Pointing and Presenting a Firearm

My question involves criminal law for the state of: South Carolina

So basically my father recently came into the house I am living in (grandmother's house), my father having legal right to be there (recently appointed PoA) and threatened to kill me, got violent (spit on me, pushed me, charged at me), and I was in fear of my life and ran to my bedroom and pointed an unloaded shotgun at him warning him that he needs to leave. He leaves, I lock the door, and call the police.

My dad completely lied to the police, saying he never even entered the house. He is being charged with assault and battery, and I am being charged with pointing and presenting. He is twice my size, so I had no other option to protect my life at the time.

My question is: am I likely to be convicted of this crime? He will probably lie to the end, saying he was never in the house, so it will wind up being my word against his.

I have been arrested twice in my life, never for anything violent, once for driving on suspended license, and once for "resisting without violence" for telling an officer what i thought when being ticketed for jaywalking.

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Here is a more thorough, detailed version of events for anyone interested:

Course of events:

- At roughly 3:45 PM I am sitting in my bedroom, watching TV, when I hear the front door open. I assumed it was my father, because he had entered the house the previous night and threatened to come back and harm me.

- Dad enters home, goes directly to washer/dryer

- I stand nearby, to ensure he doesn't steal anything, and to be ready in case he got violent, since he threatened me the previous night, which prompted me to call the police at that time.

- He begins bragging about how he has all the power now and how he can do whatever he wants, and says he won't have to "deal with me anymore" after he "gets rid of me"

- I ask him "how do you plan to rip off Grandma this time?"

- He says "i don't have to explain myself to you" and continues bragging about being able to do whatever he wants now and having all the power, and walks up to me and gets in my face, asking me to come "fight him outside" as he threatened the previous night

- He begins walking towards the front door, and i said "you are the biggest coward i have ever known because all you know to do in life is to threaten people with violence, and to be violent and intimidate people."

- He turns around, near the front door but inside, and walked towards me very aggressively and gets right in my face, clearly what i said struck a deep nerve and set him off, and he gets in my face and screams as loud as he can "I WILL KILL YOU AFTER I BREAK YOU", so loudly that I would be surprised if the neighbors did not hear it, and then he spits in my face, and pushes me back which isn't hard to do with me being 155 lbs.

- At this point I immediately turned around and ran towards my bedroom, being half of his size and knowing he has a long history of horrendous violence, seeing a lot of his violence myself in my childhood, and through learning of his violent criminal records, and his extensive history of martial arts, and knew that my life was in serious danger. So I ran to my bedroom and grabbed an unloaded .410 shotgun and pointed it at him in an attempt to end the threat to my life by scaring him out of the house so i can have enough time to call the police without anyone getting hurt, at which point the police were called and thankfully nobody was hurt.

Although you may or may not have had a duty to retreat, by going to your bedroom you pretty much mitigated the imminent threat. Did you close the bedroom door while calling 911? If, once in the bedroom, you would've stayed there with the door closed and 911 on the line, you would've at least established that your action(s) were defensive. Once you grabbed the gun and advanced, you became an agressor. Say you woulda closed the door and he came bustin' through it, THEN, you woulda had a pretty reasonable argument for reasonably being in fear for your safety.

If you're that much in fear then head for the backdoor/window/fire escape. I know that sounds like the sissyfied thing to do, but depedent on the specifics, once you turn tail then turn back for no good reason, you change the whole dynamic.

One more thing......an unloaded long gun in the sort of altercation you describe has the potential for becoming a popsicle stick. Jack a round in that chamber and you best be prepared to be able to convince twelve folks that your actions were reasonable.

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Quoting souperdave

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Although you may or may not have had a duty to retreat, by going to your bedroom you pretty much mitigated the imminent threat. Did you close the bedroom door while calling 911? If, once in the bedroom, you would've stayed there with the door closed and 911 on the line, you would've at least established that your action(s) were defensive. Once you grabbed the gun and advanced, you became an agressor. Say you woulda closed the door and he came bustin' through it, THEN, you woulda had a pretty reasonable argument for reasonably being in fear for your safety.

If you're that much in fear then head for the backdoor/window/fire escape. I know that sounds like the sissyfied thing to do, but depedent on the specifics, once you turn tail then turn back for no good reason, you change the whole dynamic.

