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Speeding While Driving in a Passing Lane
My question involves a traffic ticket from the state of: Texas
While visiting Texas, I was pulled over for driving in a passing lane and speeding 83 in a 75 near the small town of Memphis.
In regards to the left lane:
I remember seeing a white truck/semi ahead of me within approximately 10s of my vehicle. My plan was to pass said vehicle.
In regards to the speeding:
IF I was speeding (I'm not saying I was), my wife had gotten out of surgery only a few hours prior and due to the kind of surgery, great pain is caused when ones bladder is full.
Upon contacting the judge, my wife was told we would see the dash cam video in court that the officer took.
My questions are as follows:
1. If I file a discovery can I have a copy of the video, notes, etc. sent to me in another state?
2. Is there something that might allow "controlled speeding" for medical issues?
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Re: Speeding While Driving in a Passing Lane
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Quoting
Bryverine
IF I was speeding (I'm not saying I was), my wife had gotten out of surgery only a few hours prior and due to the kind of surgery, great pain is caused when ones bladder is full.
Speeding doesn't cause one's bladder to become empty.
If you are planning to try to convince the court that you were speeding to find a bathroom, then that calls into question your claim that you had merely sped up to pass a truck. If you did not share that story with the police officer at the time of the traffic stop, the court is not likely to regard your story as credible.
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Quoting Bryverine
If I file a discovery can I have a copy of the video, notes, etc. sent to me in another state?
Discovery will be sent to the address you use on your discovery request, even if it is in another state.
Quote:
Quoting Bryverine
Is there something that might allow "controlled speeding" for medical issues?
No. That's a "Throw yourself on the mercy of the court"-type of "defense". If you want to try it, you had best bring medical documentation to support your claim.
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Re: Speeding While Driving in a Passing Lane
Thank you for replying,
I was not planning to say I was speeding to pass. My plan was to say I was driving in the passing lane with intentions to pass and if I was speeding, it was to get to a bathroom for my wife.
I can easily get the surgery documentation that shows the kind of surgery it was and time it was done. I was trying to get the enforcement contact done quickly (without incriminating myself) so I could get my wife to the restroom. Also, we were about 15-20 minutes away from the nearest town according to our phone map.
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One more thing, I've been told by the judges office receptionist that in my letter of notification to plead not guilty, I am to include my name, the ticket number, and the details of my defense? Is that right? I will give all details regarding this case that identify the case such as my information and a copy of the ticket, but giving away my defense seems wrong.
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Re: Speeding While Driving in a Passing Lane
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Quoting
Bryverine
I was not planning to say I was speeding to pass. My plan was to say I was driving in the passing lane with intentions to pass and if I was speeding, it was to get to a bathroom for my wife.
"I wasn't speeding, but if I was I had to get my wife to a bathroom" -- zero credibility.
Instructions on how to respond to a ticket are normally provided with the ticket. If you are following those instructions, and what you are told by the court clerk, then it's reasonable to expect that you are responding properly.
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Re: Speeding While Driving in a Passing Lane
I see your point. I will plead not guilty to driving in the passing lane and probably guilty for the speeding but ask for mercy with the consideration of the medical documents I will provide as evidence.
I was just worried giving the judge my decision/plan will work against me somehow.
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Re: Speeding While Driving in a Passing Lane
If you're not sure you were speeding, then don't say that you were, or that you probably were. You can say that you don't know if you were speeding because you weren't looking at the speedometer at the time, but were moving pretty much with the flow of traffic. That is completely reasonable and definitely not zero credibility. Many people drive like that, at least some of the time.
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Re: Speeding While Driving in a Passing Lane
I was finally able to locate the mile marker on a map and I guess I was only TWO minutes away from the next town (I said 15 to be conservative in case I remembered wrong).
If I can get a note/email from a doctor that says it's normal to experience elevated pain after surgery that can be relieved by going to the bathroom, could this be legally justified speeding?
Not sure if this could possibly with under the "sudden emergency doctorine"?
She had several liters of fluid pumped into her (IV) as well as several water bottles to reduce dangerous complications that she was at a high risk for.
Logic:
I knew my wife was in pain, I knew the town was close, I knew using the bathroom could relieve pain. Therefore I wanted to get to the bathroom faster so my wife wasn't in pain. (It's not just a little tummy ache type pain, the doctor gave her morohine before we started driving and prescribed Tylenol with Codine).
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Re: Speeding While Driving in a Passing Lane
Not even winter and it is time to get out the boots.
