Mentally Diminished Son Charged with Statutory Rape

My question involves criminal law for the state of: Missouri

My 21 year old son, who's on disability and who currently lives in Missouri (I am in Illinois) was recently arrested for statutory rape. The girl in question is 12. The sex was consensual, although she's a minor and it's WRONG.

However, that being said, my son has the mental capacity of a 12-13 year old. He thinks he is in love with this girl and vice versa. He doesn't seem to truly understand the gravity of the situation.
While I find the act repugnant, he is still my child and I will help both of them in any way I can.

When he was arrested, he waived his rights and willingly told the police everything. When he told me, he was under the impression that they were his "friends" and that they were trying to help him. He has NO idea that he was able to have a lawyer to defend him or protect him. He doesn't he gave up his rights. He thought they were just being "nice" to him by showing concern.
The woman who he lives with and who 's his payee, an ex family acquaintance, didn't even tell us what had happened until the next NIGHT. We could have helped him get at least a public defender!

He was released after 24 hours because they hadn't yet filed charges. They did that today and he has a warrant for his arrest.
I've called the police and spoken to the prosecutors office, explaining his mental disabilities. I have spoken with the public defender's office, begging them to have a competency hearing and a pysch eval when he gets picked up. They've told me they can't help him until he applies for help, but he isn't capable of this for himself.

We've been begging him all day to get to a mental hospital and admit himself so that he might at least have an advocate. He's been talking all day of killing himself. We've notified them of this as well...that he is a danger to himself, but not to others.

What are the chances of him getting a reduced sentence in protective custody or in a State mental hospital for diminished mental capacity? He is developmentally and mentally disabled, suffers from ptsd, high anxiety and isn't capable of making good judgements, as well. He honestly acts about 12.

I know what my boy did was wrong. But I need to help him now in any way I can. What steps can I take to make sure he's properly cared for while this is going on. I'm broke. I can't afford a lawyer, have nothing worth collateral even.
What can I do for him from Illinois? Should I go to Missouri and try to help him? We can't afford for me to go, but if it's what I have to do, I will do it. Please, anyone...I just want to help my child.

*edit*

Just found out he is at a mental hospital in MO for an evaluation.

You should never be talking to the police, victim/victim's family or the DA. They are not your friends nor your son's friends; they are only to secure a conviction and can/will tell you anything they have to do in order to get you to talk and convict your son.

Work with the mental institution and his attorney only. Anything you say to them is confidential and they will work to lighten his sentence.

If you have any paperwork showing his mental capacity before the incident, give them to his defense team only. Same goes for anything you have showing he gets SSI or any IQ scores.

The thing is, the more you have, the better and the longer period of time before the incident, the better. Many people use mental defects as a defense and you want to show that his line of defense was long standing before the incident. This gives his case more merit.

************ I am not an attorney. I can only give info on things I've learned over the years so this is not legal advice**************

Thank you very much for answering. Alot of his paperwork is in Missouri with that woman. And I have no way to get over there. Right now, he's safe, sitting in the mental ward. I spoke to his nurse Friday. He hasn't seen a doctor yet. I spoke to him. He says he is really messed up. I am glad that he can finally see this. I am beating myself up hardcore here. We didn't want him leaving for Missouri to begin with and his brother and I were actually looking into having him declared mentally incompetent to take care of himself. Now, I have to figure out how to do this from Rockford.
His case has now reached local media. We are trying to get him a public defender so he can have his case moved out of this smaller town to the city where he is now so he'll have a fair trial.

We are also finding out that this 12 year old child keeps trying to find Josh and contact him. She apparently is obsessed with my son. Is there anyway we can keep her away from him?

A PD will be assigned to him at his pretrial hearing and a motion will be made to have him deemed mentally incapacitated.

Have a restraining order placed on the girl, but keep any evidence that she is pursuing him. You can show that she is the instigator and aggressor and that she, knowing his mental state, inticed him.

