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New Neighbor is Blocking My Cat From Her Yard

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  • 11-04-2015, 06:37 PM
    delta_nine
    New Neighbor is Blocking My Cat From Her Yard
    My question involves real estate located in the State of: California

    My house backs up to a neighbor's backyard and we have a lattice fence at the end of my small deck for some privacy. The edge of the deck and lattice are about 6" within my property. The lattice has a small area cut into it that allows my cat to come and go. We had an oral agreement for the past 7 years with the owner of the property that my cat was allowed to enter her backyard.

    The original owner of the house has moved out and I don't know if she has sold or is renting the house. The house currently appears empty. Today I find that someone has sloppy nailed boards to my lattice and has blocked the hole for my cat to access.

    What are my rights in this situation?
  • 11-04-2015, 07:21 PM
    Mr. Knowitall
    Re: New Neighbor is Blocking My Cat From Her Yard
    Your former neighbor allowed your cat into her yard. Your new neighbor has revoked that permission and does not want your cat in her yard. You and your cat have no right to enter the yard without permission. However, your neighbor does not have the right to nail boards to your fence.
  • 11-05-2015, 12:10 PM
    eapls2708
    Re: New Neighbor is Blocking My Cat From Her Yard
    I agree with what Mr. Knowitall said with the possible exception of nailing boards to the fence.

    Your neighbor has the right to prevent your cat's access to his or her property. Since you describe it as being on your deck, I'm picturing that you are in a duplex, a townhouse, or in a subdivision where many of the homes and improvements, including your deck, are built at a zero setback (essentially on the property boundary). If your lattice fence is on or very close to the boundary line, it would likely be considered a boundary fence, very much like the wall within a duplex or townhouse that separates one residential unit from another under the same roof is a party wall. The hole in the fence was made specifically for that purpose, so it follows that the neighbor must specifically prevent access through that hole to keep your cat from entering.

    If that's the case, then the neighbor could attach some manner of material to the fence to block that hole, but it must be done in a manner that leaves it in a safe condition. Alternatively, and perhaps before blocking the hole in the manner done, your neighbor should have spoken to you and asked you to close up the hole. Presumably you made the hole for your cat, and so it was actually your responsibility to prevent the trespass.

    Either way, you've been put on notice that the permission for your cat to access your neighbor's yard has been rescinded or revoked. Ensuring that your cat does not enter that yard is a shared responsibility. Your neighbor has the responsibility to take reasonable steps to prevent people and animals from entering their yard, and you have the responsibility of taking reasonable steps to ensure that your neighbor's right to privacy and a cat poop free yard is respected in so much as you and your family and pets are concerned.
  • 11-05-2015, 12:23 PM
    adjusterjack
    Re: New Neighbor is Blocking My Cat From Her Yard
    Quote:

    Quoting delta_nine
    View Post
    Today I find that someone has sloppy nailed boards to my lattice and has blocked the hole for my cat to access.

    What are my rights in this situation?

    You have the right to replace the sloppy nailed boards with neatly nailed boards that please you.

    And keep your cat on your own property.
  • 11-05-2015, 02:40 PM
    delta_nine
    Re: New Neighbor is Blocking My Cat From Her Yard
    Thank you for your explanation. Yes, I live in a dense urban area and most of the houses are built with zero setback.

    Today I heard a bunch of banging outside and found my new neighbor had removed the boards and was installing a piece of metal grating onto my deck. I asked him to stop and why he thought that it was ok to do with without talking to me first. He really didn't have anything to say except that he didn't like looking at the hole. I asked him to stop, and remove the rest of the nails and left it at that. I'm not even sure he knows that I have a cat. In the backyard with him was a small dog and a ~3 year old so it's possible that he wanted to close up the hole to prevent them form coming onto my property.

    There are several other cats on the block that also have access to the backyards so I'm not sure how he plans on keeping them out



    Quote:

    Quoting eapls2708
    View Post
    I agree with what Mr. Knowitall said with the possible exception of nailing boards to the fence.

