Third Degree Shoplifting

My question involves criminal law for the state of: New Jersey.

My girlfriend is 20 and being charged with third degree shoplifting in new jersey, the amount is just over 500 dollars. This is the first time she has ever gotten into trouble,She's on the Dean's list at our college, all her teachers and colleagues have good things to say about her. For all intents and purposes she's a good kid. Security got her outside of the mall and asked her to step to the side. When they brought her in the office they took what she had taken and wrung it up out of her presence, the number they came up with is 534 dollars exactly. It was a few purses and about 10 pieces of off the rack jewelry, we're both trying to figure out how that came to over 500 dollars. That must explain why everything at JC Pennies is always on sale.

She works at the portrait studio there, the security officer knows that. They brought out a bunch of tapes, none of which they showed her, and said they had been watching her for a while to see if she has any accomplices, I think thats bs. They told her she had to write a statement saying how long she had been stealing and how much. She was crying by now, thinking she was going to give her sick mom a heart attack and kill her, and the guy told her she had to compose herself and write his statement. Then when she went to write she thought she had taken 2000 dollars worth he told her to think hard that the number was higher than that to guess and she wrote down 8500. He never told her she didn't have to write the statement, or that she could call her lawyer.

She was then arrested and is now being charged with the third degree shoplifting, the amount is 500 dollars not 8500.

I'm wondering what JC Penny may want to do with her statement, and if a lawyer can get it thrown out if they tried to do something with it. It sounded like she was coerced and when your scared and crying thats not that easy to do. I also want to get an idea of what the punishment may be. We're hoping they'll bring the charge down so she won't have a felony on her record. We're hoping for a fine and community service. What are the odds? I know the dollar amount was a lot but she's a good girl with a future ahead of her, the judge and prosecutor will take that into consideration right?

We're getting a lawyer tomorrow.

She needs a lawyer.

She has apparently been stealing for a while, so she may be facing multiple charges and/or felonies.

The store has a year to press criminal charges.

By the way, every shoplifter is a "good person" right up to the time they decide to commit several instances of felony theft.

She will also be receiving a civil demand in the mail. It may be for the $8500.

It is perfectly legal to ask an adult to fill out a form. It is also perfectly legal for the adult to refuse. Just because your girlfriend shouldn't have said anything doesn't make the fact that she did illegal.

I bring up her standing in the college, first time offense, etc because of whatever bearing it might have on her case. Thats what i want to know about. What she did was wrong, I'm not going to argue that what she did was right, but I'm concerned with how this will affect her future. Should she pay restitutions yes, but should her life be ruined, people don't like to hire felons, over this stupid stupid mistake, no. And she hasn't stolen 8500 dollars worth of crap from JC Penny. Maybe a few things here or there, but not that much. As far as the statement shouldn't the fact that she was under duress, Loss Preventions coercion, and possible lie(about the tapes) have any bearing on whether or not she's responsible for the 8500 dollars? Shouldn't they be responsible to let her know that she doesn't have to write the statement? Police are required to read someone their rights when taking them into custody, if Security personnel are given police powers should they not be held under the same standard as police officers when handling suspects?

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Quoting tonytocayjuega

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I bring up her standing in the college, first time offense, etc because of whatever bearing it might have on her case.

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Some... not much.

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Thats what i want to know about. What she did was wrong, I'm not going to argue that what she did was right, but I'm concerned with how this will affect her future.

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This has the potential to effect her future in a multitude of ways. For instance, she will never work in retail or for a retailer again.

If convicted, she will be a felon. Depending on the circumstances, this may mean she cannot vote, own a weapon or have one of a specific set of licenses (nursing, etc.)

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Should she pay restitutions yes, but should her life be ruined, people don't like to hire felons, over this stupid stupid mistake, no.

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It wasn't a single mistake. She stole several times over a long period of time.

A mistake would be accidentally not giving back enough change. Your girlfriend routinely stole from her employer.

You make it sound like she tripped and, when she stood up, found her employer's merchandise in her pocket.

This is a crime of moral turpitude... especially given the number of times it was committed. Any thinking employer will wonder how long it will be before she starts stealing from THEM. Then, all the other applicants start to look a lot better.

The time to think about the effects of a felony on your record is BEFORE you commit it.

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And she hasn't stolen 8500 dollars worth of crap from JC Penny. Maybe a few things here or there, but not that much.

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Then she shouldn't have admitted to $8,500. The judge now has HER confession as to the amount.

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As far as the statement shouldn't the fact that she was under duress, Loss Preventions coercion, and possible lie(about the tapes) have any bearing on whether or not she's responsible for the 8500 dollars?

