Trying to Get Sole Custody After a Prior Unsuccessful Petition

My question involves a child custody case from the State of: Illinois.

I'm going to give a short run down of this case, but it is important to know that I am neither the mother or father, but instead a significant other. (Also, we do have a lawyer, but the general agreement is that I obtain information/evidence/file much of the paperwork to lower our general costs.)

Background: Divorce settled in February of 2013 (while being started in May of 2012). Sole custody given to mother- father was poorly informed by lawyer and did not know custody was an option at the time. Flash forward, Mother moves 150+ miles away with child with no notice to father,September 2013, violating martial agreement. After some seriously aggressive court battles, ex-wife is ordered to move back to school district agreed upon and enroll child. NOW, the child has finished her last day in Kindergarten as of this week. During this time period, there were several contempt orders against the ex-wife- (Moving, denying visitation, enrolling the child in the wrong district, etc.) While this occurred the father filed for a custody change, due to both physical and mental endangerment. There was belief that drugs were being used in the home, as well as things like allowing the boyfriend and 4 year old child to share a bed. However, this was denied. The reasoning, as the judge put it- by forcing the mother to move back or lose custody until she moves back, it will solve the major problems. (It hasn't.) Currently, in Illinois, it is EXTREMELY difficult to change custody without endangerment within two years of the original agreement. (We are now at 2 years and 3 months). Unfortunatley, much of this information has come from the child, when she babbles about her two separate homes and since we do not want to discourage her relationship with her mother, we let her ramble about anything she wants.

Now, I'll describe what's currently going on, so that we may obtain advice on what would be the best mode of "attack" when we motion for custody again. We believe the mother will now try moving again during the summer months, since there is no technicality on where the child must be during this time. Following the agreement exactly, we would have the child roughly 14-15 days out of the month. We receive about 10 days.

Relationships:
1. Mother is currently living with ex-fiancee, who we believe to be physically abusive.
2. Mother was allowing 4/5 year old daughter to share a bed with her boyfriend of 6 months.
3. Mother is currently spending a significant amount of time with a sex-offender, (assaulted 13-17yr old) but will not admit to dating him. (Child has mentioned visiting his house.)
4. Mother has had 5 or 6 boyfriends since the divorce. She has encouraged/forced her daughter to refer to 3 of them as "Daddy/Dad".

Living Arrangements:
1. Mother currently lives with ex-fiancee, but has had 5 residences (that we know of) in the past 2 years.
a. Ex-Fiancee, apartment, ex-fiancee again, grandparents, ex-fiancee.
2. Currently, the child has her own room at the ex-fiancee's, but mother sleeps on a couch or floor.

Jobs:
1. Mother had job at motorcycle dealership for roughly 6 months before having to move to origin district.
2. Held a gas station position for roughly 3 months.
3. Maintains large gaps in employment, and has quit several jobs voluntarily.
4. Receives roughly $440 in child support a month. (Almost 50% of father's total income.)
5. Told us she had accepted another job recently, but never started.
6. Mother has had car repo'd, and has a suit against her for at least 2 other loans that were taken out in her name. (All public records).

Child's Well-being:
1. Daughter has had serious self-image issues since before her 4th birthday.
a. She fully believes you can only be pretty if you color your hair and wear makeup.
b. Is often critical of herself, calling herself ugly, etc. ("I wish I had blonde hair like Mommy")
2. Daughter is aware that her mother and the ex-fiancee fight both verbally and physically.
3. Mother spent several months telling daughter, "Daddy doesn't love you, that's why he made us move", "Daddy doesn't want you to have any friends", etc.
4. Child is behind in schooling. Teacher believes she is receiving no help at home.
5. Child often apologizes for mother's actions/words (although she is only 5!)
a. Please note, we do our best not to mention her mother in any way, unless the child brings her up first. Even, then we do not speak negatively about her.
6. Child received her first dental exam over the summer and had 5 cavities, one so bad it was into the gum.
7. Child received treatment in the E.R for bronchitis, mother did not bother to notify us until we found it on social media.
8. Child is potentially developing asthma (father has), but mother refuses doctor's notes, saying it's allergies to our pets.

