12 Year Old Boy Doesn't Want to Have Overnight Visitation

I have a 12 year old son, who doesn't want visitation (overnight) anymore. He is uncomfortable with the environment. At what age can this happen? My son has finally spoken to his father on what is bothering him, and his dad flushed it out and turned it on him. At which point, my son told me his wishes and I called his dad to tell him. He of course became indignant, and said that when he (the son) can respect his wishes and he calls to want to see him then fine.

Can I just stop this entirely?

If there is a court order for visitation and you aid your child is ignoring that court order YOU will be found in contempt. Your son can stop visiting his father when he is an adult (18) and the court no longer has jurisdiction over him.

There is no specified visitation. It is just reasonable, and I have full custody.

If I am held in contempt for my child's well being - then there is really something wrong with the court systems.

Being you did not state the reason why your son does not want to go to the visitation. If it is something illegal going on at the other parents house. Then I would report it to the proper authorities. Informing them of the illegal activity. Then once the police report has been made you have leverage for your reasoning behind not allowing your son to see his father.

Being there is no specified visitation it would be hard to hold you in contempt.

Because a 12 year old says I don't want to, and you want to buy into whatever story he's giving you does not make it in his best interest. Remember, you are entering manipulative preteen world...

If mom begins to withhold visitation, it won't be that hard to hold her in contempt.

The child isn't comfortable being over there. According to him, there is heavy drinking going on and he doesn't like driving home with them. In counseling, it has come out that his father has lifted him up by his neck against the wall. His father is making him fearful of a lot of anger. As well as, documentation of the mind state of returning from his dads. He will see him, just not overnight. His father is refusing to see him unless it is overnight.
I understand the "preteen" conception. However, the child tried talking to his father for four hours, and he just will not listen to what he has to say.

When you reference contempt - is that jail?

Initially, no. It doesn't mean jail. However, if you keep disobeying the court, it could mean that you are no longer the custodial parent. The custodial parents job is to facilitate a relationship between the NCP and child, not listen to the child and do what they say. Often, you have to make children do things they don't want to. They have to do things and be put in positions where they are uncomfortable. Your solution to what to do when your child is put in an uncomfortable situation is to let him not deal with it. A responsible parent would make him deal with it and teach him HOW to deal with it. There are a gazillion times when your child is going to be put in uncomfortable or difficult situations. You can't hide him from them all.

I found this out through Macomb County Friend of the Court. It seems that MI must be different than CA

My parenting time order indicates I have reasonable parenting time rights. What does that mean?
Answer:
Reasonable parenting time is a legal term of art. Quite simply, it means whatever is reasonable between the two competing parties. There are a number of parenting time schedules which would equate with reasonable rights of parenting time, such as alternating weekends. However, without a specific parenting time schedule, it is virtually impossible to enforce denial of reasonable rights of parenting time. The Macomb County Family Court has adopted a reasonable parenting time schedule which can be readily enforced. If you have difficulty operating under a reasonable rights of parenting time theory, it is suggested that a motion be filed to specifically delineate the non-custodial parties’ parenting time.

Here's what you are missing. If you begin to withhold visitation, when he's been excersing it because YOU feel like you should, YOU are being unreasonable. He is not agreeing to your unilateral decision. Take it in front of the judge. They will not be amused....

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Quoting taps23

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There is no specified visitation. It is just reasonable, and I have full custody.

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What you have is an established pattern of visitation, and it sounds like a very long-term established pattern. Even if it's not set forth in the court order, it's not something you are free to unilaterally change (let alone terminate).

If you believe that there are grounds to suspend visitation, you are expected to bring a motion before the court and prove your case to a judge. If you suspend visitation and end up before the court on the father's motion, you're going to find yourself on the defensive. You can expect that the judge will want to know why you feel like you don't have to obey his orders, and why he should trust that you'll do so in the future.

I could put it like this: "If you have difficulty operating under a reasonable rights of parenting time theory, it is suggested that a motion be filed to specifically delineate the non-custodial parties’ parenting time." If you don't like what you've been doing since the divorce, file the motion.