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Re: Speeding While Driving in a Passing Lane
Your cleverness is not lost on me, though i was only looking for an answer. I'm not trying to drag this on or waste anyone's time, I was just curious how or if I can even fight this ticket.
I am very grateful for the replies and appreciate the time and energy that it took to reply to me.
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Re: Speeding While Driving in a Passing Lane
Your first story was that you weren't speeding. Now you say that you're going to confess to speeding, and are going to present what you've told us would be a false attempt at a necessity defense -- if you weren't speeding, then you weren't rushing anywhere for any reason. You have not indicated that you told the officer that you were rushing to a bathroom. So really, you appear to want us to let you know if we believe that you're going to trick the judge and get out of one or both of your tickets by telling lies in court. The answer is, "Don't lie in court."
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Re: Speeding While Driving in a Passing Lane
If you could please indulge me for one more letter, I'd greatly appreciate it.
I can easily see where I might have been unclear and would like you apologize for that.
What I want to know is if I can justify speeding to get my wife to a restroom.
Quote:
IF I was speeding (I'm not saying I was), my wife had gotten out of surgery only a few hours prior and due to the kind of surgery, great pain is caused when ones bladder is full.
I was just trying to use the word "if" in my original post to show that I wasn't sure if I should commit to incriminating myself of speeding. I used it unsuccessfully. I also tried to use the phrase "i'm not saying I was" as more of a figure of speech rather than a definitive "I will say in court that I was not speeding".
I greatly appreciate your insight and hope you can believe that even without actually knowing me, nor knowing my character, I never intended to lie, trick, or deceive anyone, including members on this forum.
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Re: Speeding While Driving in a Passing Lane
No you can not justify speeding PERIOD. It doesn't matter what story you make up: people having to pee, wanting to pass other vehicles, being tailgated, being pursued by zombies, none.
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Re: Speeding While Driving in a Passing Lane
Of course you can sometimes justify speeding using the necessity defense. It's not murder, for crying out loud, and certainly you are allowed to try this approach. Here's a roughly similar case that I found in 5 seconds: https://scholar.google.com/scholar_c...33939384373410 . Whether it will work is another matter, though, and depends greatly on the judge. But it's worth a shot.
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Re: Speeding While Driving in a Passing Lane
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Quoting
thewiseone
Of course you can sometimes justify speeding using the necessity defense. It's not murder, for crying out loud, and certainly you are allowed to try this approach. Here's a roughly similar case that I found in 5 seconds:
https://scholar.google.com/scholar_c...33939384373410 . Whether it will work is another matter, though, and depends greatly on the judge. But it's worth a shot.
Thank you so much, that is extremely helpful and I appreciate your help.
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Re: Speeding While Driving in a Passing Lane
There is a very, very great difference between someone having a heart attack and someone needing to pee.
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Re: Speeding While Driving in a Passing Lane
This is not just "someone needing to pee." And there is also a great difference between speeding 83 in a 75 and DWI.
By the way - which of us here would not speed if his wife needed to pee :) ? Huh?
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Re: Speeding While Driving in a Passing Lane
If your wife has peeing problems, she should be keeping a sanitary device for such emergencies in your vehicles. Properly prepared, no law breaking.
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Re: Speeding While Driving in a Passing Lane
You don't see a difference between someone who is in danger of DEATH and someone who needs to pee, thefoolishone?
I sure do.
And no, I would not speed if my husband needed to pee. Or even if I did.
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Re: Speeding While Driving in a Passing Lane
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Quoting
cbg
And no, I would not speed if my husband needed to pee. Or even if I did.
They might give you one of these driver's licenses:
https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2088/2...bd3b49e624.jpg
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Re: Speeding While Driving in a Passing Lane
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Quoting
thewiseone
Of course you can sometimes justify speeding using the necessity defense. It's not murder, for crying out loud, and certainly you are allowed to try this approach. Here's a roughly similar case that I found in 5 seconds:
http://www.duiattorney.com/7278-texa...fense-for-dwi/ . Whether it will work is another matter, though, and depends greatly on the judge. But it's worth a shot.
Quote:
Quoting
cbg
You don't see a difference between someone who is in danger of DEATH and someone who needs to pee, thefoolishone?
I sure do.
And no, I would not speed if my husband needed to pee. Or even if I did.
Even if you were in great pain because if a surgery? I wasn't just trying to make sure comforts of standard life could be carried out. My wife was in pain because of a surgical procedure.