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No.

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Shouldn't they be responsible to let her know that she doesn't have to write the statement?

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No.

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Police are required to read someone their rights when taking them into custody, if Security personnel are given police powers should they not be held under the same standard as police officers when handling suspects?

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Nope. Security personnel are not police... they are not bound by the same set of laws.

"Police are required to read someone their rights when taking them into custody, if Security personnel are given police powers should they not be held under the same standard as police officers when handling suspects?" - tonytocayjuega.

Police are not required to "read someone their rights" when they take someone into custody. You probably watch too many cop shows.

"The Miranda warning is only in effect during a "custodial interrogation." This means that the person being questioned is in custody or in an environment in which the person does not believe that he is free to leave."

Would this not count when brought into a security office? Also, I know security guards are not the same as cops and are not held to the same standard but if they are given police powers, ability to make arrests, etc, which in New Jersey i believe they are able to do, shouldn't they have to follow some of the guidelines?

Some bearing? So your saying she has the chance of going to jail over a first offense? Especially when she has no record of committing any crimes in the past?

It wasn't routinely, she did it a few times. Again I'm not saying she was right, or that she didn't do anything wrong. It still was a mistake. I think your oversimplifying the situation. Of course it was a mistake, not an oops mistake but there is more than one kind of mistake. And for the sake of accuracy, i don't know if this matters, she works for a photo studio that is within JC Pennies. The company she works for rents the space from JC Penny, they're not owned by Pennies.

Is the statement really that concrete? When she wrote 2000 the security guard told her "do you really expect me to believe that? Think hard it's more than that." That doesn't matter? Again they're charging her for 534. not 8500 so that leads me to believe that they're not bringing that statement in on this case.

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Quoting tonytocayjuega

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"The Miranda warning is only in effect during a "custodial interrogation." This means that the person being questioned is in custody or in an environment in which the person does not believe that he is free to leave."

Would this not count when brought into a security office? Also, I know security guards are not the same as cops and are not held to the same standard but if they are given police powers, ability to make arrests, etc, which in New Jersey i believe they are able to do, shouldn't they have to follow some of the guidelines?

Some bearing? So your saying she has the chance of going to jail over a first offense? Especially when she has no record of committing any crimes in the past?

It wasn't routinely, she did it a few times. Again I'm not saying she was right, or that she didn't do anything wrong. It still was a mistake. I think your oversimplifying the situation. Of course it was a mistake, not an oops mistake but there is more than one kind of mistake. And for the sake of accuracy, i don't know if this matters, she works for a photo studio that is within JC Pennies. The company she works for rents the space from JC Penny, they're not owned by Pennies.

Is the statement really that concrete? When she wrote 2000 the security guard told her "do you really expect me to believe that? Think hard it's more than that." That doesn't matter? Again they're charging her for 534. not 8500 so that leads me to believe that they're not bringing that statement in on this case.

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How do you have any idea how much she has taken? Have you been there with her. If she stole close to $500 at one time she has been doing this often and for awhile. You do not start out on $500. She can fight the amount and go to court. The LP will show what they can prove and the judge will decide what amount is just in this case. Good luck

Because i actually trust her. I know she's done this from time to time. Mostly it would be a pair of earings or a shirt or something like that. I've fought with her about it from time to time but it wasn't an ongoing thing, it's happened just a few times. She's never taken this much before. She was greedy, why I don't know. Honestly she's never done anything like this before, nothing this big. She didn't walk out with a toaster or anything, it was three bags(not designer bags. The stupid big fabric ones with things like snoopy on them) and less than a dozen pieces of jewelry. The jewelry is off the rack and i know it's cheap because I've brought some pieces for her before and i don't think I've ever seen one for more than 15 dollars. She's not into gold and expensive things. Thank you for the luck. I'm mostly concerned with Jail time and her record. I doubt they'd put her in jail. Her record,however, is what I'm concerned with most. And i know it sounds like I'm trying to make excuses for her, and maybe i am. But at the same time i think the punishment should fit the crime. Her life isn't worth a few hundred dollars worth of merchandise. And in case my idea of honesty is called into question i once went back to a store to pay for a brownie because i forgot if i did or didn't pay for it. I was in the fourth grade and thats the closest I've gotten to stealing.

I've been reading around and have come upon something called PTI, Pre-Trial Intervention Program. Can anybody tell me anything about this, I'm reading up on it but if someone has any knowledge of it that they think might be useful then I'd like to hear about it. So far it seems like she fits the criteria based on what http://www.judiciary.state.nj.us/criminal/crpti.htm has to say.

What constitutes planning? If she was there and did it on a whim is that the same thing?