    Your neighbor has the right to prevent your cat's access to his or her property. Since you describe it as being on your deck, I'm picturing that you are in a duplex, a townhouse, or in a subdivision where many of the homes and improvements, including your deck, are built at a zero setback (essentially on the property boundary). If your lattice fence is on or very close to the boundary line, it would likely be considered a boundary fence, very much like the wall within a duplex or townhouse that separates one residential unit from another under the same roof is a party wall. The hole in the fence was made specifically for that purpose, so it follows that the neighbor must specifically prevent access through that hole to keep your cat from entering.

    If that's the case, then the neighbor could attach some manner of material to the fence to block that hole, but it must be done in a manner that leaves it in a safe condition. Alternatively, and perhaps before blocking the hole in the manner done, your neighbor should have spoken to you and asked you to close up the hole. Presumably you made the hole for your cat, and so it was actually your responsibility to prevent the trespass.

    Either way, you've been put on notice that the permission for your cat to access your neighbor's yard has been rescinded or revoked. Ensuring that your cat does not enter that yard is a shared responsibility. Your neighbor has the responsibility to take reasonable steps to prevent people and animals from entering their yard, and you have the responsibility of taking reasonable steps to ensure that your neighbor's right to privacy and a cat poop free yard is respected in so much as you and your family and pets are concerned.

  • 11-05-2015, 02:41 PM
    Mr. Knowitall
    Re: New Neighbor is Blocking My Cat From Her Yard
    Quote:

    Quoting eapls2708
    View Post
    If that's the case, then the neighbor could attach some manner of material to the fence to block that hole, but it must be done in a manner that leaves it in a safe condition.

    What authority can you present that would give anybody in any state the right to nail boards to somebody else's fence?

    What makes you believe that a person who erects a fence on their side of the property line has to make it cat-proof?
  • 11-05-2015, 02:52 PM
    adjusterjack
    Re: New Neighbor is Blocking My Cat From Her Yard
    Quote:

    Quoting Mr. Knowitall
    View Post

    What makes you believe that a person who erects a fence on their side of the property line has to make it cat-proof?

    They don't. Wouldn't do any good anyway. A cat can easily get over the top of a 6' fence or wall.

    What cat owners need to do is make their cat travel-proof so the cat doesn't get eliminated by a home owner who is tired of cleaning up cat poop and paw prints.
  • 11-05-2015, 02:58 PM
    llworking
    Re: New Neighbor is Blocking My Cat From Her Yard
    Quote:

    Quoting Mr. Knowitall
    View Post
    What authority can you present that would give anybody in any state the right to nail boards to somebody else's fence?

    What makes you believe that a person who erects a fence on their side of the property line has to make it cat-proof?

    Who believes that anyone, anywhere can stop a cat from going wherever the heck that cat wants to go? Seriously, unless a cat never goes outside, its not possible to fence a cat in or out.

    He has a dog...its highly unlikely that he will attempt to keep cats from entering his property, because they will naturally shy away from it because of the dog.

    I suspect that the OP is correct. That he wanted the hole closed to keep his dog and child in, not to keep her cat out.
  • 11-05-2015, 03:18 PM
    BooRennie
    Re: New Neighbor is Blocking My Cat From Her Yard
    Quote:

    Quoting llworking
    View Post
    Who believes that anyone, anywhere can stop a cat from going wherever the heck that cat wants to go? Seriously, unless a cat never goes outside, its not possible to fence a cat in or out.

    He has a dog...its highly unlikely that he will attempt to keep cats from entering his property, because they will naturally shy away from it because of the dog.

    I suspect that the OP is correct. That he wanted the hole closed to keep his dog and child in, not to keep her cat out.