A motion for change of venue can be filed due to media coverage, but there is no promise this will be granted. Most times, it is not, but trying is free.

Learn all you can about this girl and what her background is. Give all you have to the PD. There may be something he can use.

Zedex, seems to me you have covered all the bases pretty well. But I will say one thing. In most states, you cannot use the girls promiscuity to defend against a "sex with minors" charge. Other than that, good job.

Thanks, Nite.
I know they cannot use her past against her or in his defense, however, they should be able to use that she is persuing him aggressively and by doing so, can give the implication of her inticment without saying a word. A jury would see a boy that doesn't know right from wrong and a mentally stable girl who does. That may just be enough to silently sway the jury, no?

The best way to help might be finding a really good private lawyer with experince in that type of cases,a pd can be toss up.It could make all the difference in the world.

I just have to wonder...where the heck is this girls parent(s)?????

Have that restraining order placed against the girl AND her parents. Definitely, as suggested, keep track of any and all correspondence.

As you mentioned this has made the media there - keep copies of all the newspapers as well. Not just the article, but the section of the paper (this way, if 12-year old girls mom speaks to the media - you have any quotes that may come out of it, along with proof of date of publication).


note also...I'm not a lawyer....

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Quoting PandorasBox

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I just have to wonder...where the heck is this girls parent(s)?????

Have that restraining order placed against the girl AND her parents. Definitely, as suggested, keep track of any and all correspondence.

As you mentioned this has made the media there - keep copies of all the newspapers as well. Not just the article, but the section of the paper (this way, if 12-year old girls mom speaks to the media - you have any quotes that may come out of it, along with proof of date of publication).


note also...I'm not a lawyer....

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I was wondering about her parents, too. Probably some crackheads that couldn't care less what the kid is up.

Excellent point on the newspaper clippings. If there is excessive coverage, then it could be used for change of venue motions, but may also hurt. If the papers stress how badly the boy is mentally defective, and it becomes massive public knowledge, then it may sway the decision that , no, he cannot possibly know right from wrong and once its shown that she actively persued him then the case becomes all too clear as to who is to fault.

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Quoting tc498

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The best way to help might be finding a really good private lawyer with experince in that type of cases,a pd can be toss up.It could make all the difference in the world.

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Obviously, agreed. You own lawyer is always your best bet. PD's, to my notion, are only there to negoitate guily pleas under fictious and deceptive circumstances. They get paid, win or lose, so they don't care the outcome.

Thank you. I was thinking in terms of sometimes a victims family gets loose lips when talking to the media "My girl, I knew she was into this boy....", stuff like that. Or posters responding to articles "Yeah, she was always calling my kid, too".....Or "We knew he was mentally impaired, but....".

Just those little slip ups....

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Quoting zedex

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Thanks, Nite.
I know they cannot use her past against her or in his defense, however, they should be able to use that she is persuing him aggressively and by doing so, can give the implication of her inticment without saying a word. A jury would see a boy that doesn't know right from wrong and a mentally stable girl who does. That may just be enough to silently sway the jury, no?

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A girl of twelve is not legally capable of giving her consent regardless of the actions she may or may not take.

She could strip naked and BEG for sex, and she is still not able to consent.

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Quoting zedex

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I know they cannot use her past against her or in his defense, however, they should be able to use that she is persuing him aggressively and by doing so, can give the implication of her inticment without saying a word. A jury would see a boy that doesn't know right from wrong and a mentally stable girl who does. That may just be enough to silently sway the jury, no?

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If he doesn't know right from wrong, he should undergo a forensic psychiatric evaluation to be determined mentally incompetent. His present hospitalization may be for that purpose. But if he's competent, it doesn't matter at all if the girl threw herself at him, and I doubt that the judge will have any interest in entertaining any such claim or evidence. That's not a defense to the crime charged.

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Quoting RSMo 566.020 - Mistake as to incapacity or age - consent not a defense, when.

