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Total Move in Fees and Amenities

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  • 05-07-2020, 07:25 AM
    rjlocal22
    Total Move in Fees and Amenities
    My question involves landlord-tenant law in the State of: Pennsylvania.

    Are landlords required to divulge all fees in their advertizing for rent? Two days ago, I visited a sample apartment and liked it. When I asked him about all the fees that
    I would have to pay to move in, he stated that all that information is listed in the brochure he provided.
    When I arrived home, I checked the brochure and none of the important fees were listed. So I sent an email asking for this information and he had two days to respond and has not. In other words, it's best to get things in writing before any application or lease signing.
    In another instance, a different landlord wanted me sign and pay for an application before showing me a vacant apartment.
  • 05-07-2020, 07:47 AM
    adjusterjack
    Re: Total Move in Fees and Amenities
    Quote:

    Quoting rjlocal22
    View Post

    Are landlords required to divulge all fees in their advertising for rent?

    Wouldn't surprise me if the answer is no. But you can check with your state's consumer affairs agency.

    Quote:

    Quoting rjlocal22
    View Post
    In other words, it's best to get things in writing before any application or lease signing.
    In another instance, a different landlord wanted me sign and pay for an application before showing me a vacant apartment.

    Appears that you are smart enough to avoid the scams.

    Keep up the good work. Question everything. Get everything in writing. Never put up a nickel until you are shown an apartment that's turnkey and is the one that you will be renting. Also make sure you thoroughly inspect everything on day one and photograph it up one side and down the other.

    Another thing that might help you is that there are websites where you can look up the name of the apartment complex and read reviews.

    https://duckduckgo.com/?q=pennsylvan...ws&t=h_&ia=web
  • 05-07-2020, 09:21 AM
    pg1067
    Re: Total Move in Fees and Amenities
    Quote:

    Quoting rjlocal22
    View Post
    So I sent an email asking for this information and he had two days to respond and has not.

    Well...what was the point of saying that "he had two days to respond" if you're not going to walk away because of his failure to respond in that time? If you're not going to walk away, then you shouldn't give hard deadlines.

    Beyond that, I don't really understand what you're asking. If you're asking whether you're entitled to specific details about advertising costs, the answer is no. If you're asking whether the landlord is required to disclose exactly how much of a check you'll have to write to move in, that's up to you. If you haven't signed a lease, then you're free to walk away if you don't get the disclosure you want. If you have already signed a lease, then you're only obligated to pay whether it says in the lease.
  • 05-07-2020, 09:41 AM
    rjlocal22
    Re: Total Move in Fees and Amenities
    Quote:

    Quoting pg1067
    View Post
    Well...what was the point of saying that "he had two days to respond" if you're not going to walk away because of his failure to respond in that time? If you're not going to walk away, then you shouldn't give hard deadlines.

    Beyond that, I don't really understand what you're asking. If you're asking whether you're entitled to specific details about advertising costs, the answer is no. If you're asking whether the landlord is required to disclose exactly how much of a check you'll have to write to move in, that's up to you. If you haven't signed a lease, then you're free to walk away if you don't get the disclosure you want. If you have already signed a lease, then you're only obligated to pay whether it says in the lease.

    The subject of my post says it all. I did not give him two days to reply. You misinterpreted. It's been two days since I requested the information. No body I know will rent an apartment without getting everything in writing such as: Rent, Security, one time fee for a pet, recurring monthly fee for a pet, utilities cost and administration fee etc etc.
  • 05-07-2020, 10:10 AM
    PayrolGuy
    Re: Total Move in Fees and Amenities
    Quote:

    Quoting rjlocal22
    View Post
    The subject of my post says it all. I did not give him two days to reply. You misinterpreted. It's been two days since I requested the information. No body I know will rent an apartment without getting everything in writing such as: Rent, Security, one time fee for a pet, recurring monthly fee for a pet, utilities cost and administration fee etc etc.

    Words mean things. "he had two days to respond" implied that there was some limiting factor on his time to reply. If you had written, "he has had two days to respond" would mean that he hasn't replied in two days.

    You are correct that one should have all of those things in writing before they agree to a lease or even an application if there is an application fee.

