Afraid I Will Lose My Son

My question involves a child custody case from the State of: Illinois

My husband lives in CA. I live in IL. We are in the process of a divorce. He left me when my son was 8 mos. old and moved to CA from IL. I followed him there a year later but returned to IL 4 months after that because of an abusive situation and financial hardship. He has been unemployed for about 90% of the time since our son was born. He has not paid one cent of child support for our son.

My son is now 5. I have worked 3 jobs and struggled to get by, paying for our mortgage payments on a house we owned in CA while my husband lived in the house, and I stayed with family in Illinois. My son is in good health, well-cared for, etc. I have people who can sign affidavits PROVING this. I have since quit all but one job, which I work full time. I spend as much time as I can with my son. He is in the care of a grandfather most of the week and with a babysitter the remaining days. I have never taken drugs. I am not an alcoholic. I have a professional job working with children. I am a responsible, self-sufficient mother who has tried to provide the best care I can for my son without any child support.

Now my ex wants to take full custody of my son, even though he has shown no interest in him until now. He only visits once a year for our son's birthday; Meanwhile, I have flown out to CA NUMEROUS times with my son and paid for the whole trip myself so he can see his child. He has never really expressed interest being with him.

My ex all of sudden says that the daycare for my son is unacceptable, and that he is concerned about "child endangerment". He says he wants to send a court-ordered investigator to check out all the places my son stays: my apartment, and the 2 places my son goes for daycare. Plus my son will probably need a child advocacy lawyer as well. Because my husband has not been employed for a long period of time, I am told that I have to pay for all these services because I AM employed. It will be upwards of $10,000.

My lawyer says my husband has a 25% chance of getting custody of my son. I know the odds are in my favor, but how is this fair? Like I said, he has taken NO financial responsibility nor shown interest for this child. A mediation date has been scheduled and my 5 year old has to be interviewed for 5 hours, I'm told.

How can he POSSIBLY get custody????? My son doesn't even recognize him as his dad, because as I said, he left us before he was even a year old. But it's all about father's rights these days, and I am painted as the bitter wife who's after him for money. He has paid NOTHING for our son. I am scared I will lose my son. Please help.

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Quoting anon1234

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My question involves a child custody case from the State of: Illinois

My husband lives in CA. I live in IL. We are in the process of a divorce. He left me when my son was 8 mos. old and moved to CA from IL. I followed him there a year later but returned to IL 4 months after that because of an abusive situation and financial hardship. He has been unemployed for about 90% of the time since our son was born. He has not paid one cent of child support for our son.

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Was there actually a court order for support?

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My son is now 5. I have worked 3 jobs and struggled to get by, paying for our mortgage payments on a house we owned in CA while my husband lived in the house, and I stayed with family in Illinois. My son is in good health, well-cared for, etc. I have people who can sign affidavits PROVING this. I have since quit all but one job, which I work full time. I spend as much time as I can with my son. He is in the care of a grandfather most of the week and with a babysitter the remaining days. I have never taken drugs. I am not an alcoholic. I have a professional job working with children. I am a responsible, self-sufficient mother who has tried to provide the best care I can for my son without any child support.

Now my ex wants to take full custody of my son, even though he has shown no interest in him until now. He only visits once a year for our son's birthday; Meanwhile, I have flown out to CA NUMEROUS times with my son and paid for the whole trip myself so he can see his child. He has never really expressed interest being with him.

My ex all of sudden says that the daycare for my son is unacceptable, and that he is concerned about "child endangerment". He says he wants to send a court-ordered investigator to check out all the places my son stays: my apartment, and the 2 places my son goes for daycare. Plus my son will probably need a child advocacy lawyer as well. Because my husband has not been employed for a long period of time, I am told that I have to pay for all these services because I AM employed. It will be upwards of $10,000.

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WHO told you that YOU will be responsible for the costs?!

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My lawyer says my husband has a 25% chance of getting custody of my son. I know the odds are in my favor, but how is this fair? Like I said, he has taken NO financial responsibility nor shown interest for this child. A mediation date has been scheduled and my 5 year old has to be interviewed for 5 hours, I'm told.