Family:
1. After she had moved the 150+ she tried to justify it was better for the child to be with her family, which consisted of her grandparents.

Now, the following is OUR current situation. Please bear with me, I'm trying to be as unbiased as possible.

Relationships:
1. Father and I have maintained a stable relationship for about the past 4 years, although we have held off marriage until this situation is more stable so we can afford something nice.

Living Arrangements:
1. Father and I have had 3 residences since the divorce.
a. Parents, rented house, rented house.
b. All three places have had a separate room for the child.

Jobs:
1. Father maintained job at local University for roughly 4 years before moving on to a better job.
2. Father now works for the county. Hours are similar, but no commute, home for lunch, etc.
3. I have had some employment issues due to also being enrolled in a college, finishing a B.A degree. (Since 2013, I had about 2 months of only have 1 PT job.)
4. I maintain a full time position in retail, as well as a part time position as a waitress.

Family:
1. In our town, we have both my parents, the father's parents, and quite a bit of extended family that is around the child often. (Great-grandparents, cousins, aunts, uncles, etc.)

I'm going to leave out the well being section, because I don't feel I could write anything out that wouldn't be biased.


SO, with all this in mind, what do you think? Would it be worth it again to attempt gaining custody? We were so disheartened last time after being denied (even with some evidence of drug and neglect), that we're afraid it'll happen again and we'll be out that money we could use on other very important bills. However, the mother has continually disobeyed the marital agreement even after the judge threatened to put her in jail, that it's just ridiculous!

Thank you in advance for you thoughts and advice!

There is no "we" in this equation. If you try this "we" stuff in court, stand by for high seas and heavy rolls.

And a lot of this stuff you bring up isn't going to mean a hill of beans in court...you can't penalize someone for having a job at a gas station or having more than one address in the last couple of years.. and much of the other allegations you have no proof of.

Given that dad voluntarily gave mom primary custody in 2013 and lost a petition to modify custody in 2014, despite raising all sorts of salacious accusations, dad is not in a good position to again try to modify custody in 2015. Dad should have the facts reviewed by a lawyer -- who will tell him that most of what you're reciting has zero relevance to a petition to modify custody, remind you that some of your accusations have already been rejected by the court in the last proceeding.

If dad wants to take the child to a dentist, he has ten days each month during which he can do exactly that. He similarly has the child with him a third of the month and is free to help her with her homework or hire a tutor. I have no idea what you mean by "mother refuses doctor's notes", except if dad is taking the child to a doctor during his visitation it serves to prove my point about the dentist. If the child does not have asthma, I'm not sure what you expect mom to do in response to your suggestion that the child is "potentially developing asthma"; I'm also not clear what you have done in response to mom's suggestion that the problem is allergies triggered by the pets at your home.

I'm not a lawyer, so I put out that information for advice.

I thought some of it may be important because it helps show how unstable she is, bouncing the child around from house to house. The accusations brought up here are not ones "thought up", they are things seen previously via social media about drug use, violence, etc. As to being denied the first time, we have been advised that within the first 2 years in our state, that it is extremely difficult without 100% proving that the child is in immediate danger.

However, we were planning to file again- now that the 2 year limitation is gone.

On a side note, I don't consider it being penalized for where she works- I have been extremely happy that she got a job, period. However, I do think it should be taken into account that she can't maintain a job for more than 6 months max. I also don't bring these allegations up haphazardly, they are all things that have been accounted for by teachers, the child, text messages, social media, etc.

Again, I'm not a lawyer, that's why I was asking for advice.

Dad needs to be very, very careful here. Going on the "attack" - and that was not simply a figure of speech - usually backfires tremendously.

Listing Mom's faults is just about the worst possible thing he can do. The first response from Mom is going to be a solid claim that you are trying to alienate her child against her. And there's an excellent chance the court will take her seriously and act accordingly.

"possible" child abuse?
"possible" drug use?

She could always levy the same accusations at Dad (and you, actually). See how that goes?