One more thing......an unloaded long gun in the sort of altercation you describe has the potential for becoming a popsicle stick. Jack a round in that chamber and you best be prepared to be able to convince twelve folks that your actions were reasonable.

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Thank you for the thoughts and the information. However, when I grabbed the firearm, I never advanced or went towards him. I didn't know if he was RIGHT behind me about to kill me or cause serious harm to me, or not chasing me, and I couldn't take any chances, so I ran right to my gun, grabbed it, and turned around (it was right by my bedroom door). So I guess I didn't advance at all, but I had to turn around to see if he was about to kill me or whatever. That's when he left the house, and I closed the front door and locked it and called police. I didn't have time to call the police at the moment because it wouldn't have been helpful had he been right behind me.

Thanks again for the thoughts and response, it is much appreciated

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dEGOnstruct;847900]Thank you for the thoughts and the information. However, when I grabbed the firearm, I never advanced or went towards him.

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you threatened him with a weapon.

but the bigger problem is;

you antagonized him into responding. Granted what he did was wrong but you yammering as you were did nothing but infuriate him. You say he had threatened you the night before so why didn't you simply call the police when he came into the house, with you staying in your room?

by what right did your father enter the house? Did your grandmother grant him permission to enter the home? I presume you didn't. A POA does not allow one to trespass into the principal's home simply because they are the agent of a POA. It gives them the right to act on behalf of the principal for whatever purposes the POA is granted.

and your argument he was going to kill you is BS. If you really thought that you would not have initiated the contact as you had but simply called the police when he entered the home. Your rouse of "watching him so he wouldn't steal anything" will show you did not fear he would carry out the threat from the night before.

how is it your father is charged with assault and battery if he claims he did not enter the house and apparently nobody has said anything about you exiting the house? Battery requires contact so either he was in the house or you were outside of the house. What is the belief of the police such that your father was charged?

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Quoting jk

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you threatened him with a weapon.

but the bigger problem is;

you antagonized him into responding. Granted what he did was wrong but you yammering as you were did nothing but infuriate him. You say he had threatened you the night before so why didn't you simply call the police when he came into the house, with you staying in your room?

by what right did your father enter the house? Did your grandmother grant him permission to enter the home? I presume you didn't. A POA does not allow one to trespass into the principal's home simply because they are the agent of a POA. It gives them the right to act on behalf of the principal for whatever purposes the POA is granted.

and your argument he was going to kill you is BS. If you really thought that you would not have initiated the contact as you had but simply called the police when he entered the home. Your rouse of "watching him so he wouldn't steal anything" will show you did not fear he would carry out the threat from the night before.

how is it your father is charged with assault and battery if he claims he did not enter the house and apparently nobody has said anything about you exiting the house? Battery requires contact so either he was in the house or you were outside of the house. What is the belief of the police such that your father was charged?

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it's not bs at all. he came in the night before, being threatening and provocative, so i called the police. in fact he came in the night, without knocking at all, and i almost mistook him for a burgler. i realized it was him, and watched him go to the laundry room and stood back and watched to ensure he wouldnt steal anything. he started yapping, being aggressive, threatening, etc so i called the police then. he left before they came, and they basically said "oh well" and left even though he threatened to come back later

the later would be the day this incident took place, the next day. he started arguing and bragging about how my grandmother, who just had a stroke, granted him PoA so that he could "do whatever he wants and has all the power now" basically bragging that he was going to wipe her clean, which disgusted me and he knew it, and then he went on to be aggressive and threatening as usual so i told him what i wanted to tell him for 30 years, which is that he's a violent coward for threatening, and so his response is to scream at my face, spit on me, threaten to kill me, and push me and kinda charge at me and so it's MY fault? damn, you really are itchy to be a dick. he's twice my size and my entire life growing up i've witnessed him be violent to many, many people. i can't tell you how many people he's beaten half to death, raped my mom, threatens pretty much everyone he comes across. but whatever. don't have much energy for trolls

Ah so grandma had a stroke and dad is planning on evicting his son who appears to be living off grandma. After calling 911, you wanted to prove what a little man you were so you came after him with a shotgun, when you were safe in your room. I do not see this turning out well for you unless you both arrange to drop the charges mutually. Had you pulled a shotgun on me, I would have made you use it or shoved it down your throat if you were my kid.

