Parking in a Handicapped Spot With No Blue Lines, Sign Off-Center
My question involves a traffic citation from the state of: Illinois
Alright, I understand that not knowing this was a supposedly a handicapped spot doesn't help anything. But take a look at this:
I parked in this spot:
http://tapatalk.imageshack.com/v2/15...a76ddc1449.jpg
Notice there's no paint here. And the sign is super off centered - if it were dead in the center of the spot I could see this as a handicapped spot. Also, there was paint where the suburu was - not my spot.
Here's another angle after I moved my car.
http://tapatalk.imageshack.com/v2/15...17c3772d3a.jpg
Let's take a look at all the other handicapped spots in the lot:
http://tapatalk.imageshack.com/v2/15...1f53ff8ebf.jpg
Signs in the center of the spots - lines and paint where the signs aren't.
Other side:
http://tapatalk.imageshack.com/v2/15...0b50801364.jpg
Again, paint and signs in the center of every spot.
A $325 ticket for this. I mean, cmon. Who would think that this is a handicapped spot when every single other spot is clear about it?
What's funny is after I moved my car, another non-handicapped person parks there (I have a photo of that as well.)
I literally had no intention of parking in a handicapped spot.
Can I fight this in court?
Thanks in advance.
Re: Parking in a Handicapped Spot With No Blue Lines, Sign Off-Center
Quote:
Quoting
Nico Spatola
You CAN fight it but you won't win.
Just looking at the first picture, it's so obviously a handicapped spot even if the sign is a little off center. I can see that just looking out your car window. You had to have seen it right in front of your face when you pulled into the spot.
What went on in any other spot or with any other driver is totally irrelevant and won't help you a bit.
Re: Parking in a Handicapped Spot With No Blue Lines, Sign Off-Center
Off center? Do you mean just because it isn't perfectly centered in the parking space itself you thought it did not apply?
If anything the lack of the HC symbol would be your only out but honestly I'm not going to chase statute to see if it is a requirement. That sign alone is adequate to me to make it a HC space.
And the silver car is also illegally parked in a HC space. The cross hatch area adjacent to a parking space is part of the area designated to the HC parking space. It is for use by a wheelchair lift or any other mechanism that requires additional space.
My only suggestion would be to research the required markings for a HC space in illinois. If it is requirred to have the ground paint symbol, there is your defense
Re: Parking in a Handicapped Spot With No Blue Lines, Sign Off-Center
Quote:
Quoting
jk
Off center? Do you mean just because it isn't perfectly centered in the parking space itself you thought it did not apply?
If anything the lack of the HC symbol would be your only out but honestly I'm not going to chase statute to see if it is a requirement. That sign alone is adequate to me to make it a HC space.
And the silver car is also illegally parked in a HC space. The cross hatch area adjacent to a parking space is part of the area designated to the HC parking space. It is for use by a wheelchair lift or any other mechanism that requires additional space.
My only suggestion would be to research the required markings for a HC space in illinois. If it is requirred to have the ground paint symbol, there is your defense
I found this:
Size and Markings
Each accessible parking space, except on-street spaces, shall be 16 feet wide, with either an eight-foot wide or five-foot wide diagonally striped access aisle. A high quality yellow paint, manufactured especially for pavement striping, must be used. Adjacent accessible parking spaces cannot share a common access aisle.
Signs
A U.S. Department of Transportation R7-8 (Reserved Parking) and a R7-I101 ($250 fine) sign must be mounted on a permanent post no lower than five feet from the pavement. The post must be mounted in the center of the 16-foot wide accessible parking space, no more than five feet from the front of the parking space. Municipalities may impose a larger fine (up to $350) through the adoption of a local ordinance.
Re: Parking in a Handicapped Spot With No Blue Lines, Sign Off-Center
You appear to be looking at this, which describes the property owner's duties. The property owner's non-compliance with some of its duties does not, of itself, mean that a ticket for parking in a handicapped zone will be unenforceable.