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I think your attorney is being very generous and trying to prepare you for the worst.

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How can he POSSIBLY get custody????? My son doesn't even recognize him as his dad, because as I said, he left us before he was even a year old. But it's all about father's rights these days, and I am painted as the bitter wife who's after him for money. He has paid NOTHING for our son. I am scared I will lose my son. Please help.

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In all honestly, your ex has little to no chance of getting custody of your son. At this point, he'll need to prove one of two things:

Either a significant change in your SON'S circumstances or;

You are unfit to be the primary custodian.

From what you've said, he's not going to be able to show this. Listen to your attorney. S/he is right in warning you that there is a chance, however slim, that Dad can get custody. But unless there's something you haven't shared with us, I just don't see that happening.

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Quoting Dogmatique

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Was there actually a court order for support?

No. Since he is unemployed, I didn't think I would even get anything from him.

WHO told you that YOU will be responsible for the costs?!
a)my ex-to be and b)other divorced women in remotely similar situations (my cousin and a co-worker. They said whoever makes more pays more, and if one party is unemployed, they pay nothing.)


I think your attorney is being very generous and trying to prepare you for the worst.



In all honestly, your ex has little to no chance of getting custody of your son. At this point, he'll need to prove one of two things:

Either a significant change in your SON'S circumstances or;

You are unfit to be the primary custodian.

From what you've said, he's not going to be able to show this. Listen to your attorney. S/he is right in warning you that there is a chance, however slim, that Dad can get custody. But unless there's something you haven't shared with us, I just don't see that happening.

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What do mean by "significant change in" my son's circumstances? He is at the point right now that he understands there is no father in his life. My caregiver and his preschool teacher have noticed conversations he's had with other kids when the issue of father comes up. My son says, "My daddy is in California. I can't be in soccer or take guitar lessons because he doesn't give my mommy money". Yes, he does know this, but it's not really me bad-mouthing the father. These are facts that he overhears me discussing that come out in his conversations, and I've heard this can be to my disadvantage.

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Quoting anon1234

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What do mean by "significant change in" my son's circumstances? He is at the point right now that he understands there is no father in his life. My caregiver and his preschool teacher have noticed conversations he's had with other kids when the issue of father comes up. My son says, "My daddy is in California. I can't be in soccer or take guitar lessons because he doesn't give my mommy money". Yes, he does know this, but it's not really me bad-mouthing the father. These are facts that he overhears me discussing that come out in his conversations, and I've heard this can be to my disadvantage.

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Well, things that may be considered as a substantial change in your son's circumstances include:

Mom dies;
Mom drops kid off at the grandparents' house and doesn't return for several months;
Mom gets arrested and is facing a lengthy imprisonment;
Child is not being taken care of:
No Food
No Home
No Clothes
No Form of Education
No Healthcare


As you can see, you really don't seem to fit those parameters :)

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Quoting Dogmatique

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Well, things that may be considered as a substantial change in your son's circumstances include:

Mom dies;
Mom drops kid off at the grandparents' house and doesn't return for several months;
Mom gets arrested and is facing a lengthy imprisonment;
Child is not being taken care of:
No Food
No Home
No Clothes
No Form of Education
No Healthcare


As you can see, you really don't seem to fit those parameters :)

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Thank you for your prompt reply. Luckily, I don't fit those paramaters. Most people that I've talked to about this (both professional and non) have told me that more than likely, my ex-to-be is just trying to get me riled up and not to worry too much. That 25% likelihood of him taking custody really bothered me, and like you said, I do believe it's worst-case scenario...I just had to have SOME piece of mind from a legal expert other than my lawyer (which I'm not too happy witha). At this point in the game, though, and due to finances, I am not in a position to switch lawyers. My plan is to see what comes out of mediation and go from there if I am unhappy with the result. Again, thanks for your reply.

