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Caught Shoplifting at Target, Under $200

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  • 02-23-2009, 08:36 PM
    lespaul1214
    Caught Shoplifting at Target, Under $200
    My question involves criminal law for the state of: New Jersey


    In late January, I was caught shoplifting at Target. I'm 18 and it's my first offense ever. The value of the stuff I was trying to steal was $197.7 -- 3 cents away from the felony, as four police officers informed me.


    If you're not interested in the details of my apprehension (I don't know whether or not they're important), then just skip this next part.


    I had a big Target bag in my pocket when I entered the store, I picked up the stuff I wanted to steal, found a deserted aisle and put the things in the bag there. Then I walked out. The moment I stepped outside the store's doors, two security guards grabbed me and pretty much dragged me to some windowless room. When they brought me in, another Target employee said something along the lines of "oh, nice you got him." Him, as though they had known me...turns out they also had me on camera stealing a $150 keyboard.

    They sent me over to some bench and asked me for my license (well, sort of demanded it...I didn't object, I turned it over immediately) and while they were copying that, they had me speak over the phone with someone else. They asked me a bunch of questions, I think trying to figure out if I do this regularly (I don't), and then I went back to the bench. During the hour or so I was there, four police officers came in. One of them searched my pockets; that wasn't an issue since I didn't have anything illegal on me.

    They spent a lot of time cracking jokes -- one officer told me that I'm "a ****ing dummy" (I agreed with him; I am), and they joked about accusing me of stealing the pack of gum I had in my pocket -- if that [i]was[i] stolen, it would've pushed me over $200 and I'd be looking at a felony.

    I don't think it counts as me being arrested, since nobody ever said "you are under arrest" or "you have the right to..." or any of that other stuff.

    Then they just suddenly let me go, and told me to bring back the keyboard from before or they'd add it to my charges. Naturally, I brought it back.




    Around 2/4, I got a notice demanding $150 civil penalty. I haven't paid it yet, and from what I've read on the interent, I shouldn't. Apparently, if I don't pay it, then I can try to strike a deal with Target in which they recommend the charges be dropped and I pay them the $150.

    I have yet to receive a summons, a month after the incident.

    Does anybody have any other advice? I'm a senior in high school, headed to college next year, and I really just want all of this to go away. Thank God I had under $200 in merchandise, I can't even imagine what I'd do if I had been actually arrested for a felony.

    Thanks
  • 02-23-2009, 08:58 PM
    cyjeff
    Re: Caught Shoplifting at Target, Under $200
    You do not have a bargaining position.

    They do not have to negotiate bringing criminal charges against you.

    Pay the civil demand or they will take you to court where, once fees and court costs are added, you will end up paying triple that amount... EASILY.

    Paying the civil demand does not mean you cannot be charged criminally. The store does not press charges. The DA does. The store is a witness.
  • 02-23-2009, 09:07 PM
    lespaul1214
    Re: Caught Shoplifting at Target, Under $200
    Well, that advice came from two lawyers (even though it was on the internet), and I think it's probably not a bad idea. The crime was committed against Target, they're the ones filing the complaint, and I think that if they recommend that a misdemeanor be dismissed, a busy court with much better things to deal with will probably listen.

    And I realize that they could take me to court...but do you really think they would? They made $2.85 billion last year. $150 is hardly worth their time.

    I probably will just pay that eventually, but whether it's on their first, second, or third notice doesn't really matter to me.
  • 02-23-2009, 09:13 PM
    cyjeff
    Re: Caught Shoplifting at Target, Under $200
    Quote:

    Quoting lespaul1214
    View Post
    Well, that advice came from two lawyers (even though it was on the internet), and I think it's probably not a bad idea. The crime was committed against Target, they're the ones filing the complaint, and I think that if they recommend that a misdemeanor be dismissed, a busy court with much better things to deal with will probably listen.

    And I realize that they could take me to court...but do you really think they would? They made $2.85 billion last year. $150 is hardly worth their time.

    I probably will just pay that eventually, but whether it's on their first, second, or third notice doesn't really matter to me.

    Fine.

    Don't pay it.

    Good luck.
  • 02-24-2009, 04:50 AM
    BOR
    Re: Caught Shoplifting at Target, Under $200
    Quote:

    Quoting lespaul1214
    View Post
    Well, that advice came from two lawyers (even though it was on the internet), and I think it's probably not a bad idea. The crime was committed against Target, they're the ones filing the complaint, and I think that if they recommend that a misdemeanor be dismissed, a busy court with much better things to deal with will probably listen.

    And I realize that they could take me to court...but do you really think they would? They made $2.85 billion last year. $150 is hardly worth their time.

    I probably will just pay that eventually, but whether it's on their first, second, or third notice doesn't really matter to me.


    PAY the CIVIL fine, if you are guilty. If you do not, you risk being sued civily and adding the costs and fees to the judgment against you AND bypassing the reason for non criminal involvement, a civil fine.

    Unless Target files a "criminal" complaint, the state has no probable cause to arrest/cite as the crime was not witnessed by the state, by and through any agent/police officer. I am talking about a theft charge here.

    Sure, other crimes, the state can be a complainant even IF the actual victim does not wish to press charges, such as domestic violence.

    "Technically" yes, they can, as the civil demand denotes an actual theft, the state can commence a criminal prosecution on that basis. However, without Target as an actual complainant, highly unlikely.
  • 02-24-2009, 02:41 PM
    lespaul1214
    Re: Caught Shoplifting at Target, Under $200
    Okay, besides the civil suit risks of not paying (which I'm well aware of), do you think there's any other reason for me to pay it?

    Target's policy (at least according to their loss prevention manual from 2006) is to file the criminal complaint for anything over $200. Although the $150 will release me of civil liability, it doesn't help much (well, at all) with the criminal issue.


    Basically, what I'm wondering is what you think about the idea of me saying to Target, "let's make a deal. You forget about the criminal complaint, and I'll give you the $150 nicely and save us both a lot of trouble."

    Yes, Target ABSOLUTELY can sue me for the $150 and for their costs, but does anybody think they really want to? They have way beter things to deal with, like people who sue them.



    Now, assuming that doesn't work out (because I'd be counting on a lot of luck with that), what would you recommend for court, and what do you think is likely to happen? And I mean LIKELY to happen, not worst case scenario -- yes, a misdemeanor can carry up to 6 months or a year or whatever, but that's not going to happen to a kid heading off to college in the fall on his first offense; that's really just written into the law for people who plea down from felonies, misdemeanor drunk driving, etc..

    I know how all this municipal court stuff works, I'm always polite, dress nicely, etc. (I've argued a few tickets before).

    I'm expecting a fine, or maybe probation at the worst...but does anybody know what usually happens with this kind of stuff? And is it worth it to speak with the public defender? There's no way I'm paying for a lawyer over this (I have noooo money), but I'd certainly take one for free if it's worth it.
  • 02-24-2009, 04:52 PM
    Security Consultant
    Re: Caught Shoplifting at Target, Under $200
    [QUOTE=lespaul1214;291591]

    Yes, Target ABSOLUTELY can sue me for the $150 and for their costs, but does anybody think they really want to? They have way beter things to deal with, like people who sue them. QUOTE]

    Actually they have a whole separate department that does nothing but collect civil demands.

    Look again at your 2006 Target document the amount is $20.00 not $200.00.
  • 02-26-2009, 12:38 PM
    dagreat1
    Re: Caught Shoplifting at Target, Under $200
    geeez why people steal out of target with the types of cameras and LP system they have is strictly beyond me
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