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Quoting Disagreeable

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Ah so grandma had a stroke and dad is planning on evicting his son who appears to be living off grandma. After calling 911, you wanted to prove what a little man you were so you came after him with a shotgun, when you were safe in your room. I do not see this turning out well for you unless you both arrange to drop the charges mutually. Had you pulled a shotgun on me, I would have made you use it or shoved it down your throat if you were my kid.

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Not living off grandma, helping an old woman who can't live alone. Why so hostile? I didn't call 911 and then "come after him with a shotgun" -- I ran to my bedroom since he had already initiated violence against me and was threatening to kill me, didn't know if I was being chased, assumed I was, and did the ONLY thing possible to ensure the safety of my life which is grab the firearm and turn around. I dont know if he began chasing me and then turned around, or if he didn't chase, but when I turned around he was close to the spot he was in when I ran. He then left the house, I locked the front door, and then I called 911 and stayed in the house.

I don't see why you people are so eager to be hostile and twist the story around

This man has a long rap sheet full of violent charges, and was being threatening the previous night already, which prompted me to call the police then as well.

He also lied on the police report, stating that he never entered the house at all on the day of the second incident.

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Quoting dEGOnstruct

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it's not bs at all. he came in the night before, being threatening and provocative, so i called the police. in fact he came in the night, without knocking at all, and i almost mistook him for a burgler. i realized it was him, and watched him go to the laundry room and stood back and watched to ensure he wouldnt steal anything. he started yapping, being aggressive, threatening, etc so i called the police then. he left before they came, and they basically said "oh well" and left even though he threatened to come back later

the later would be the day this incident took place, the next day. he started arguing and bragging about how my grandmother, who just had a stroke, granted him PoA so that he could "do whatever he wants and has all the power now" basically bragging that he was going to wipe her clean, which disgusted me and he knew it, and then he went on to be aggressive and threatening as usual so i told him what i wanted to tell him for 30 years, which is that he's a violent coward for threatening, and so his response is to scream at my face, spit on me, threaten to kill me, and push me and kinda charge at me and so it's MY fault? damn, you really are itchy to be a dick. he's twice my size and my entire life growing up i've witnessed him be violent to many, many people. i can't tell you how many people he's beaten half to death, raped my mom, threatens pretty much everyone he comes across. but whatever. don't have much energy for trolls

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It is BS because if you actually feared him due to the threats the night before you would have responded by calling the police when he entered the home. You didn't. You confronted him and even worse; used the opportunity to complain about all the wrongs you see he has committed over the years. Then when he responds as you actually expected him to, you run and grab a gun and threaten him.






as to trolls; take a look in the mirror because that is as close as you will get to one here.

the fact is; if you feared him so much you would not have confronted him. You would have stayed in your room and left him alone. It sounds a whole lot like you were egging him on with the intent of eventually shooting him.


Castle doctrine laws allow a lot of leeway for a person rightfully in their home to use lethal force to protect themselves but if you initiate the argument (which you did) and the other person was rightfully in the home (which you said he was), the castle doctrine laws are not going to save your ass from prison.




and you best hope the prosecutor believes you the weapon was not loaded. The charges can be a world of difference.

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dEGOnstruct;847986]Not living off grandma, helping an old woman who can't live alone. Why so hostile? I didn't call 911 and then "come after him with a shotgun" -- I ran to my bedroom since he had already initiated violence against me and was threatening to kill me, didn't know if I was being chased, assumed I was, and did the ONLY thing possible to ensure the safety of my life which is grab the firearm and turn around. I dont know if he began chasing me and then turned around, or if he didn't chase, but when I turned around he was close to the spot he was in when I ran. He then left the house, I locked the front door, and then I called 911 and stayed in the house.

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so why didn't you call 911 and then confront him?

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I don't see why you people are so eager to be hostile and twist the story around

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I don't see why you cannot understand you did a lot of really dumb things that day and whether you want to hear them or not, they are what may cause you to be convicted of the charges. Your claims of being afraid of him and your actions of confronting him just don't jive.

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This man has a long rap sheet full of violent charges, and was being threatening the previous night already, which prompted me to call the police then as well.

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yet this time you not only didn't call the police initially but went after him and initiated an argument. Pretty stupid.

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He also lied on the police report, stating that he never entered the house at all on the day of the second incident.

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so where were the two of you supposed to be when he committed this battery on you?