Was your ticket issued under 625 ILCS 5/11-1301.3?
Re: Parking in a Handicapped Spot With No Blue Lines, Sign Off-Center
I saw nothing saying the HC design must be on the ground
the sign for that space is actuslly closer to properly placed laterally than any other. The only issue is it looks like the sign is not permanent. Whether you can drive the tcunicality to a win I don't know but I suspect not given the overall layout of the space is obviously a HC space b
Re: Parking in a Handicapped Spot With No Blue Lines, Sign Off-Center
Quote:
Quoting
Mr. Knowitall
You appear to be looking at
this, which describes the
property owner's duties. The property owner's non-compliance with some of its duties does not,
of itself, mean that a ticket for parking in a handicapped zone will be unenforceable.
Was your ticket issued under
625 ILCS 5/11-1301.3?
I don't know how to tell. It's a parking citation. It doesn't even have a due date on it? What the hell?
Re: Parking in a Handicapped Spot With No Blue Lines, Sign Off-Center
OK, I live with a handicapper, and lived with one before.
My observations:
- Hard to tell if there is are blue lines in that spot, but I think I do think they are very faded. This might keep you out of a ticket. I'd go back and take a pic kissing the ground.....if it is faded...I mean the yellow lines are very clear.
- But...the placement of the sign says this is handicapped. So.....that would work for the ticketing agency.
LOGIC: When in doubt....see a sign, see a blue/yellow combo...park further out, save yourself the hassle and fine.
As for your citation...it should have a website to punch in and find out how who to contact to contest it, or a date to appear in court by.
Re: Parking in a Handicapped Spot With No Blue Lines, Sign Off-Center
My observations being handicapped. It is clear the intent was for that space to be for handicapped individuals. You were a jerk for taking it. You will likely win if you fight the ticket because the pavement is not properly marked.
Quote:
Quoting
PandorasBox
OK, I live with a handicapper, and lived with one before.
My observations:
- Hard to tell if there is are blue lines in that spot, but I think I do think they are very faded. This might keep you out of a ticket. I'd go back and take a pic kissing the ground.....if it is faded...I mean the yellow lines are very clear.
- But...the placement of the sign says this is handicapped. So.....that would work for the ticketing agency.
LOGIC: When in doubt....see a sign, see a blue/yellow combo...park further out, save yourself the hassle and fine.
As for your citation...it should have a website to punch in and find out how who to contact to contest it, or a date to appear in court by.
Re: Parking in a Handicapped Spot With No Blue Lines, Sign Off-Center
Quote:
(a) It shall be prohibited to park any motor vehicle which is not properly displaying registration plates or decals issued to a person with disabilities, as defined by Section 1-159.1, pursuant to Sections 3-616, 11-1301.1 or 11-1301.2, or to a disabled veteran pursuant to Section 3-609 of this Act, as evidence that the vehicle is operated by or for a person with disabilities or disabled veteran, in any parking place, including any private or public offstreet parking facility, specifically reserved, by the posting of an official sign as designated under Section 11-301, for motor vehicles displaying such registration plates.
the only statutory requirement is the sign. and under
Quote:
(c) Any person found guilty of violating the provisions of subsection (a) shall be fined $250 in addition to any costs or charges connected with the removal or storage of any motor vehicle authorized under this Section; but municipalities by ordinance may impose a fine up to $350 and shall display signs indicating the fine imposed. If the amount of the fine is subsequently changed, the municipality shall change the sign to indicate the current amount of the fine. It shall not be a defense to a charge under this Section that either the sign posted pursuant to this Section or the intended accessible parking place does not comply with the technical requirements of Section 11-301, Department regulations, or local ordinance if a reasonable person would be made aware by the sign or notice on or near the parking place that the place is reserved for a person with disabilities.
the sign being out of spec does not even allow you to get out of the ticket as long as it is a handicapped sign
(both quotes from Mr K's link)