized that you wrote, "That statute has to do with NSF checks, not stop payment, but thanks anyway." above. That statute is the bad check law in PA. It doesn't include stop pays because stop pays aren't a criminal act in your PA. If you have any information saying otherwise please share it.

  2. #2

    Default Re: Is a Stop Payment on a Check for Services Rendered Illegal in Pa

    Quote Quoting PayrolGuy
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    But your research, at least here, hasn't shown that "a stop payment on a check for services rendered can be considered a crime". It is an empty threat. That said she may not know that it isn't a crime. So the simple sentence that includes "legal action will be taken to collect the debt" is a true statement in that you may sue and it may make her think the police are going to show up.

    I just realized that you wrote, "That statute has to do with NSF checks, not stop payment, but thanks anyway." above. That statute is the bad check law in PA. It doesn't include stop pays because stop pays aren't a criminal act in your PA. If you have any information saying otherwise please share it.
    When I wrote "that statute..." that was a reply to someone else, didn't realize it wouldn't attach to that person's response (this is all new to me). Anyway, your right on both counts, I don't have information saying a stop payment is a criminal act. Placing a stop payment on a check isn't criminal, if it was, banks wouldn't let you do it. That much I do know, it's the fact that it's for services rendered (and not for a product) that I think is criminal. If a stop payment is placed on a check for a product it's to ensure the product will be replaced, it's leverage and as far as I know that's ok. Since the check is for services rendered and that can not be replaced, it might involve a different law (theft of services comes to mind immediately). However, I can't find information that says it is, but many people tell me it is, but they aren't lawyers and the business can't afford the legal fees involved to consult with a lawyer to make sure. That's why I'm posting here. You're also right on the second count, it is an empty threat (sort of). I'm hoping to scare her enough that she pays for the check and we don't have to take it into the court system, quite honestly, we don't have the money to sue in a civil suit. But if the theft of services law is in play in this situation, I will leave in my statements about it being possibly criminal and I have no problem with contacting law enforcement. So, if at the end of today, no one can definitively tell me it's illegal, I will leave it at the law is on my side and take out my 2 stronger sentences (that only serve to scare her) . However if someone can definitively tell me it is illegal, I will leave them in.

  3. #3
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    Default Re: Is a Stop Payment on a Check for Services Rendered Illegal in Pa

    What she did would in fact be illegal in some of not most states. It isn't in your state. It also makes no difference if it was for a good or service.

    The bank allows stop payment for many reasons.

    Here are the PA laws on theft of services.

  4. #4

    Default Re: Is a Stop Payment on a Check for Services Rendered Illegal in Pa

    Quote Quoting PayrolGuy
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    What she did would in fact be illegal in some of not most states. It isn't in your state. It also makes no difference if it was for a good or service.

    The bank allows stop payment for many reasons.

    Here are the PA laws on theft of services...
    If I'm interpreting this right, what she did can be considered a possible crime under PA law. Under definitions, it lists labor as one of the services. Which is what we were charging her for. And I interpret #4 to be what she did. She obtained our services by deception, she wrote the check and put the stop payment on it the same day. She had no intention of ever allowing the bank to process the check. But as someone else pointed out that can be hard to prove. However, since my sentences are only to scare her and I can interpret the law that way, I'm still leaning towards leaving those sentences in...

  5. #5
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    Default Re: Is a Stop Payment on a Check for Services Rendered Illegal in Pa

    The law I posted re: theft of services is all aimed at utility providers.

    You can write whatever you liked but you came here for advice on what you can legally do. But you might want to read this section of the FCRA first. What I bolded.

    § 807. False or misleading representations
    A debt collector may not use any false, deceptive, or misleading representation or means in connection with the collection of any debt. Without limiting the general application of the foregoing, the following conduct is a violation of this section:

    (1) The false representation or implication that the debt collector is vouched for, bonded by, or affiliated with the United States or any State, including the use of any badge, uniform, or facsimile thereof.