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. 1. Whenever in this chapter the criminality of conduct depends upon a victim's being incapacitated, no crime is committed if the actor reasonably believed that the victim was not incapacitated and reasonably believed that the victim consented to the act. The defendant shall have the burden of injecting the issue of belief as to capacity and consent.

2. Whenever in this chapter the criminality of conduct depends upon a child being thirteen years of age or younger, it is no defense that the defendant believed the child to be older.

3. Whenever in this chapter the criminality of conduct depends upon a child being under seventeen years of age, it is an affirmative defense that the defendant reasonably believed that the child was seventeen years of age or older.

4. Consent is not an affirmative defense to any offense under chapter 566 if the alleged victim is less than twelve years of age.

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Quoting RSMo 566.032. - Statutory rape and attempt to commit, first degree, penalties.

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1. A person commits the crime of statutory rape in the first degree if he has sexual intercourse with another person who is less than fourteen years old.

2. Statutory rape in the first degree or an attempt to commit statutory rape in the first degree is a felony for which the authorized term of imprisonment is life imprisonment or a term of years not less than five years, unless in the course thereof the actor inflicts serious physical injury on any person, displays a deadly weapon or dangerous instrument in a threatening manner, subjects the victim to sexual intercourse or deviate sexual intercourse with more than one person, or the victim is less than twelve years of age in which case the authorized term of imprisonment is life imprisonment or a term of years not less than ten years.

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Moreover, a child trying to contact a man she thinks she's "in love with" is not all that unusual and is not exculpatory.

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Quoting PandorasBox

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Have that restraining order placed against the girl AND her parents.

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That doesn't work so well when you're a criminal defendant and the girl is the alleged victim.

The girl was abandoned at birth by her mother. I know...I was around when that happened in Arizona. The birth mother was 15. The father 18 or so. The father is not in the girls life hardly at all. He prefers a more outlaw mode of living. She is raised by her morbidly obese grandmother who, due to her health and condition, cannot take care of this girl properly OR her 15 year old brother. Both children run pretty wild. The boy has severe anger issues. Both children are left to their own defenses far too much. Both have experimented with drugs. drinking and crime.
It's so tragic. And it reads out like a godawful plot to some crappy soap opera. But these white trash, bottom feeder types never lead boring lives and just perpetuate their lives through their children.

I am watching the online version of their paper carefully. And the ones in the surrounding cities.

In order to file an ex parte or restraining order, I have to go there, first. No money to travel at this time.

My son is currently in custody in the local jail cell. He was released and immediately picked up by the police. I called them and tried to explain his autism (he has Asperger's as well as other emotional and mental disabilities) to the officer there, but he didn't seem very nice and in fact, hung up on me before I could even wish him a Merry Christmas.
I was just so worried some "good ol' boy" backwater county cop would decide to stop on the way back to jail and try and show him a "lesson" without understanding that he's a kid with mental problems, not some sick bastard that's trying to lure 4 year olds off the playground.

So you (and he) have known the girl her entire life? Then there's a back story here beyond his happening to move to a new state and encountering the girl.

Please, btw, don't use real names as you did in some prior posts.

Unfortunately, I have known the family for years. I moved from Arizona, where we all had lived at one time, to Illinois. The other family moved to Missouri. We did NOT keep in touch for years. Then my kids found them and wanted to speak to the one woman again. Since they were over 18 at this point, I didn't have much say in the matter.

And yes, I slipped up on the name thing. Lack of sleep isn't helping matters.

My son is now in the county jail. They picked him up from the mental hospital yesterday. I am so glad I at least got a chance to speak to him before they picked him up.

This is absolutely going down as the worst Xmas ever:-(

I wish you and your son luck.

My thoughts: If the 12 & 15 year old kids are being raised in such an environment and just running wild....hasn't anyone contacted Social Services?

That's what I would like to know! But at any rate, Social Services is involved now and hopefully will help remedy the situation. It's sad. Just...sad. But unfortunately, happens all too often and goes undetected.