If you're not careful, you're going to help Dad total his case in court. I strongly suggest that Dad sees an attorney, and more to the point, learns how to keep you out of the equation completely.

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Quoting August0821

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I'm not a lawyer, so I put out that information for advice.

I thought some of it may be important because it helps show how unstable she is, bouncing the child around from house to house. The accusations brought up here are not ones "thought up", they are things seen previously via social media about drug use, violence, etc. As to being denied the first time, we have been advised that within the first 2 years in our state, that it is extremely difficult without 100% proving that the child is in immediate danger.

However, we were planning to file again- now that the 2 year limitation is gone.

On a side note, I don't consider it being penalized for where she works- I have been extremely happy that she got a job, period. However, I do think it should be taken into account that she can't maintain a job for more than 6 months max. I also don't bring these allegations up haphazardly, they are all things that have been accounted for by teachers, the child, text messages, social media, etc.

Again, I'm not a lawyer, that's why I was asking for advice.

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Hmm. Is Dad current on child support?

You mention teachers. They're mandated reporters - in other words, if they think something is amiss they have a legal obligation to make the right calls. That they haven't simply supports the notion that Mom is fine.

Her lack of job stability means nothing. She can be the laziest SAHM she wants to be and the court will not penalize her for it. You are walking a very, very thin line.

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Quoting August0821

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I'm not a lawyer, so I put out that information for advice.

I thought some of it may be important because it helps show how unstable she is, bouncing the child around from house to house. The accusations brought up here are not ones "thought up", they are things seen previously via social media about drug use, violence, etc. As to being denied the first time, we have been advised that within the first 2 years in our state, that it is extremely difficult without 100% proving that the child is in immediate danger.

However, we were planning to file again- now that the 2 year limitation is gone.

On a side note, I don't consider it being penalized for where she works- I have been extremely happy that she got a job, period. However, I do think it should be taken into account that she can't maintain a job for more than 6 months max. I also don't bring these allegations up haphazardly, they are all things that have been accounted for by teachers, the child, text messages, social media, etc.

Again, I'm not a lawyer, that's why I was asking for advice.

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You don't need a lawyer to call CPS if you genuinely think child abuse is going on.

He is not current. He is making payments larger than the required amount, paying $220 a paycheck instead of the required $185. His previous job was only allowed to withdraw so much from his check. We had never received a notice that we were behind until he started his new job. It will be current within two months.

I understand the need for me to be separated from this. So please, do not attack me for it. As mentioned in the original post, I gather information for our lawyer as leg work, to help with the fees. But really, THIS particular thread was for our information. Just to see what others think, if they've had similar cases.

I also realize that in normal situations that my opinion/testimony/involvement,etc would not be important to the judge, however with this case the judge has been interested in both significant others as well as the family. I believe because I have been involved with the child since she was about 18months.

YOU are not behind. I note something interesting though -- dad has been divorced for two years and yet you have been with him for four years. So basically you were the adulterous lover. The lawyer is not "OUR" lawyer. Nope. Not at all. The fact that you and dad were engaged in an affair while he was still married (and for two years at least while he was married) doesn't speak much about you or him.

Furthermore, what you have mentioned above? I see nothing about dad up there. The fact that he is behind on child support doesn't help him. He knew how much he was ordered to pay in child support and the fact that he didn't make sure it happened is on him. Furthermore, YOUR parents and dad's parents matter not. But especially YOUR parents. YOU are NO ONE in this situation legally. The child's family is mom and dad -- end of story.

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Quoting August0821

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However, we were planning to file again- now that the 2 year limitation is gone.

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I suggest that you have a lawyer review the order denying dad's last petition to modify, as it may have reset the clock.

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My question involves a child custody case from the State of: Illinois.

I'm going to give a short run down of this case, but it is important to know that I am neither the mother or father, but instead a significant other. (Also, we do have a lawyer, but the general agreement is that I obtain information/evidence/file much of the paperwork to lower our general costs.)

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YOU do NOT have a lawyer. YOU are not a party and therefore the lawyer is NOT representing you but rather your husband.

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Background: Divorce settled in February of 2013 (while being started in May of 2012).

