Is it Legal to Record Conversations Between a Parent and Child
My question involves child abuse or neglect in the State of: New Jersey
My soon to be ex-wife is emotionally abusive to me and my daughter and for evidence I have been recording conversations. I know NJ is a one-party consent state and I'm in the house for all of the recordings. Even if I'm not participating in the conversation, am I considered a party? I want to make sure what I'm doing is legal. In some conversations I am involved and talking so I would think I pass the "party in the conversation" test.
I plan to talk to a lawyer soon but if I should change how I'm recording for it to be a) legal and b) admissible in court I'd appreciate the help.
Re: Is it Legal to Record Conversations Between a Stepparent and Stepchild
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nj1234
My question involves child abuse or neglect in the State of: New Jersey
Even if I'm not participating in the conversation, am I considered a party? I want to make sure what I'm doing is legal.
If you are not participating in the conversation then you are not a party to that conversation. Recording those conversations are criminal violations of both NJ and federal law. Moreover, in NJ disclosure of an illegally made recording of a conversation is an additional offense. Illegal recordings are not admissible as evidence. I suggest you stop recording private conversations to which you are not a participant and do not have the explicit consent of the one participants to make the recording.
As to the admissibility of legally obtained recordings, that will depend on the content of the recording and whether the proper foundation can be laid to get it admitted.
Re: Is it Legal to Record Conversations Between a Stepparent and Stepchild
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Taxing Matters
If you are not participating in the conversation then you are not a party to that conversation. Recording those conversations are criminal violations of both NJ and federal law. Moreover, in NJ disclosure of an illegally made recording of a conversation is an additional offense. Illegal recordings are not admissible as evidence. I suggest you stop recording private conversations to which you are not a participant and do not have the explicit consent of the one participants to make the recording.
As to the admissibility of legally obtained recordings, that will depend on the content of the recording and whether the proper foundation can be laid to get it admitted.
Ok. Does me just merely talking establish participation or must there be active dialogue / acknowledgement between two or more people?
Re: Is it Legal to Record Conversations Between a Stepparent and Stepchild
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nj1234
Ok. Does me just merely talking establish participation or must there be active dialogue / acknowledgement between two or more people?
How are you talking but not actually a part of the conversation? Being a party to the conversation means you are one of the people participating in the conversation — i.e. you are part of the group having the conversation. If you are talking on the phone in the next room then you are not a party to the conversation. The situation has to be such that the typical person would consider you to be part of the conversation that is taking place. Trying to find some loophole to record a conversation between others that does not involve you could come back to bite you. You don’t want to try introducing a recording that turns out to be illegally recorded in court. Not only would the recording not be allowed as evidence, you’d risk criminal prosecution for having made the recordings. I think you know when you are included in a conversation and when you are not. If the others would not regard you as a participant in the conversation, you have a problem.
Re: Is it Legal to Record Conversations Between a Stepparent and Stepchild
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Taxing Matters
How are you talking but not actually a part of the conversation? Being a party to the conversation means you are one of the people participating in the conversation — i.e. you are part of the group having the conversation. If you are talking on the phone in the next room then you are not a party to the conversation. The situation has to be such that the typical person would consider you to be part of the conversation that is taking place. Trying to find some loophole to record a conversation between others that does not involve you could come back to bite you. You don’t want to try introducing a recording that turns out to be illegally recorded in court. Not only would the recording not be allowed as evidence, you’d risk criminal prosecution for having made the recordings. I think you know when you are included in a conversation and when you are not. If the others would not regard you as a participant in the conversation, you have a problem.
Totally understand on the severity. I read the news article on the Kentucky woman that was prosecuted with felony charges recording her care giver and special needs child. My situation is one where the initial abusive dialogue is between my wife and daughter, so my reaction is to engage in the conversation and record. But, for cases where I don't engage I can see where that won't make me a participant. Either way I'll consult my lawyer about admissibility. Thank you!
Re: Is it Legal to Record Conversations Between a Stepparent and Stepchild
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nj1234
Totally understand on the severity. I read the news article on the Kentucky woman that was prosecuted with felony charges recording her care giver and special needs child. My situation is one where the initial abusive dialogue is between my wife and daughter, so my reaction is to engage in the conversation and record. But, for cases where I don't engage I can see where that won't make me a participant. Either way I'll consult my lawyer about admissibility. Thank you!
If you enter the conversation after you are already recording to try and backdoor legality, you're going to have a bad time.
Re: Is it Legal to Record Conversations Between a Stepparent and Stepchild
To any conversation there are only ever two parties. If you are participating then you are participating at that moment by talking to one of the others. But you cannot record a conversation where two or more others than yourself are talking.
Re: Is it Legal to Record Conversations Between a Stepparent and Stepchild
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Ohiogal
To any conversation there are only ever two parties. If you are participating then you are participating at that moment by talking to one of the others. But you cannot record a conversation where two or more others than yourself are talking.
I disagree with that premise. A conversation certainly can include more than two people. Suppose Amy, Becky, and Carl are talking together about last week’s football game. While only one person is talking at a time, the other two are listening and participants to that conversation. i.e. there are three people to that conversation. So, under federal and NJ law, if Amy wanted to record that conversation, she could do so legally. And not just the parts of it in which she talks, as you seem to suggest. If I understand correctly what you are saying, I find it very bizarre.
Re: Is it Legal to Record Conversations Between a Stepparent and Stepchild
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Taxing Matters
I disagree with that premise. A conversation certainly can include more than two people. Suppose Amy, Becky, and Carl are talking together about last week’s football game. While only one person is talking at a time, the other two are listening and participants to that conversation. i.e. there are three people to that conversation. So, under federal and NJ law, if Amy wanted to record that conversation, she could do so legally. And not just the parts of it in which she talks, as you seem to suggest. If I understand correctly what you are saying, I find it very bizarre.
Communication is between two people at any one time. That is fact. You can disagree with that premise but you would be incorrect. I say this as someone with a Communication degree as well as a law degree.
Re: Is it Legal to Record Conversations Between a Stepparent and Stepchild
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Ohiogal
Communication is between two people at any one time. That is fact. You can disagree with that premise but you would be incorrect. I say this as someone with a Communication degree as well as a law degree.
So in my hypothetical, if Amy addresses a comment about the game to both Becky and Carl she is not communicating to both of them? If that is the case, with which one is she communicating? How would you, as a communication major, sort that out? If it is a “fact” (i.e. something you can test scientifically) that one can communicate with only one other person at any one time, please give me a citation with the proof of that. I did some Google searching and found plenty of references to communications involving more than two people but none, not one, that asserts that all communication is strictly limited to two people, and only two people. So forgive me, but I am not going to accept your word on this one just because you say you have a communication degree.
Let me at least give a citation to back up my view. The book Effective Business Communication breaks down communication into intrapersonal, interpersonal, group, public and mass communication. The latter three all involve communication involving three or more people. That discussion has citations to other authority for its definitions. You can read that here: http://open.lib.umn.edu/businesscommunication/chapter/1-3-communication-in-context/
So, do you disagree with that discussion? And if so, what authority do you rely upon that supports your view?
In any event, it is clear that the law allows Amy in my hypothetical to record the discussion among Amy, Becky, and Carl about the game and not just Amy’s own speech.