It also turns out it was a prima facie speeding ticket.
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Quote:
Quoting
Disagreeable
If your wife has peeing problems, she should be keeping a sanitary device for such emergencies in your vehicles. Properly prepared, no law breaking.
It was after a surgery. Perhaps I should go ahead and put something in my emergency kit that includes post surgery amenities?
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Re: Speeding While Driving in a Passing Lane
Perhaps you should stop changing your story because as it is, I wouldn't believe you if you said the sky was blue.
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Re: Speeding While Driving in a Passing Lane
Though their method of disposal can be somewhat lacking in respect and other things, there is a reason truck drivers keep a piss bottle. Have you ever tried to find a place to park a vehicle about 80 feet long to go pee.
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Re: Speeding While Driving in a Passing Lane
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Quoting
cbg
Perhaps you should stop changing your story because as it is, I wouldn't believe you if you said the sky was blue.
Two things,
One, when did I change my story? From my first post, and there after, I never once claimed I was not speeding, I explained several times my wife had got out of surgery and had pain, and finally that I was going to pass someone.
It's not my fault people keep jumping to conclusions. Please read my post carefully before jumping on the 'you changed your story' bandwagon.
Two, the sky is not blue it's several colors and actually mostly violet/ultra violet due to scattering in the atmosphere but your eyes can't see it because the colors do not have wavelengths that are in the visible spectrum.
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To Disagreeable,
Lol no, apparently I have trouble with a 10 foot long car, I can't imagine driving an 80 foot one.
To those who have been helpful (or at least not rude), I greatly appreciate your help and comments. I was looking for the necessity law but didn't know the words to find it so I was grasping at straws. Thank you so much.
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Re: Speeding While Driving in a Passing Lane
You stated that you were speeding due to your wife needing to use a bathroom as she was in pain. You stated that your wife was on Morphine and prescribed T3.
You also stated that not to incriminate yourself, you made no statement to the police officer.
How long did the traffic stop last, 10 15, 20 minutes? And you mean to tell me that you never asked the officer if he could hurry the stop up as your wife was in pain?
I think you need to change your story once again, because no judge will believe that your wife was in pain.
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Re: Speeding While Driving in a Passing Lane
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Quoting
cbg
You don't see a difference between someone who is in danger of DEATH and someone who needs to pee, thefoolishone?
Congrats on the fantastic retort. Now, where did I say that? Please quote.
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Re: Speeding While Driving in a Passing Lane
Hey, you're the one who equated the OP's case with the extreme measure described in the link.
Backpedal much?
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Re: Speeding While Driving in a Passing Lane
Okay.... So now that your story is that you were speeding, you're left with the fact that you have no excuse for driving in the fast lane at the point that you were stopped. The idea of a necessity defense is cute, but if the judge knows the elements of that defense it is going to fail.
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Quoting Jackson v. State, 50 S.W.3d 579, 591-92 (Tex.App.-Fort Worth 2001, pet. ref'd).
Section 9.22 of the penal code provides that necessity is a defense if:
(1) the actor reasonably believes the conduct is immediately necessary to avoid imminent harm;
(2) the desirability and urgency of avoiding the harm clearly outweigh, according to ordinary standards of reasonableness, the harm sought to be prevented by the law proscribing the conduct; and
(3) a legislative purpose to exclude the justification claimed for the conduct does not otherwise plainly appear.
Id. In addition, "imminent" means something that is impending, not pending; something that is on the point of happening, not about to happen.
Smith v. State, 874 S.W.2d 269, 272-73 (Tex.App.-Houston [14th Dist.] 1994, pet. ref'd). Harm is imminent when there is an emergency situation and it is "immediately necessary" to avoid that harm.
Id. at 273. In other words, a split-second decision is required without time to consider the law.
Id.
There's not one person on this planet who, if they wait too long to evacuate their bladder, is not going to experience pain. The decision to speed in response to the need to pee, whether yours or a passenger's, however is not a split-second decision -- the need to pee builds over time. Also, if the need to pee is imminent, you're not going to be able to sit through several more minutes of driving and searching for a restroom -- let alone when that period is extended by a traffic stop. And that's before we get to the fact that when you sit through a traffic stop without telling the officer, "My wife has a medical condition and really needs to pee," raising that story for the first time in court has no credibility.