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And you have been involved with dad since 2011 (four years according to you), correct?

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Sole custody given to mother- father was poorly informed by lawyer and did not know custody was an option at the time.

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father apparently didn't care enough to ask questions.

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Flash forward, Mother moves 150+ miles away with child with no notice to father,September 2013, violating martial agreement.

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No she didn't. There is no martial agreement.

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After some seriously aggressive court battles, ex-wife is ordered to move back to school district agreed upon and enroll child. NOW, the child has finished her last day in Kindergarten as of this week. During this time period, there were several contempt orders against the ex-wife- (Moving, denying visitation, enrolling the child in the wrong district, etc.)

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Mother cannot enroll a child in just any school district.

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While this occurred the father filed for a custody change, due to both physical and mental endangerment. There was belief that drugs were being used in the home, as well as things like allowing the boyfriend and 4 year old child to share a bed. However, this was denied. The reasoning, as the judge put it- by forcing the mother to move back or lose custody until she moves back, it will solve the major problems. (It hasn't.)

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What evidence was there of drugs? Other than a "belief"? Was there positive drug tests? Drug arrests and criminal charges during this period of time?

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Currently, in Illinois, it is EXTREMELY difficult to change custody without endangerment within two years of the original agreement. (We are now at 2 years and 3 months). Unfortunatley, much of this information has come from the child, when she babbles about her two separate homes and since we do not want to discourage her relationship with her mother, we let her ramble about anything she wants.

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She babbles huh? Children her age are NOT competent.

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Now, I'll describe what's currently going on, so that we may obtain advice on what would be the best mode of "attack" when we motion for custody again. We believe the mother will now try moving again during the summer months, since there is no technicality on where the child must be during this time. Following the agreement exactly, we would have the child roughly 14-15 days out of the month. We receive about 10 days.

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YOU have no right to receive the child at all. You have no right to be involved. And how dare you decide to "attack". You are a legal stranger, now and forever.

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Relationships:
1. Mother is currently living with ex-fiancee, who we believe to be physically abusive.

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Dad is living with his adulterous overstepping lover. There is no evidence of physical abuse or dad would have reported such to the proper authorities.

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2. Mother was allowing 4/5 year old daughter to share a bed with her boyfriend of 6 months.

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Based upon what?

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3. Mother is currently spending a significant amount of time with a sex-offender, (assaulted 13-17yr old) but will not admit to dating him. (Child has mentioned visiting his house.)

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Really? What is a significant amount of time? How does dad know this? What were the actual charges?

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4. Mother has had 5 or 6 boyfriends since the divorce. She has encouraged/forced her daughter to refer to 3 of them as "Daddy/Dad".

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Dad has an adulterous long term lover who oversteps.

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Living Arrangements:
1. Mother currently lives with ex-fiancee, but has had 5 residences (that we know of) in the past 2 years.
a. Ex-Fiancee, apartment, ex-fiancee again, grandparents, ex-fiancee.

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And?

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2. Currently, the child has her own room at the ex-fiancee's, but mother sleeps on a couch or floor.

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So what? The child has her own room. She is taken care of and not neglected. Maybe if dad wasn't a deadbeat and paid his child support consistently and constantly, mother would not be financially strapped.

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Jobs:
1. Mother had job at motorcycle dealership for roughly 6 months before having to move to origin district.
2. Held a gas station position for roughly 3 months.
3. Maintains large gaps in employment, and has quit several jobs voluntarily.

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And how frequent were dad's child support payments during this time? Was he helping cover daycare or just paying whatever because he didn't think he had to pay according to the order?

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4. Receives roughly $440 in child support a month. (Almost 50% of father's total income.)

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Yet he went without paying for a while. How much do you earn?

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5. Told us she had accepted another job recently, but never started.

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So? None of your business.

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6. Mother has had car repo'd, and has a suit against her for at least 2 other loans that were taken out in her name. (All public records).

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Has nothing to do with custody. And if dad weren't a deadbeat and were paying per the court order constantly, mom may not have had to financially struggle.