These people have filthy houses, don't care for their children and let them run around wild because they can't control what goes on in their homes. Yet, will be the first to defend and blame everyone else for their problems. And drama! Oh! They THRIVE on it. I call it the "Jerry Springer Syndrome", personally.

Are you serious? Your son should be incarcerated for the remainder of his miserable life! And him ALLEGED as being "mentally diminished" does in no way vindicate his heinous crime! It doesn't take a rocket scientist to know it's wrong to have sexually relations with children! Hell, Zedex and cyjeff know that are they are far from being the brightest bulb on the christmas tree!

P.S. The social-economic background of this GIRL does not provide any justification either! I don't care if shes the princess of freakin Saudi Arabia or a trailer trash girl from Georgia, she's still a CHILD!!!!


LOCK HIM UP AND THROW AWAY THE KEY!!!!

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Quoting blueeagle

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LOCK HIM UP AND THROW AWAY THE KEY!!!!

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YEAH! And give him some electric shock therapy aswell!!!!

Wow. I fought the compulsion to post something for about 5 seconds.

Now that you've made it blatantly obvious that you know many, many people with autism, or aspergers, or.....well, any form of mental health issue.....

What the hell???????? How on earth could your suggestions be of ANY possible help??? What year is it where you live? "Alleged as being mentally diminished". Mom says he has autism. Do you know any differently? No, you know as much as I do, mom says he has autism, in addition to other mental health issues. Autism is very f***ing real.

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Quoting blueeagle

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It doesn't take a rocket scientist to know it's wrong to have sexually relations with children!

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Have you been watching Rain Man again?

(It doesn't take a rocket scientist to create a grammatically correct sentence either. Yes, low blow. What can I say, you p*** me off.)

Yes, lock him up and throw away the key. That'll learn him.

Sweet, sweet ignorance.

Go educate yourself a little.

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Quoting skyt

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(It doesn't take a rocket scientist to create a grammatically correct sentence either....)

... That'll learn him.

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:confused:

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Quoting skyt

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YEAH! And give him some electric shock therapy aswell!!!!

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Well, he did RAPE a CHILD!

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Now that you've made it blatantly obvious that you know many, many people with autism, or aspergers, or.....well, any form of mental health issue.....

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My neighbor is profoundly retarded. I see him walkin' around the yard droolin', starin' at me when I'm doing yard work, and rubbing the front of his pants when my girlfriend comes to visit, but even he doesn't mess around with 12 year old GIRLS!

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What the hell???????? How on earth could your suggestions be of ANY possible help???

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It would be of considerable help to the victim of this case!

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"Alleged as being mentally diminished". Mom says he has autism. Do you know any differently? No, you know as much as I do, mom says he has autism, in addition to other mental health issues. Autism is very f***ing real.

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Very well. Let's say he has autism! Big freakin deal. Thomas Jefferson and Albert Einstein both had Autism. I would hardly classify either one as "mentally diminished"

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Have you been watching Rain Man again?

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Ain't never seen that movie!

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Yes, lock him up and throw away the key. That'll learn him.

Sweet, sweet ignorance.

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What do ya suggest we do, buddy? Would you trust somebody like him around your daughter?

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Go educate yourself a little.

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You're the one who needs educating!

Instead of directing these acrimonious attacks towards me, why don't you go to a foster home and talk to some of the children who have been molested? Maybe your perspective will change!

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Quoting That Guy

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:confused:

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Don't ask me, man.

None of us here have any idea whether this man knows right from wrong (most 12 year olds do) or what his mental capacity is. So there's a set of procedures that will be followed to try, as best as society can, to make that determination. And then it will procede from there. I understand a parent not wanting to lose their child to a long prison senence. I understand that we need to protect our children from sexual predators. The law makes black and white judgements on mental capacity, guilt, etc. But there are gray areas in life and hopefully that is taken into account in sentencing, but we've eliminated a lot of judicial discretion in that regard. My hope is that this girl gets help from somewhere ASAP, and that this man also get help. Even if he is found to be responsible and put in jail, it will not be for that long and he will live in society again. What then? My hope is that our "system" will deal with the situation as well as possible, but many times it fails miserably in that regard because it is only as good as the people administering it.