    It's possible to keep a cat where you want it. A screened in porch comes to mind, if someone wants Kitty to get air/outside scents (or a fully-fenced [including top] chain-link dog run).
  • 11-05-2015, 05:02 PM
    llworking
    Re: New Neighbor is Blocking My Cat From Her Yard
    Quote:

    Quoting BooRennie
    View Post
    It's possible to keep a cat where you want it. A screened in porch comes to mind, if someone wants Kitty to get air/outside scents (or a fully-fenced [including top] chain-link dog run).

    My mom tried the screened in porch. The cats made their own cat door in the screen. I knew someone who tried the big cage bit, and the cat managed to unlatch it every time.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote:

    Quoting adjusterjack
    View Post
    They don't. Wouldn't do any good anyway. A cat can easily get over the top of a 6' fence or wall.

    What cat owners need to do is make their cat travel-proof so the cat doesn't get eliminated by a home owner who is tired of cleaning up cat poop and paw prints.

    Cats are different than dogs. They find a place where they can dig a hole and bury their poop. Therefore nothing to clean up...and honestly, on the rare occasions that they do not, I challenge anyone to actually find and identify any cat poop, even if they are looking. It wouldn't be any bigger than squirrel poop.

    Paw prints? That one is a valid gripe. However again, some of what people think are kitty paw prints are other critter paw prints.
  • 11-06-2015, 01:20 AM
    eapls2708
    Re: New Neighbor is Blocking My Cat From Her Yard
    Quote:

    Quoting Mr. Knowitall
    View Post
    What authority can you present that would give anybody in any state the right to nail boards to somebody else's fence?

    What makes you believe that a person who erects a fence on their side of the property line has to make it cat-proof?

    Civil Code §841
  • 11-06-2015, 01:58 AM
    Taxing Matters
    Re: New Neighbor is Blocking My Cat From Her Yard
    Quote:

    Quoting eapls2708
    View Post
    Civil Code §841

    And what exactly in § 841 do you think requires a person make the fence cat proof? Even if we assume this is a boundary fence, which seems contradicted by the facts shared, I see nothing in it that even seems to come close to that.
  • 11-06-2015, 05:00 AM
    flyingron
    Re: New Neighbor is Blocking My Cat From Her Yard
    Quote:

    Quoting Mr. Knowitall
    View Post
    What authority can you present that would give anybody in any state the right to nail boards to somebody else's fence?

    What makes you believe that a person who erects a fence on their side of the property line has to make it cat-proof?

    If it's a boundry fence, they may very well have rights to modify the fence (and perhaps even apportion part of the cost to the other owner).
  • 11-06-2015, 12:24 PM
    Mr. Knowitall
    Re: New Neighbor is Blocking My Cat From Her Yard
    Quote:

    Quoting flyingron
    View Post
    If it's a boundry fence, they may very well have rights to modify the fence (and perhaps even apportion part of the cost to the other owner).

    But it's not a boundary fence. It's the lattice at the end of a deck.
  • 11-06-2015, 12:55 PM
    delta_nine
    Re: New Neighbor is Blocking My Cat From Her Yard
    Thanks everybody - last night I covered up the hole from my side of the lattice. MY neighbor had rigged up this screen attached to a post to cover the hole form his side, sometime during the night it fell over and turned on his backyard faucet. It's been running all morning and nobody is home.
  • 11-06-2015, 01:13 PM
    Mr. Knowitall
    Re: New Neighbor is Blocking My Cat From Her Yard
    Would he object if you did him the favor of turning it off?
  • 11-06-2015, 01:40 PM
    delta_nine
    Re: New Neighbor is Blocking My Cat From Her Yard
    Quote:

    Quoting Mr. Knowitall
    View Post
    Would he object if you did him the favor of turning it off?

    I would if I could but the faucet isn't accessible from my property
  • 11-06-2015, 01:43 PM
    eapls2708
    Re: New Neighbor is Blocking My Cat From Her Yard
    Lattice can't be a boundary fence? Go back and re-read my first post. I qualified that if the lattice is constructed such that it would be considered a boundary fence, then the neighbor could make reasonable modifications to prevent the cat coming through. I described some ways that could be the case.