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Child's Well-being:
1. Daughter has had serious self-image issues since before her 4th birthday.
a. She fully believes you can only be pretty if you color your hair and wear makeup.
b. Is often critical of herself, calling herself ugly, etc. ("I wish I had blonde hair like Mommy")

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And? What has dad done about that?

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2. Daughter is aware that her mother and the ex-fiancee fight both verbally and physically.

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What evidence is there of that? Do you and your lover fight verbally at all or do you ALWAYS agree on EVERYTHING?

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3. Mother spent several months telling daughter, "Daddy doesn't love you, that's why he made us move", "Daddy doesn't want you to have any friends", etc.

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What evidence is there?

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4. Child is behind in schooling. Teacher believes she is receiving no help at home.

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So why isn't dad helping?

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5. Child often apologizes for mother's actions/words (although she is only 5!)
a. Please note, we do our best not to mention her mother in any way, unless the child brings her up first. Even, then we do not speak negatively about her.

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I am not believing this.

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6. Child received her first dental exam over the summer and had 5 cavities, one so bad it was into the gum.

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And while dad was involved PRIOR to the divorce, he did nothing about the dentist either. How neglectful was he? Why didn't he do anything in the 10 days a month he had his child? OH, because he wants to blame mom. I get it. Pathetic.

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7. Child received treatment in the E.R for bronchitis, mother did not bother to notify us until we found it on social media.

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Mother doesn't have to say a word to you EVER. You deserve NO information. Got it?

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8. Child is potentially developing asthma (father has), but mother refuses doctor's notes, saying it's allergies to our pets.

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Mother refuses doctor's notes? Meaning what? Dad has no proof the child has asthma. Nor has he done anything about it.

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Family:
1. After she had moved the 150+ she tried to justify it was better for the child to be with her family, which consisted of her grandparents.

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And? She lost that argument. Doesn't matter.

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Now, the following is OUR current situation. Please bear with me, I'm trying to be as unbiased as possible.

Relationships:
1. Father and I have maintained a stable relationship for about the past 4 years, although we have held off marriage until this situation is more stable so we can afford something nice.

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You forgot to mention that dad was sleeping with you while married to mom for two years. Stability does NOT include adultery. What he does with you, he will do to you. Might want to remember that.

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Living Arrangements:
1. Father and I have had 3 residences since the divorce.
a. Parents, rented house, rented house.
b. All three places have had a separate room for the child.

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So do you work? Dad wasn't paying all the child support he was supposed to but rather was using it for apparently supporting you and your household.

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Jobs:
1. Father maintained job at local University for roughly 4 years before moving on to a better job.
2. Father now works for the county. Hours are similar, but no commute, home for lunch, etc.
3. I have had some employment issues due to also being enrolled in a college, finishing a B.A degree. (Since 2013, I had about 2 months of only have 1 PT job.)

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Dad may have a better job so he has gone to increase his child support correct? I mean he should if he cared about the support of his child and according to you mother has financial issues. Maybe if dad weren't a deadbeat things would be easier. He apparently is supporting you partially with his income but you resent what he pays to support his child.

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4. I maintain a full time position in retail, as well as a part time position as a waitress.

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And? Your income doesn't matter except that you need to support yourself. It isn't dad's job to support you.

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Family:
1. In our town, we have both my parents, the father's parents, and quite a bit of extended family that is around the child often. (Great-grandparents, cousins, aunts, uncles, etc.)

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You, your parents and extended family matter not. Father's parent's matter not. The child's parents and siblings are what matters.

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I'm going to leave out the well being section, because I don't feel I could write anything out that wouldn't be biased.

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Everything you wrote is biased.

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SO, with all this in mind, what do you think? Would it be worth it again to attempt gaining custody? We were so disheartened last time after being denied (even with some evidence of drug and neglect), that we're afraid it'll happen again and we'll be out that money we could use on other very important bills. However, the mother has continually disobeyed the marital agreement even after the judge threatened to put her in jail, that it's just ridiculous!

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YOU will NEVER get custody. You have no dog in this fight. You truthfully need to quit overstepping and let dad deal with his issues.