If he's so "mentally diminished", why doesn't he live at home with his family?

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Quoting That Guy

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:confused:

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What's so confusing? You can't figure out why I might throw some colloquial language in? You see no connection between the colloquialism "that'll learn him" and the attitude shown by blueeagle?

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Quoting blueeagle

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My neighbor is profoundly retarded. I see him walkin' around the yard droolin', starin' at me when I'm doing yard work, and rubbing the front of his pants when my girlfriend comes to visit, but even he doesn't mess around with 12 year old GIRLS!

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It sounds like you think there is only one variety of "retarded". Do you?

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Quoting blueeagle

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Let's say he has autism! Big freakin deal. Thomas Jefferson and Albert Einstein both had Autism. I would hardly classify either one as "mentally diminished"

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Do you know what a spectrum is? Specifically in relation to mental health? I know many people with autism who are completely unable to function in daily life without assistance - yes, it CAN be a big freakin deal. (I also know people with autism who are only slightly affected)

......and to be picky, no, Thomas Jefferson and Albert Einstein are ALLEGED to have had autism......they are also alleged to have NOT had autism....

(I wouldn't be particularly surprised for it to be proven that Einstein had Asperger's)

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Quoting blueeagle

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What do ya suggest we do, buddy? Would you trust somebody like him around your daughter?

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I don't know, I'm thinking some kind of residential treatment, supervision.....I know....crazy idea. I don't know what I'm thinking, it's a wild idea I know. Throwing him in prison would be MUCH smarter. Much better facilities for mental health and preparation for living within a community.

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Quoting blueeagle

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You're the one who needs educating!

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About what exactly?

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Quoting blueeagle

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If he's so "mentally diminished", why doesn't he live at home with his family?

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.......:rolleyes:

You ask a question, I'd like to respond but I'm not going to bother. You have no idea about mental health in the slightest.

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Quoting skyt

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I don't know, I'm thinking some kind of residential treatment, supervision.....I know....crazy idea. I don't know what I'm thinking, it's a wild idea I know. Throwing him in prison would be MUCH smarter. Much better facilities for mental health and preparation for living within a community.

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He raped a CHILD! Do you really find it prudent to sentence him to probation?????

Blueeagle asked if the boy had such diminished mental capacity why wasn't he living at home? You would not respond to this question. why?

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Quoting leopardprints

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Then my kids found them and wanted to speak to the one woman again. Since they were over 18 at this point, I didn't have much say in the matter.(

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Could it be that when the boy went to another state you thought he had enough mental capacity that you could not stop him.

I also have some questions of my own:

Who was your son residing with in MO.?

How was he supporting himself?

Do you have another adult child there as well?

Has he been appointed a PD yet?

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Quoting blueeagle

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He raped a CHILD! Do you really find it prudent to sentence him to probation?????

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BE, When did you become so high and mighty? If this was a 21yo female, and a 12yo BE, would you feel this strongly?

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Quoting Joshuadeuce1

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Blueeagle asked if the boy had such diminished mental capacity why wasn't he living at home? You would not respond to this question. why?

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Yeah, really. My RETARDED next door neighbor is 50 something and he still live at home!

I hate that son of a bitch...

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BE, When did you become so high and mighty? If this was a 21yo female, and a 12yo BE, would you feel this strongly?

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Shut up, asshole! :p

Yes, I probably would. 12 years old would be pushing it. Now, if it was a 16 year old boy and a 31 year old woman, I wouldn't have a problem.

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Quoting blueeagle

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Yes, I probably would. 12 years old would be pushing it. Now, if it was a 16 year old boy and a 31 year old woman, I wouldn't have a problem.