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Quoting anon1234

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Thank you for your prompt reply. Luckily, I don't fit those paramaters. Most people that I've talked to about this (both professional and non) have told me that more than likely, my ex-to-be is just trying to get me riled up and not to worry too much. That 25% likelihood of him taking custody really bothered me, and like you said, I do believe it's worst-case scenario...I just had to have SOME piece of mind from a legal expert other than my lawyer (which I'm not too happy witha). At this point in the game, though, and due to finances, I am not in a position to switch lawyers. My plan is to see what comes out of mediation and go from there if I am unhappy with the result. Again, thanks for your reply.

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You're quite welcome. Please note though, I am NOT an attorney - yup, I know a heckuva lot about family law, but I'm not an attorney. I just want to make that clear :)

Still, I can't help but think that your ex is blowing hot air. Nothing you have said would justify a change in custody at this point.

(and if you're not confident in the ability of your attorney, please get yourself another!)

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Yes, he does know this, but it's not really me bad-mouthing the father. These are facts that he overhears me discussing that come out in his conversations, and I've heard this can be to my disadvantage.

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You need to be careful here too. It doesn't matter that the conversations were only overheard...you can bet the farm that the father's attorney is going to make an issue of this...because the child could ONLY get that information from you, even if you didn't INTEND to communicate it directly. Courts look unfavorably on parents who attempt to paint such pictures for their children, and, it can REALLY come back to bite you later. If dad wants it, he WILL be given some level of visitation, and if that visitation is ordered, it won't matter that the child doesn't want to go. Your son having the knowledge that daddy doesn't give mommy money is ALSO the knowledge that the father will use to paint the picture of "mommy doesn't let me see you or love you if I don't give her money"...and it won't matter it its true or not - it's a hyper common dynamic in such cases. Fact or not, your child has NO business knowing about it. As far as you are concerned, when the child is anywhere around, dad is a super guy that you are just incompatible with and you have some things to work out to go your separate ways. If you want to bitch your heart out about the situation, that's completely understandible, even healthy - but in no way, shape, or form, does it need to occur within 500 yards of the child. Your son will also grow up and get a better understanding of relationships and these issues, and coming from a similar situation, I will tell you that even if dad never gives you a penny, you are going to have serious resentment issues to deal with later as he grows up and forms his own opinions (and he will never have ALL of the facts, and SHOULDNT) - because once a child has the idea that you hoarded them away from the other parent over money (remember, doesn't matter if its TRUE of not), years of therapy may not even scratch the surface of how deep that will run.

I highly doubt you will lose your son. Since you've been the primary care giver of your son for the past 4 years, that will be taken into consideration. And since you've paid for EVERYTHING to maintain a contact between father and son, that'll benefit you.
What I feel is that you will have primary custody of him, and that the father will see him during holidays and summer (if son is in school) since he lives in CA and you live in IL. You may have to pay the travel expenses because you are the only one working, but he may be required to pay child support based on his potential and that's what you should ask for.
Since you say that there is no abuse, neglect nor endangerment, I believe that you will not be required to pay the investigator because if the allegations are proved to be invalid, that's the father bringing unnecessary charges to the courts and he will have to pay.
If you want to be fair, I would file for full physical with him having every other holiday and summertime and joint legal... but since he's shown no interest in his well being up until now, I'd file for visitation during summer and half of holidays, PLUS YOU have sole legal custody.
I don't think you will have a problem... you're lawyer is either a dipwit or is considering the worst of the worst outcome... which I honestly don't see happening.
As for the house, I would petition to either sell your half to him that way you don't have to pay the mortgage on a house that you don't live in and he does FREE... or buy it from him. Or he may be required to sell it and give you half and he will have to find somewhere else to live.
Don't put up with this crap... do what you feel is best for your child in regards to filling out papers.
Since child has been living in IL for more than 6 months, he and you are legal residents of IL not CA. So you can file the papers in IL, giving him ample notice to come to court there in IL...
Good luck!

