Was What Happened to Me Legal?

Security Consultant stated the law as it applies to this case. A perfectly fair response to the question, "Why didn't you show them the receipt" is, "Because I didn't want to." The law in this person's state doesn't require anything more.

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Quoting Scruit

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The consitution doesn't govern the behaviour of companies. Even if it did, asking you to show them the piece of paper that you were given by the checkout 50 feet away is not unreasonable.

Really? Then how come they get sued for discrimination? Or get sued for keeping people from practicing their religion?

You didn't say anythign about them trying to search you. If you want the us a cop analogy then the receipt is like your license plate. If you refuse to show your plate then the police will think you are breaking the law.

They wanted to stop me to look at my papers and look through my property. That's not a search? You do realize that failure to display your plate IS BREAKING THE LAW, right? A better analogy would be if the police stopped you walking down the street and demanded to see your ID. You are under no obligation to show it to them.

I know you don't like it, but the fact remains that I believe an objective view of the facts presented must conclude that the LP has every reason to suspect that you had stolen the contents of the cart, and that you created (and certainly prolonged) the confrontation.

The receipt checker was checking everyone's receipt. Is it reasonable to assume that ALL customers are shoplifting? Is that the new standard? Since you shop at a store, that is reasonable suspicion that you are a shoplifter?

It would also be unreasonable totell walmart that they cannot detain people they suspect of theft. You said yourself your path tot he door was not directly from the checkout (which would not have raised suspicions) but instead could easily have appeared to be an attempt to bypass the registers.

It is not unreasonable for them to detain a suspected shoplifter. The question is, is it reasonable to suspect a customer of shoplifting for declining to show a receipt? Further, the receipt checker had no idea what my path was. It was not visible to him. Also, I was not singled out. Every customer exiting the store was asked to show a receipt. Again, is simply shopping at a store reasonable suspicion that you are a shoplifter?

Your state may consider the employee grabbing your arm to be a crime - the police will asnwer that question for you if you call them to make a report. Otherwise, live and learn. If they have a policy of seeing a receipt when you exit the store apparently bypassing the checkouts, then don't go back there unless you;re willing to show your receipt.


I called the police and filed a report. They won't get involved in something like that unless there were serious injuries.

Suggesting I just shop somewhere else doesn't address the key issue. What if ALL store institute this policy? What would my option be? Also, as I asked earlier, would you say the same if the store only stopped hispanic shoppers? Should they just shop somewhere else?

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See my text in red.

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Quoting ragedracer

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So, I guess then, retailer policy trumps your rights as a citizen?

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Your rights as a citizen never come into play here. It's private property, they get to set their own rules.

Look, sweetie, they were asses and grabbing you was out of line. I'm not arguing that.

But seriously? If they're going to treat you like a criminal, vote with your wallet like everyone else with sense does, instead of yelling at a bunch of strangers for not being quite as outraged about it as you are.

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Quoting LawResearcherMissy

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Your rights as a citizen never come into play here. It's private property, they get to set their own rules.

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Sorry sweetie. Not true.

If that were the case, and I owned a store, would it be OK for me to refuse non-whites entry?

rr

I agree on "voting with your wallet", but private property or no they are not within their rights to detain a customer with a demand to see a receipt "just because they want to". In Arizona, they need reasonable cause of shoplifting to detain somebody, and detaining somebody in order to seek out cause turns that on its head.

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Quoting ragedracer

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If that were the case, and I owned a store, would it be OK for me to refuse non-whites entry?

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That's a different issue. They can ban you (or anybody else) for arguing with them, because they think you're ugly, or because they don't like the car you drive, without implicating civil rights laws.

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Quoting aaron

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That's a different issue. They can ban you (or anybody else) for arguing with them, because they think you're ugly, or because they don't like the car you drive, without implicating civil rights laws.

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And I agree 100%. The other posters are arguing that your constitutional rights become void once you enter private property.

rr

Bottom line is this.

Possible Criminal charges, Assualt on the person that physically grabbed you.

Possible Law Suit for Civil Rights Violation.

Sitting here debating what happened is really not going to get nothing done. If you feel you wrongfully treated and that a law was broken. Then take action and fight it out in the Court Room. You can supena the video tape from the security cameras for your evidence. You really can't find the witnesses that were standing around watching what was happening though. Because you did not get there names or contact info. Although you might be able to supena the credit card receipts so you can try to contact the shoppers that were there at the same time this happened. So you can question them if they seen anything.


I am a LEO and I have shopped at walmart off duty in uniform. I had my receipt checked upon leaving. Is it in violation of my civil rights, maybe it is maybe it isn't. If they are not signalling out one specific race, gender, age group, other classification, then I don't see how it is. If they are checking everyone walking out of the store then I really can not see how it is in violation of your civil rights. Being everything in the cart was in plain view site. They ask to see your receipt to compare with the contents in your cart. If you refuse to show the receipt, then they may hold you and wait for a manager.

But you kept trying to elude or flee from the store. Which could have given them reason to believe you were trying to steal something.

I know that if you have a cart full of items you will always be stopped by the greeter. In my honest opinion I think it is a joke. they look at the receipt then they look at the cart and let you go on your marry way. They don't inventory your cart to compare it to the receipt.

Now your rights are not void once you go on private property. If that was the case then we would be living just like before the civil rights movement. Also most of our US history would not have happened yet.

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Really? Then how come they get sued for discrimination? Or get sued for keeping people from practicing their religion?

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They get sued for a violation of something like Title VII of the Civil Rights Act (1964). NOT for 'violating the constitution.' How about you stand on Walmart property and start protesting - you'll find out VERY quickly if they will honor your freedom of speech.

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They wanted to stop me to look at my papers and look through my property. That's not a search?

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I didn't say they didn't try to search you - I said you didn't say anything about a search. I checked again, the word 'search' does not appear in your post.

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The receipt checker was checking everyone's receipt. Is it reasonable to assume that ALL customers are shoplifting?

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It IS reasonable to assume that anyone wheeling a cartful of stuff out the door with no receipt is probably shoplifting.

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The question is, is it reasonable to suspect a customer of shoplifting for declining to show a receipt?

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It's reasonable to suspect that someone declining to show a receipt (or saying they threw it away already) is a cover for someone who never had a receipt in the first place. I'll bet money that almost exclusively people who ARE shoplifting a cartful of merchandise whoe ARE asked fro their receipt will come up with some excuse to not give it up - they won't say; "Oh, right, my bad, I stile all this stuff." Criminals lie to avoid being caught, and your behaviour pattern was suspicious, and you refusal to show the receipt is something the LP folks have likely heard before - from shoplifters.

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Suggesting I just shop somewhere else doesn't address the key issue. What if ALL store institute this policy? What would my option be?

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If you don't like it then write your congressperson and ask for a law banning the practice.

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Quoting Scruit

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It IS reasonable to assume that anyone wheeling a cartful of stuff out the door with no receipt is probably shoplifting.

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Again, that's not what happened. This person had a receipt. They were not stopped for shoplifting, or because they didn't have a receipt - from what has been shared, they were stopped because they exercised their legal right to leave the store without complying with an arbitrary demand to present their receipt.

In case you weren't paying attention, in the state at issue, the store's conduct as described is not legal. You don't need a law outlawing something that is not legal.