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22 and 14?

And its people like you with this black and white mentality about stuff like this that lock people with the minds of children in a jail cell. HE IS MENTALLY 12-14. He has AUTISM. Now, if this was your child, would you be so quick to toss him in a prison and throw away the key? When it's YOUR child, you come to me and discuss it. This isn't a predator. This isn't a guy stalking 5 year olds at the park. This is a mentally handicapped CHILD. His body might be 21 but his mind sure as hell isn't.

You talk about my son like he is some sort of an animal. He isn't and never has been.

As for the socio-economic state of the girl's family, YES, it does have something to do with it. Had she had a decent upbringing that didn't involve people with a Jerry Springer mentality, she wouldn't be out screwing half the town, doing drugs and having a record already. I feel very sorry for her because, with her lack of proper care and upbringing, she wouldn't be destined to a life of feeling like men are the only way to validate herself and a way to escape her horrible life.

He did live at home. I was working on getting him declared mentally competent, because he doesn't know how to take care of himself.
He wanted to go stay with someone we knew in MO. Someone whom I thought I could trust to keep watch over him, although yeah...we see how THAT went.
We decided to hold back on the competency hearing to see if he could, away from everyone else, manage on his own. Obviously, he couldn't.

Now, I am beating myself up for NOT forcing him to stay. I had so hoped he'd be able to function better without me micromanaging everything for him. I listened to other people than going with my own instincts. This is something I have to live with now.

I made a judgemental error in letting him go. I thought I'd give him a chance to see if, away from my "s'mothering" as my husband calls it, if he could function better.

The person we sent him with is someone I've known 21 years. And no, I do NOT like her.

My son has SSI. That is how he supports himself.

My other adult son (who is 20) did stay there with him for 3 months to make sure he was settled in. But his child was due to be born and he had responsibilities to his new wife here, so he had to leave.

I keep calling the jail and reminding them of his autism and other disabilities. He hasn't filled out the application yet for the Public Defender. He needs help with it and thus far, no one has sat down with him to help him do it.

As for why I haven't responded, I'm not online alot. Alot more lately because of this, but I work two jobs to support my children still living at home.

I would like to see him in a group home where he can be monitored all the time since I now work two jobs and am not at home much.

Now...would you put a 12 year old in a prison with adults? Seriously!

I am really hoping we can have his sentence fulfilled in a State Hospital. And afterwards a group home.
Residential treatment would be far better for someone of his mental capacity than a prison. It would be like throwing a confused preteen in a prison full of adults who'd thinking nothing of harming him. Simply because he's non-violent and would just curl up in a ball and cry or be non-verbal and withdraw completely from everyone.

Also, this forum is very confusing to someone with dyslexia...I hope I didn't do the responses wrong. I apologize to everyone if I did.

There are some things that you really need to understand from a legal aspect.

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Quoting leopardprints

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And its people like you with this black and white mentality about stuff like this that lock people with the minds of children in a jail cell. HE IS MENTALLY 12-14. He has AUTISM. Now, if this was your child, would you be so quick to toss him in a prison and throw away the key? When it's YOUR child, you come to me and discuss it. This isn't a predator. This isn't a guy stalking 5 year olds at the park. This is a mentally handicapped CHILD. His body might be 21 but his mind sure as hell isn't.

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Let's start here.

His body's age is the main focus of the law. On the basis of that alone, he is, indeed, in the same class as other sexual predators.

To prove diminished capacity, you are looking at a significant legal battle... an expensive one at that.

I am not saying it shouldn't be pursued... I am just saying it isn't close to the slam dunk you seem to think it is.

Even a 12-14 year old knows right from wrong.

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You talk about my son like he is some sort of an animal. He isn't and never has been.

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You should be prepared for members of his jury to feel the same way as some of the members here.

Diminished capacity will only play so far in front of a jury.