    The document that would need to have those fees spelled out is called a lease which you don't have to sign until you agree with all of that and more spelled out.
  • 05-07-2020, 11:29 AM
    rjlocal22
    Re: Total Move in Fees and Amenities
    I am willing to bet that before one see's a lease then one has to sign an application first and pay the cost ($35.00 to $50.00). So if one does not like the lease , then he lose's his application fee if he does not sign it. The only way an application fee is refunded is when one fails the application process.
    I suppose I may have to ignore all who do not place all their requirements online and concentrate on those who do.
  • 05-07-2020, 11:54 AM
    adjusterjack
    Re: Total Move in Fees and Amenities
    Quote:

    Quoting rjlocal22
    View Post
    I am willing to bet that before one see's a lease then one has to sign an application first and pay the cost ($35.00 to $50.00). So if one does not like the lease , then he lose's his application fee if he does not sign it. The only way an application fee is refunded is when one fails the application process.


    No reason you can't ask for (or demand) a copy of the lease to review before you hand over the application fee. And walk away if you don't get it.

    If you want to get ahead of the game you can download Pennsylvania residential lease forms from the internet and get a preliminary idea of what you might be getting into.

    https://duckduckgo.com/?q=pennsylvan...rm&t=h_&ia=web

    The one from the Landlord Association is probably as comprehensive as any lease you'll see out there.

    https://www.landlordassocpa.com/Memb...0Agreement.pdf

    Quote:

    Quoting rjlocal22
    View Post
    I suppose I may have to ignore all who do not place all their requirements online and concentrate on those who do.

    You'll be passing up a lot of nice places if you do that.

    Back in the Stone Age when we old folks didn't have the advantage of the internet, apartment complexes ran small ads in the newspaper with very little information and we had to go there to have a look and talk to the management.

    Is this going to be your first apartment?
  • 05-07-2020, 12:32 PM
    rjlocal22
    Re: Total Move in Fees and Amenities
    This will be my second apartment. About 80% of the apartments say online that they do not accept dogs. But some of them do not update their websites and may have changed their policy. I have a list of 6 apartments that I should phone them for an update.
  • 05-07-2020, 12:38 PM
    pg1067
    Re: Total Move in Fees and Amenities
    Quote:

    Quoting rjlocal22
    View Post
    The subject of my post says it all. I did not give him two days to reply. You misinterpreted. It's been two days since I requested the information. No body I know will rent an apartment without getting everything in writing such as: Rent, Security, one time fee for a pet, recurring monthly fee for a pet, utilities cost and administration fee etc etc.

    Ok, so at this point, I'm hard pressed to see any legal issue here. If you haven't signed a lease and want certain info before signing, then you either get the info and sign or don't sign based on that info, or you don't get the info and don't sign or sign anyway. Regardless, none of this appears to implicate any legal issue.
  • 06-02-2020, 01:44 PM
    rjlocal22
    Re: Total Move in Fees and Amenities
    I have one more question:

    Is it legal for a lease manager in Pennsylvania to deny me an inspection of a vacant apartment except on day of move in?

    Below are his exact words:

    "Additionally our units aren't available for inspection until the day you move because either the tenant is still in the unit or we are rehabbing the unit".
  • 06-02-2020, 01:45 PM
    PayrolGuy
    Re: Total Move in Fees and Amenities
    Quote:

    Quoting rjlocal22
    View Post
    I have one more question:

    Is it legal for a lease manager in Pennsylvania to deny me an inspection of a vacant apartment except on day of move in?

    Below are his exact words:

    "Additionally our units aren't available for inspection until the day you move because either the tenant is still in the unit or we are rehabbing the unit".

    Yes, it is legal.

    It is also legal for you to tell the manager to stuff it and go find another apartment.
  • 06-02-2020, 03:14 PM
    pg1067
    Re: Total Move in Fees and Amenities
    Quote:

    Quoting rjlocal22
    View Post
    Is it legal for a lease manager in Pennsylvania to deny me an inspection of a vacant apartment except on day of move in?

    Yes.
  • 06-02-2020, 03:40 PM
    rjlocal22
    Re: Total Move in Fees and Amenities
    Thanks,
    Before I write him off in about two weeks, I'll call and ask if there are any vacancies. Then ask if I can inspect them. if not, I'll place one star on the reviews.
    Some Landlords or their managers think they hold all the cards.
  • 06-02-2020, 03:50 PM
    PayrolGuy
    Re: Total Move in Fees and Amenities
    Quote:

    Quoting rjlocal22
    View Post
    Thanks,
    Before I write him off in about two weeks, I'll call and ask if there are any vacancies. Then ask if I can inspect them. if not, I'll place one star on the reviews.
    Some Landlords or their managers think they hold all the cards.

