Which Survey Stands

I think that you just got an update to your previous "mortgage survey".

It's just as worthless updated as it was originally.

You have no next step until you get a proper boundary survey done, documented in writing with a legal description, marked on the ground, and drawn up with a plat (map) showing the location of the fence in relation to the boundary line.

The previous post which you quote regarded boundary by acquiescence, which requires that both parties act in complete agreement as to their common boundary. You don't seem to be in that situation.

Thank you Land Surveyor. Would you know where I might find accepted documentation regarding mortgage surveys vs. boundary surveys? I realize that mortgage surveys are accepted in property sales and purchases. Clearly they are accepted by banks as well. Yet I would like to offer evidence to the judge in this case stating the facts surrounding these two types of surveys. Thank you again for your help.
My "angle" or "approach" in presenting my case to the judge will be the truth regarding these survey types and that in light of this truth, personal property should not have been touched without clear and accurate boundary information.
If the judge agrees that a mortgage survey lacks the accuracy needed to determine true boundary lines then he may also rule that the destruction of the fence was in fact premature and illegal. Determining the boundary after the fact may well be a moot point. As my surveyor said..."how can anyone testify as to where the fence was (within 7 inch accuracy)....when the fence is gone?". They should not have taken down the fence with a mortgage survey (and malicious retaliation) as their only foundation.
As I have stated before, I am a single mom of four children. I work two jobs to feed my family and keep a roof over our heads. I cannot take on an added thousand dollar cost.
Thank you again for all your advice and informative help. :)

Here is a link to what I think you requested:

http://codes.ohio.gov/oac/4733-38

Dear Land Surveyor,

I want to thank you, most sincerely, for sharing your knowledge and patience with me. I believe the site you offered will be most helpful in proving my case. Thank you again. Would you by chance have the link to NewJersey codes? I will use Ohio's if necessary, I just thought perhaps you might know. I have googled many guesses but keep coming up short. Thank you again.

You are welcome of course.

I cannot envision a judge doing anything in your proposed case in the absence of a boundary survey. The fact that the boundary is unknown simply means that your assertion that the the fence was removed from your property as an act of vandalism or whatever puts you in only a "he said she said" situation. If you cannot afford the cost of a survey, I cannot imagine that will get in front of a judge for more than four or five minutes.

I am not trying to be rude or disrespectful here but just attempting to give you a realistic appraisal of your situation. You asked for that.

In the absence of an actual boundary survey establishing your claim, you have no claim and should be so advised, and you are.

Hello again Land Surveyor,

I have not been able to contact you as work has kept me mostly exasperated. I have though been able once in a while to research the current situation. I was able to find extremely helpful New Jersey codes and standards. I thought you might like to peek so I am offering you the website. ACMS.NET - ALTA-ACSM Standards The accuracy standards are listed as 0.07. Is that 8" ? There are also a few interesting articles on that site.
I have been in touch with my neighbor's surveyor...indirectly...who said he never told my neighbor that the entire fence was encroaching by 0.06 but that he said the corner of the last panel encroached. He said he was in no way responsible or accountable for the neighbor's actions and in no way suggested such drastic measures be taken.
I get what you are saying with regard to boundary survey. And without being rude, I must offer, especially when it comes to the law, that there is more than one way to skin a cat. There is motive. There is information used to substantiate actions. etc.
Most all the laws, statutes and codes I have printed as evidence clearly state that one can not, and should not, use a mortgage/location survey to determine accurate property lines. I have also found cited cases where a judge awarded damages based on malicious intent regardless of a 10 or 13 year old encroachment. There is a book called "Neighbor Law; fences, trees, boundaries & noise. Very helpful :) I couldn't believe the laws on "Spite Fences" Wow! In any event, if this case hinges solely on where the property line is then perhaps the judge will order a "boundary survey". But if the case is more than that and the judge agrees that no action should have been taken based on a mortgage survey followed by an obvious spite fence then who knows what will happen. It seems to me that most judges frown on vigilante retaliation. One more question if you wouldn't mind. If the accepted accuracy is 0.07, then can someone remove an 0.06 encroachment legitimately? Just curious. Thank you again for your help and candidness. It is appreciated.

The specification of "0.07' " is seven hundredths of a foot or approximately just under one inch.

Quote:

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I must offer, especially when it comes to the law, that there is more than one way to skin a cat.

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That is certainly true. And all of the cat skinning is done by lawyers. You'll need to be getting one on board if you expect to go to court on the issue you present, regardless of it's merits.

If 0.07 is equal to just under one inch, then what is the specification for 0.06? 0.06 is the specification used by my neighbors surveyor. He wrote: "in locating the rear left iron pin, the corner of the fence is 0.06 over property line of neighbor."

Also, if you wouldn't mind, on my survey the distance measurement for the easterly side of my property is notated as 71.18... can you tell me this specification in laymens terms? The westerly distance measurement from front to back is 74.19. These measurements do not make much sense to me but I am sure they do to you. Thank you in advance for whatever you can offer. The frontage on my property is where the uneven starting points are....if that helps.
The lawyer that I worked for believes I should have no problems presenting my case. Perhaps New Jersey is different from where you are? In any event, taking the "inadequate survey information" approach, (by using a mortgage survey), he believes I have a strong case.
You are unequivocably correct when you say that a boundary survey will offer proof of justification. That works both ways. Since the fence pre-existed for thirteen years, and their is no boundary survey to date, (not on the part of the fence destroyer either) then the inadequate survey information stance is bolstered.
I have N.J.S.A. statutes to support my case. I am still seeking "Common Law" cases to further support my stance. Quite frankly I have very little to lose. My fence is already gone. If the judge rules that human beings can take matters into their own hands and destroy property, then so be it. In the interim I am learning a lot and presenting my case to the best of my ability. My children are also learning. They are learning that you do not have to be a victim simply because you don't have alot of money. They are learning how to thoroughly research all options. Perhaps God will smile on our efforts. Thank you again Land Surveyor for all your intelligent imput :)

0.06' = 3/4"

71.18' = 71' 2 1/8"

74.19' = 74' 2 1/4"

0.01' is one hundredth of a foot. So 0.01' is barely less than 1/8"

1" = 0.08'
2" = 0.16'
3" = 0.25'
4" = 0.33'
5" = 0.42'
6" = 0.50'
7" = 0.58'
8" = 0.67'
9" = 0.75'
10" = 0.83'
11" = 0.92'
12" = 1.00'

Hope this helps.

For those of you who have read this widely-read post, let me add this for those who may think land surveying or legal practice can be a hobby or some kind of a do-it-yourself project.

There is a lot of stuff on the internet now, and you can certainly get advice about how to be your own attorney or land surveyor. None of the advice-givers will be around to help you when you get to court.

You can also learn on the internet how to embalm a corpse or perform an appendectomy on your kid if you think that you need to save the money.

If you think that the licensed professions have no more value, why would you bother to come here and ask them, and then ignore the advice.

Our original poster seems to be headed for court with an "atta girl " from a former employer who will be nowhere near the scene of the action when she attempts to get before a judge. I hope her adversary does not retain a lawyer. If he does the result predicted will not occur.