Don't forget... there are two reasons for prison. One is to punish the guilty... the other is to protect society from those that would do it harm.

Saying that your son didn't know what he was doing and, by inference, could do it again is not going to help much.

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As for the socio-economic state of the girl's family, YES, it does have something to do with it

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Completely wrong.

Her family has NOTHING to do with your son's case. There is no "her family is trailer trash" affirmative defense to statutory rape.

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Had she had a decent upbringing that didn't involve people with a Jerry Springer mentality, she wouldn't be out screwing half the town, doing drugs and having a record already

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Again, she could be ridden more than the town bicycle and it wouldn't make ANY difference.

Even if.

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I feel very sorry for her because, with her lack of proper care and upbringing, she wouldn't be destined to a life of feeling like men are the only way to validate herself and a way to escape her horrible life.

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I would also recommend against saying her rape was her fault.

The victim is not on trial.

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He did live at home. I was working on getting him declared mentally competent, because he doesn't know how to take care of himself.

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Wait.

So he is mentally diminished but you are "working on getting him declared competent". Which is it?

You can't pick and choose because the circumstances seem better that way.

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He wanted to go stay with someone we knew in MO. Someone whom I thought I could trust to keep watch over him, although yeah...we see how THAT went. We decided to hold back on the competency hearing to see if he could, away from everyone else, manage on his own. Obviously, he couldn't.

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Okay, now I (and that imaginary jury) are REALLY confused.

You, yourself, believed he was ready to start assuming the responsibilities of an adult.

Therefore, you, yourself, will be seen as making a judgement call that he is NOT diminished mentally and was ready to take his place in society.

Your attorney is going to want to plea bargain the hell out of this. Putting you on the stand will get your son in a small cage.

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Now, I am beating myself up for NOT forcing him to stay. I had so hoped he'd be able to function better without me micromanaging everything for him. I listened to other people than going with my own instincts. This is something I have to live with now.

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So it is the girl's fault, your fault and the people watching your son's fault.

When does his responsibility kick in? Especially since you thought he was mentally old enough to try living outside the home?

Well said, Jeff.

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Quoting leopardprints

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He did live at home. I was working on getting him declared mentally competent, because he doesn't know how to take care of himself.

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Jeff, looking at the context, I'd say Leopardprints meant to say "declared INCOMPETENT".

Leopard, I certainly understand as a parent why you feel as you do. If you wanted less than the best possible outcome for your child that would be abnormal.

That being said, by directing ANY of the blame or fault at the victim, you will not receive much compassion here, or anywhere else for that matter.

You have said your son still does not have counsel, is that correct? He has been arraigned already, correct?

Typically, at arraignment the judge will ask if you have an attorney, if you can afford an attorney, or if you would like to have a PD appointed in the alternative. Did this happen?

If your son does not have the capacity to understand basic legal questions such as "do you have an attorney?". Then you have to make sure he has some sort of advocate when he next appears.

If it is at all possible to be there, then be there. If not, you must find someone else who can.

Why is your son receiving SSI? Is it because he has been diagnosed with a mental handicap? Is he involved with any state agencies as a result? Developmental services? Autism speaks? If involved with any agency like this, get them involved, they have more clout than you do. Is he a member of a church? Call his Pastor.

I very much sympathize with you.

But they are right. Your son does have to go jail or an institution where he cannot commit his crime again.

yes, the girl is at fault to a degree - being the reputed town tramp. But if your son's mental capacity is so that he can't say "NO"....that's a problem. He obviously needs to be where he is under strict, 24/7/365 observation and care. Whether that be a jail, a group home, or what.

And yes, that girls parents should be reported again...she needs help as well. But that is not the issue here.

I would not expect him to be sent home. I would expect him to be sentenced to a mental unit for a while, and then a group home. Unless you can somehow make sure he is supervised around the clock and prove it.

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Quoting Joshuadeuce1

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Jeff, looking at the context, I'd say Leopardprints meant to say "declared INCOMPETENT".