    Why would you give him one star? They have told you beforehand that they don't do pre-inspections. It isn't illegal and is their right. Just move on with your life.
  • 06-02-2020, 04:02 PM
    llworking
    Re: Total Move in Fees and Amenities
    Quote:

    Quoting rjlocal22
    View Post
    I have one more question:

    Is it legal for a lease manager in Pennsylvania to deny me an inspection of a vacant apartment except on day of move in?

    Below are his exact words:

    "Additionally our units aren't available for inspection until the day you move because either the tenant is still in the unit or we are rehabbing the unit".

    By inspection, are we talking about listing any potential damages etc, or are we talking about you getting to see the unit at all? In any case, don't sign the lease unless you at least get to see the unit first.
  • 06-02-2020, 05:36 PM
    Harold99
    Re: Total Move in Fees and Amenities
    Quote:

    Quoting PayrolGuy
    View Post
    Why would you give him one star? They have told you beforehand that they don't do pre-inspections. It isn't illegal and is their right. Just move on with your life.

    People can be dicks and not break the law, which we can and should write reviews to expose.

    General respect and a good business ethic is rarely dictated by the law.
  • 06-02-2020, 05:57 PM
    rjlocal22
    Re: Total Move in Fees and Amenities
    Quote:

    Quoting PayrolGuy
    View Post
    Why would you give him one star? They have told you beforehand that they don't do pre-inspections. It isn't illegal and is their right. Just move on with your life.

    That puts the potential renter at a disadvantage. The manager will ask for his fee for doing a credit and background check; usually about $50.00 and you still not see the apartment. So if he wants to run a scam and tells you that you failed the income test ( that has already happen at another complex ). I guess its my fault I been on pension for 25 years and social security for 18 years and not receiving a COLA from my employer. My gross income is $36,000 per year and the rental fees are about $1135 to $1200 on average for a one bedroom apartment. One does not get the rejection from the landlord directly. It is passed on by the manager to you by phone call or email. So I do not know anyone willing to pay every manager $50.00 for a credit check. So If I cannot change his mind, then his complex deserves one star. He may have terms but renter's have terms also.
    One other thing, I sent him an email a week ago listing all the information and fees required and he has not answered yet.
  • 06-02-2020, 07:47 PM
    adjusterjack
    Re: Total Move in Fees and Amenities
    Quote:

    Quoting rjlocal22
    View Post
    So If I cannot change his mind, then his complex deserves one star. He may have terms but renter's have terms also.

    Agree. Shady tactics (legal or not) should be revealed.

    Quote:

    Quoting rjlocal22
    View Post

    One other thing, I sent him an email a week ago listing all the information and fees required and he has not answered yet.

    Of course not. He's got plenty of suckers that will do it his way.
  • 06-03-2020, 07:08 AM
    PayrolGuy
    Re: Total Move in Fees and Amenities
    Quote:

    Quoting rjlocal22
    View Post
    That puts the potential renter at a disadvantage. The manager will ask for his fee for doing a credit and background check; usually about $50.00 and you still not see the apartment. So if he wants to run a scam and tells you that you failed the income test ( that has already happen at another complex ). I guess its my fault I been on pension for 25 years and social security for 18 years and not receiving a COLA from my employer. My gross income is $36,000 per year and the rental fees are about $1135 to $1200 on average for a one bedroom apartment. One does not get the rejection from the landlord directly. It is passed on by the manager to you by phone call or email. So I do not know anyone willing to pay every manager $50.00 for a credit check. So If I cannot change his mind, then his complex deserves one star. He may have terms but renter's have terms also.
    One other thing, I sent him an email a week ago listing all the information and fees required and he has not answered yet.

    He didn't answer your request a week ago so I simply don't understand why you would continue to want to live there. Move on.
  • 06-03-2020, 03:01 PM
    rjlocal22
    Re: Total Move in Fees and Amenities
    He is not the only lease manager that has ignored email requests based on my experience. However I will give him another chance to comply with my requests. Most of the information found on websites regarding apartments come's up short and one has to pry this information out of them in person. Maybe the lease managers do it differently in other States.
    I have narrowed down my choice to just three apartments out of about a dozen. This is why I am giving him a second chance. If I do not find a vacancy in those three, then I will place all my property in storage and go homeless rather then pay a outragious increase in rent at my present location for a month to month lease.
    If I have to go homeless, the big benefit for me is I'll be able to pay down my credit card bill and pay it off in about 7 months or less.
  • 06-03-2020, 03:05 PM
    PayrolGuy
    Re: Total Move in Fees and Amenities
    It seems that you have no further questions that involve the law. I hope you have enjoyed your visits.
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