I have almost the exact same situation here in Illinois and my son is 11. He has resisted visitation since he was 5 years old. I have tried motions for interuptions and suspensions. Nothing has been resolved and the situation has been becoming more volitile as years have passed. I have withheld visitation 3 times, an NO the court does not like that.
It is probably not a pre teen manipulative thing...there are real problems. Just because there aren't needles hanging out of arms and cords wrapped around necks does not mean that your childs wishes should not be considered. Of course, it could be worse...but as parents we want the best possible for our children and you do not seem to be getting out of the system what is necessary for your sons positive growth experience. The system is broken.

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Quoting pardus

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I have almost the exact same situation here in Illinois and my son is 11. He has resisted visitation since he was 5 years old. I have tried motions for interuptions and suspensions. Nothing has been resolved and the situation has been becoming more volitile as years have passed. I have withheld visitation 3 times, an NO the court does not like that.
It is probably not a pre teen manipulative thing...there are real problems. Just because there aren't needles hanging out of arms and cords wrapped around necks does not mean that your childs wishes should not be considered. Of course, it could be worse...but as parents we want the best possible for our children and you do not seem to be getting out of the system what is necessary for your sons positive growth experience. The system is broken.

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Please don't blame the system for your inability to choose the right person to procreate with. That was solely your decision alone. The system had nothing to do with it. You invited the system into your life.

In Oregon/Washington the courts can not force a child after the age of 13 to see a parent if the child verbally states their life could be in danger. (i.e. if you send me there I will run away!) If the child says this to a police officer then you can get a statement from that police officer to use in court. If your X is manhandling your child I do not blame you for not wanting your child in an unsafe position. if you are really concerned about him hurting your child, tell him you will end his child support payments if he suspends his parenting time, if you really care you wont care about the money and if he really doesn't care about your kid then he may do this.
TO COURT CLERK:
ANYONE IS CAPABLE OF MAKING A CHILD, IT DOESN'T MEAN THEY SHOULD RAISE ONE

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Quoting gctsad

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In Oregon/Washington the courts can not force a child after the age of 13 to see a parent if the child verbally states their life could be in danger. (i.e. if you send me there I will run away!)

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There are miles of difference between a child being worried for their safety and a petulant child throwing a tantrum.

By your reasoning, when the child is at dad's, all he would have to do to stay is to say, "if you send me back to mom's, I will run away" and then dad keeps him.

Right?

Children are not given that much power in any court room I know of.

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If the child says this to a police officer then you can get a statement from that police officer to use in court

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Yes, and it will say, "the child is 13 and throwing a tantrum".

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If your X is manhandling your child I do not blame you for not wanting your child in an unsafe position. if you are really concerned about him hurting your child, tell him you will end his child support payments if he suspends his parenting time,

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You are not actually telling the OP to intentionally violate a court order, are you?

Make that two court orders.

In the meantime, mom does not have the authority to suspend CS payments. Only the court does. If dad doesn't pay, saying "Mom told me I didn't have to" won't fly very far.

Further, if you start teaching a child that they can be bought and sold for the right amount of money, you really should consider parenting classes.

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if you really care you wont care about the money and if he really doesn't care about your kid then he may do this.

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See above "violating a court order is a bad idea" statement.

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TO COURT CLERK:
ANYONE IS CAPABLE OF MAKING A CHILD, IT DOESN'T MEAN THEY SHOULD RAISE ONE

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No, but, legally, it means they have every right to try.

Even if.

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Quoting gctsad

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In Oregon/Washington the courts can not force a child after the age of 13 to see a parent if the child verbally states their life could be in danger. (i.e. if you send me there I will run away!)

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Please post the statutes in both states that support your statement. I suppose if a child says "if you send me to school, I will run away!" they don't have to go there either, or does this fictitous law only apply to noncustodial parents????

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TO COURT CLERK:
ANYONE IS CAPABLE OF MAKING A CHILD, IT DOESN'T MEAN THEY SHOULD RAISE ONE

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And if you spend a little time trying to figure that out before you cock your legs open, then maybe y'all wouldn't have all these problems. Being a little selective with your genitals goes a long way.

Thought of something else...

What proof do you have of these incidents happening outside of your son's statement?