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Quoting aardvarc

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You need to be careful here too. It doesn't matter that the conversations were only overheard...you can bet the farm that the father's attorney is going to make an issue of this...because the child could ONLY get that information from you, even if you didn't INTEND to communicate it directly. Courts look unfavorably on parents who attempt to paint such pictures for their children, and, it can REALLY come back to bite you later. If dad wants it, he WILL be given some level of visitation, and if that visitation is ordered, it won't matter that the child doesn't want to go. Your son having the knowledge that daddy doesn't give mommy money is ALSO the knowledge that the father will use to paint the picture of "mommy doesn't let me see you or love you if I don't give her money"...and it won't matter it its true or not - it's a hyper common dynamic in such cases. Fact or not, your child has NO business knowing about it. As far as you are concerned, when the child is anywhere around, dad is a super guy that you are just incompatible with and you have some things to work out to go your separate ways. If you want to bitch your heart out about the situation, that's completely understandible, even healthy - but in no way, shape, or form, does it need to occur within 500 yards of the child. Your son will also grow up and get a better understanding of relationships and these issues, and coming from a similar situation, I will tell you that even if dad never gives you a penny, you are going to have serious resentment issues to deal with later as he grows up and forms his own opinions (and he will never have ALL of the facts, and SHOULDNT) - because once a child has the idea that you hoarded them away from the other parent over money (remember, doesn't matter if its TRUE of not), years of therapy may not even scratch the surface of how deep that will run.

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First of all, my son is ONLY 5 years old and has been with me since birth. He BARELY knows his father, and most of what he knows about his father is because of MY efforts, i.e. paying for NUMEROUS trips to California from Illinois so my son can see him and develop a relationship.

Remember now, I am in Illinois and the father is in CA. How can a court logically and FAIRLY take a 5 year old away from me and give him to a father in ANOTHER STATE who he does really know, who he is NOT comfortable with, and who OBVIOUSLY does not care about him (he's only fighting me to be a thorn in my side)? I am self-sufficient, I hold a full-time job working with children, I am 100% clean and sober and mentally stable. We're talking sending my son 1,500 miles away from Illinois to be with basically someone who is a stranger to him. It would be a different scenario altogether if a)my son were 5 years older or b)dad lived in the same state or c)he had at least SOME relationship with him and kne how to be a supportive parent -- I'm NOT talking just financially, either. It is much deeper than that. My husband FALLS ASLEEP EVERY TIME I BRING HIS SON TO SEE HIM IN CA!!! He is irresponsible and has not made any attempts to establish a relationship with his son until now.

I have been as fair and liberal as I can with my husband. I have told him (and this is in our divorce papers) that he can come to Illinois ANY TIME he wants to see him, as long as he gives me advance notice. I have told him that he is WELCOME and that it would be MUTUALLY BENEFICIAL to establish a relationship on familiar ground where my son feels comfortable, unlike sending him to CA where he will no doubt be scared and confused. Even if it "doesn't matter" if he wants to go or not...REALLY? The courts are going to FORCE a crying 5 year old child to be permanently away from his mother, thousands of miles away, with a virtual stranger who doesn't even really want him, nor who can provide adequate care for him due to finances???

Given all the above, "I can bet the farm" that he can STILL take him away from me? REALLY?! It's not like we just broke up and my son has had a loving relationship with him all along. MY SON WAS ONLY 8 mos. old when dad left. I followed my husband to CA after he left to TRY to make it work, and it obviously didn't. I have done SO MUCH to try to establish a good life/situation from my son. What has my ex done that warrants him even the opportunity to see him, much less get custody? I guess fathers rights surpass all. So much for justice and fairness in this country.

Calm down hon. That's NOT what we're saying.

The simple fact is that even though it's pretty much a given that he cannot get custody of your son it would be doing both you and this forum a disservice if we said anything other than "well...yes, it's possible...not likely, but possible". Y'know? Judges can make unusual and unexpected rulings. Nothing is 100%.

To answer your other question....you made this guy a father. That alone warrants him being allowed to visit. You made that decision and you just can't unring that ball.

(and listen to ardvaarc's advice - it's well worth taking!)