So you can attempt to throw yourself on the mercy of the court or try to convince the prosecutor to give you a break, but the facts you have shared provide no defense at all to driving in the passing lane, and under the governing statute and case law do not support a necessity defense for speeding.
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Re: Speeding While Driving in a Passing Lane
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Quoting
Mr. Knowitall
Okay.... So now that your story is that you were speeding
I never said I wasn't speeding, you jumped to that conclusion all on your own.
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you're left with the fact that you have no excuse for driving in the fast lane at the point that you were stopped.
You again decided all on your own that I was speeding up to pass someone. I merely said there was someone in front of me I was planning to pass; it was never even related to the speeding.
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The idea of a necessity defense is cute, but if the judge knows the elements of that defense it is going to fail.
There's not one person on this planet who, if they wait too long to evacuate their bladder, is not going to experience pain. The decision to speed in response to the need to pee, whether yours or a passenger's, however is not a split-second decision -- the need to pee builds over time. Also, if the need to pee is imminent, you're not going to be able to sit through several more minutes of driving and searching for a restroom -- let alone when that period is extended by a traffic stop. And that's before we get to the fact that when you sit through a traffic stop without telling the officer, "My wife has a medical condition and really needs to pee," raising that story for the first time in court has no credibility.
So you can attempt to throw yourself on the mercy of the court or try to convince the prosecutor to give you a break.
Here's the thing, I do appreciate that you were the first person to help and I appreciate your continued interest in this thread.
I see your points and understand your reasoning with the given information; I see it differently. I can understand the gravity of the DUI story and that of a life or death situation, which this was not. At this point though any details about the enforcement contact or otherwise, that I would add would either be considered 'excuses' or I would be told that I have changed my story again.
On that note, I am baffled by the number of times I've been told I changed my story. If you feel there are contradictions, that's fine, but that's not a change in story. Maybe I'm arguing semantics here, but I don't believe I changed my story anywhere. If I have, I can't see it even after reviewing my statements.
Perhaps people are taking my not objecting to comments or posts made by other people as me accepting them as my truth.
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Re: Speeding While Driving in a Passing Lane
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Quoting
Bryverine
I never said I wasn't speeding, you jumped to that conclusion all on your own.
Eventually you will need to pick one of your lies and stick with it.
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Quoting Bryverine
You again decided all on your own that I was speeding up to pass someone.
I said nothing of the sort. I have simply pointed out that none of your excuses justify your driving in the passing lane.
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Quoting Bryverine
I see it differently.
And you would be wrong.
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Re: Speeding While Driving in a Passing Lane
Did you even read my post before you decided what I was or wasn't trying to say?
My first post:
Quote:
In regards to the left lane:
I remember seeing a white truck/semi ahead of me within approximately 10s of my vehicle. My plan was to pass said vehicle.
Hence my desire to get the dashcam video in a discovery. That seems pretty black and white to me.
That's the ONLY thing I said about being in the passing lane, that's it.
Upon reading my first post, you replied with:
Quote:
If you are planning to try to convince the court that you were speeding to find a bathroom, then that calls into question your claim that you had merely sped up to pass a truck.
Where was this supposed claim that I was speeding to pass anyone?
I'm not sure if you're just pulling my leg at this point, but I have presented proof that you jumped to conclusions and misread my post. Where is your proof that I changed stories? I will apologize with humility if you could please just show where I changed my story.
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Re: Speeding While Driving in a Passing Lane
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Quoting
Bryverine
Did you even read my post before you decided what I was or wasn't trying to say?
Obviously we read what you wrote. If you want to pretend you weren't lying here, at best it can be said that you admitted a willingness to lie in court. Either way....
Perhaps if you go to court you could leave your wife out of it and, instead, try arguing to the court that you have a medical condition pursuant to which you're in danger of having excrement explode out of your ears if you don't let it out -- because, truly, if you comport yourself in court like you have here the judge is going to believe that you're full of excrement.
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Re: Speeding While Driving in a Passing Lane
I guess you're going to continue to ignore what I actually said in my posts. I think you disregard my request to offer proof to your claims out of convenience so you can continue to be argumentative.
I offered solid data, I gave you a chance to counter with your own to enlighten me. If you can't show me data to oppose mine, I'm forced to believe in what I've concluded.
The only lie I've made here is when I tricked myself into believing your help would continue to be useful.
Well, at least I got a few good laughs out of your comments.
Now would be the perfect time for that boots comment.
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Re: Speeding While Driving in a Passing Lane
And I guess you're still full of excrement.