    Some have mentioned that there is no way to keep a cat from going where it wants to. That is certainly true in many cases, but not in all cases. Cats are individuals, some are young and energetic, some are super inquisitive, most are masters at breaking & entering and then making quick escapes through seemingly impenetrable barriers, and some are old, fat, or lazy. A landowner can only make reasonable steps to prevent access of neighboring people and pets. Such steps will keep out old, fat, and lazy cats, and may discourage others that would rather roam areas with easier access.

    Just because it is impossible to prevent all cats from entering if they are really determined is not a reason to forego making reasonable attempts to minimize such occurrences, nor a reason to deny a landowner the right to take reasonable steps to do so.

    llworking, if you've been around nearly 6 decades and have had cats all your life, then you are being disingenuous about the latrine habits of cats and the results of those actions. I too have had cats all my life - indoor and outdoor cats. The good thing about cats is that if they are indoor pets, you can train them to use a box as a latrine. Cats that spend a lot of time outdoors tend to choose one or a few particular spots to regularly relieve themselves. The bad thing about cats is that both their urine and their feces can be and often is very pungent. Anyone who has had cats, has regularly visited the homes of cat owners, or has had the misfortune of a roaming neighborhood or stray cat choose some location in their yard as their regular dumping ground knows that if you don't clean up the cat box or the portion of ground the cat regularly uses as a latrine on a regular basis or the odor can hang throughout a house or a yard area up to several dozen feet from the box or outdoor latrine location. Nobody with the slightest knowledge of either animal could ever confuse squirrel droppings with cat droppings. When I have a bobcat or mountain lion visit my property, I never know it because I see them, and very rarely because I see their tracks. But if they decide to spray on plants or other objects, or leave a pile of their regards on my land, I'll know it the moment I walk toward whichever part of my land they left their mark on. Not necessarily so with bears, coyotes, foxes, or other critters unless they leave their droppings in a conspicuous location to advertise their visit.

    Cat owners learn to deal with cleaning up after their cats and with having to occasionally take other actions to mitigate the odor and have chosen to deal with it. Someone who has not chosen to deal with it shouldn't have to, or at least may take reasonable steps to minimize having to do so. I also own dogs, but if I had a neighbor who also had a dog and built a fence around his yard except for a dog-sized hole into my yard, and for whatever reason - the dog digs, barks, does his business in my yard, or I have a family member who is allergic to that breed of dog, I would have no qualms about asking the neighbor to close up the hole or doing it myself. I also have no worries about my legal right to do so. §841 makes no exceptions for certain kinds of pets and makes no exceptions for certain kinds of fencing materials.

    If the lattice is not on or vary near the property line, then it would not be a boundary fence and the neighbor would not have a right to close the hole in it, but would need to build a fence on their lot or on the line as the reasonable step to keep the cat and others out. But I have a hard time picturing how closing the hole in the lattice would be effective if it did not serve as a part of a longer boundary barrier between the yards.
  • 11-06-2015, 01:50 PM
    Mr. Knowitall
    Re: New Neighbor is Blocking My Cat From Her Yard
    Quote:

    Quoting eapls2708
    View Post
    Lattice can't be a boundary fence? Go back and re-read my first post.

    It's clear from the original post and subsequent discussion that we're not talking about a boundary fence.
  • 11-07-2015, 10:06 AM
    LawResearcherMissy
    Re: New Neighbor is Blocking My Cat From Her Yard
    Quote:

    What are my rights in this situation?
    You have the right to keep your cat out of his yard.

    Seriously??

    I love cats, I've had many over the years. They've never been allowed to roam freely. My dogs love cats, too. THEIR cats, the ones they live with and fuss over and get bossed around by. Strange cats wandering in their yard, not so much.

    Would you be in here asking after your rights if your cat came into my yard, irritated my dogs, and came home missing an eye or a limb? THINK, for heavens' sake.
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