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I arrived at the same conclusion.

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That being said, by directing ANY of the blame or fault at the victim, you will not receive much compassion here, or anywhere else for that matter.

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Ain't gonna receive any from me! You don't blame a rape VICTIM for the rape. especially if the victim is a CHILD! We don't live under sharia law!!!!

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You have said your son still does not have counsel, is that correct? He has been arraigned already, correct?

Typically, at arraignment the judge will ask if you have an attorney, if you can afford an attorney, or if you would like to have a PD appointed in the alternative. Did this happen?

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One must to be found indigent in order to qualify for a court appointed attorney. Maybe he don't qualify because of his SSI income?

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Is he a member of a church? Call his Pastor.

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Sorry, but I have to ask... what good will that do?

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Quoting blueeagle

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One must to be found indigent in order to qualify for a court appointed attorney. Maybe he don't qualify because of his SSI income?

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This could be the case BE. Does anyone know off hand if you continue to receive SSI benefits if you are incarcerated?

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Sorry, but I have to ask... what good will that do?

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Mom has said it will be very difficult for her to travel. This young man needs someone who has not already condemned him to be there to insure he knows what is going on. Pastor, maybe.

BE, as you know from previous conversations, I am a strong supporter in harsh penalties for people convicted of any sexual assault, including statutory rape. This case is a little different though. No sympathy if the young man does not have severely diminished capacity. But, if he does, he obviously should not be treated as a normally functioning 21yo.

Clearly the girl is a victim. It could be this young man becomes one.

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Quoting blueeagle

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You don't blame a rape VICTIM for the rape. especially if the victim is a CHILD! We don't live under sharia law!!!!

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Where do you get the idea that sharia law would blame the victim of rape for the rape whether the victim was a child or not???

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Quoting Joshuadeuce1

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This could be the case BE. Does anyone know off hand if you continue to receive SSI benefits if you are incarcerated?

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Thats a good question.

Care to make a conjecture as to how much money this young man receives in SSI benefits? I've heard my retarded neighbor receives close to 3000 dollars a month. This seems a bit excessive to me.

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Mom has said it will be very difficult for her to travel. This young man needs someone who has not already condemned him to be there to insure he knows what is going on. Pastor, maybe.

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Gotcha.

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BE, as you know from previous conversations, I am a strong supporter in harsh penalties for people convicted of any sexual assault, including statutory rape. This case is a little different though. No sympathy if the young man does not have severely diminished capacity. But, if he does, he obviously should not be treated as a normally functioning 21yo.

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Mom says he has the mind of a 12 year old. Ok, let's say he does. Even a 12 year old knows the difference between right and wrong. Hell, my 6 year old neice knows the difference!

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Quoting blueeagle

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Care to make a conjecture as to how much money this young man receives in SSI benefits? I've heard my retarded neighbor receives close to 3000 dollars a month. This seems a bit excessive to me.

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I have no idea how much he would receive. If indeed he was able to hire private counsel, it would almost certainly be to his benefit.

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Mom says he has the mind of a 12 year old. Ok, let's say he does. Even a 12 year old knows the difference between right and wrong. Hell, my 6 year old neice knows the difference!

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If he has the mind of a 12yo, he could be seeing himself and the girl as equals, rather than an adult and a child. Hence, he would not be seeing his actions as being wrong.

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Quoting Joshuadeuce1

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If indeed he was able to hire private counsel, it would almost certainly be to his benefit.

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Agreed

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If he has the mind of a 12yo, he could be seeing himself and the girl as equals, rather than an adult and a child. Hence, he would not be seeing his actions as being wrong.

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I don't know, man... I can't find anyway to justify what he did to her.

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Quoting blueeagle

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I don't know, man... I can't find anyway to justify what he did to her.

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I am not sure I can either. I am just not going to be as quick to put him in prison. Does society need some sort of protection from the young man? Yes. Will he be rehabilitated in prison? No.