    (2) The false representation of --

    (A) the character, amount, or legal status of any debt; or

    (B) any services rendered or compensation which may be lawfully received by any debt collector for the collection of a debt.

    (3) The false representation or implication that any individual is an attorney or that any communication is from an attorney.

    (4) The representation or implication that nonpayment of any debt will result in the arrest or imprisonment of any person or the seizure, garnishment, attachment, or sale of any property or wages of any person unless such action is lawful and the debt collector or creditor intends to take such action.

    (5) The threat to take any action that cannot legally be taken or that is not intended to be taken.

    (6) The false representation or implication that a sale, referral, or other transfer of any interest in a debt shall cause the consumer to --

    (A) lose any claim or defense to payment of the debt; or

    (B) become subject to any practice prohibited by this subchapter.

    (7) The false representation or implication that the consumer committed any crime or other conduct in order to disgrace the consumer.

    (8) Communicating or threatening to communicate to any person credit information which is known or which should be known to be false, including the failure to communicate that a disputed debt is disputed.

    (9) The use or distribution of any written communication which simulates or is falsely represented to be a document authorized, issued, or approved by any court, official, or agency of the United States or any State, or which creates a false impression as to its source, authorization, or approval.

    (10) The use of any false representation or deceptive means to collect or attempt to collect any debt or to obtain information concerning a consumer.

    (11) The failure to disclose in the initial written communication with the consumer and, in addition, if the initial communication with the consumer is oral, in that initial oral communication, that the debt collector is attempting to collect a debt and that any information obtained will be used for that purpose, and the failure to disclose in subsequent communications that the communication is from a debt collector, except that this paragraph shall not apply to a formal pleading made in connection with a legal action.

    (12) The false representation or implication that accounts have been turned over to innocent purchasers for value.

    (13) The false representation or implication that documents are legal process.

    (14) The use of any business, company, or organization name other than the true name of the debt collector's business, company, or organization.

    (15) The false representation or implication that documents are not legal process forms or do not require action by the consumer.

    (16) The false representation or implication that a debt collector operates or is employed by a consumer reporting agency as defined by section 1681a(f) of this title.

  6. #6

    Default Re: Is a Stop Payment on a Check for Services Rendered Illegal in Pa

    If it is actually criminal, I have no problem with contacting our local law officer (he's a good friend) and having her arrested. If I threaten it, I will follow through on that threat. But like I said before I don't think I'm actually threatening to have her arrested, I'm just trying to scare her and make her think twice about not paying us. Besides I used the qualifying adjective 'possible' which means I'm not sure if it is and no where in the letter do I say I will have her arrested, I do say definitively that I will sue her in court. I might have to have a sit down with my cop friend and see what he thinks...

  7. #7
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    Default Re: Is a Stop Payment on a Check for Services Rendered Illegal in Pa

    Your cop friend isn't going to know more than what was written in the state laws I linked and isn't likely to know anything about the FCRA.

    It isn't illegal in your state. If you threaten criminal action your will be violating the FCRA.

    But do what you want I'm done trying to help you.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
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    Default Re: Is a Stop Payment on a Check for Services Rendered Illegal in Pa

    Quote Quoting office507work
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    If it is actually criminal, I have no problem with contacting our local law officer (he's a good friend) and having her arrested. If I threaten it, I will follow through on that threat. But like I said before I don't think I'm actually threatening to have her arrested, I'm just trying to scare her and make her think twice about not paying us. Besides I used the qualifying adjective 'possible' which means I'm not sure if it is and no where in the letter do I say I will have her arrested, I do say definitively that I will sue her in court. I might have to have a sit down with my cop friend and see what he thinks...
    Stop playing games with this. She's already displayed enough nerve to stop pay. If you don't have the stones to sue for your money, no amount of huffing and puffing is going to get it for you when she ignores you.

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