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Quoting jk

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It is BS because if you actually feared him due to the threats the night before you would have responded by calling the police when he entered the home. You didn't. You confronted him and even worse; used the opportunity to complain about all the wrongs you see he has committed over the years. Then when he responds as you actually expected him to, you run and grab a gun and threaten him.






as to trolls; take a look in the mirror because that is as close as you will get to one here.

the fact is; if you feared him so much you would not have confronted him. You would have stayed in your room and left him alone. It sounds a whole lot like you were egging him on with the intent of eventually shooting him.


Castle doctrine laws allow a lot of leeway for a person rightfully in their home to use lethal force to protect themselves but if you initiate the argument (which you did) and the other person was rightfully in the home (which you said he was), the castle doctrine laws are not going to save your ass from prison.




and you best hope the prosecutor believes you the weapon was not loaded. The charges can be a world of difference.

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so why didn't you call 911 and then confront him?

I don't see why you cannot understand you did a lot of really dumb things that day and whether you want to hear them or not, they are what may cause you to be convicted of the charges. Your claims of being afraid of him and your actions of confronting him just don't jive.

yet this time you not only didn't call the police initially but went after him and initiated an argument. Pretty stupid.

so where were the two of you supposed to be when he committed this battery on you?

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When he entered the house I got up to watch him because if i stayed in my room he'd wind up A) probably harming me while i'm sitting down or totally defenseless, and B) he'd wind up stealing things

I didn't call the police immediately when he entered the house because I simply didn't think to. First thing when someone enters the house, you check to see who it is and by then I'm far from my phone and not willing to show him my back, because it could be disasterous for me. When your adrenaline shoots up and you fear for your life you don't exactly plan for things as you would sitting at your computer in an AC room typing on some forums.

Also I never initiated an argument. He started arguing with me and making comments in the laundry room, and then he gets in my face and gets aggressive, threatens me to come outside with him, and then i REPLY by saying that he is a coward for always being violent and threatening with violence.

This causes him to become violent, and comes at me, at which point I had no option to defend myself other than what I did. Also I never "went after him" what so ever. He told police he never entered the house, which was a complete lie, because he knows he is guilty. The police's stance was neutral, and they were extremely friendly towards me

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dEGOnstruct;848004]When he entered the house I got up to watch him because if i stayed in my room he'd wind up A) probably harming me while i'm sitting down or totally defenseless, and B) he'd wind up stealing things

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you could close the door. That would give you time to stand if he attempted to enter.

and as to stealing things; call the police. Remember, this is a guy that you claim you fear is going to harm you. Only a fool, a 155 pound fool confronts a 300 pound person they truly believe will cause them harm.

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I didn't call the police immediately when he entered the house because I simply didn't think to. First thing when someone enters the house, you check to see who it is and by then I'm far from my phone and not willing to show him my back, because it could be disasterous for me. When your adrenaline shoots up and you fear for your life you don't exactly plan for things as you would sitting at your computer in an AC room typing on some forums.

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actually, you claim you stood back and observed him. That is when you needed to turn and call the police rather than initiate contact with him.

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Also I never initiated an argument. He started arguing with me and making comments in the laundry room, and then he gets in my face and gets aggressive, threatens me to come outside with him, and then i REPLY by saying that he is a coward for always being violent and threatening with violence.

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hmm, maybe my memory is bad.

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- Dad enters home, goes directly to washer/dryer

- I stand nearby, to ensure he doesn't steal anything, and to be ready in case he got violent, since he threatened me the previous night, which prompted me to call the police at that time.

- He begins bragging about how he has all the power now and how he can do whatever he wants, and says he won't have to "deal with me anymore" after he "gets rid of me"

- I ask him "how do you plan to rip off Grandma this time?"

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since an argument requires multiple parties, until you started responding, it was a guy rambling about whatever.

He may have spoken first but you are the one that turned it into an argument.

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This causes him to become violent, and comes at me, at which point I had no option to defend myself other than what I did.

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yet you claim your fear was so great but you are the one that placed yourself in close enough proximity that a physical altercation was possible. That refutes your claim of being in fear of him.

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Also I never "went after him" what so ever.

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but I do not believe I said you went after him. I said you confronted him and you continue to state that is true.

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He told police he never entered the house, which was a complete lie, because he knows he is guilty. The police's stance was neutral, and they were extremely friendly towards me

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the police were friendly towards you? Boy are you in trouble. Often times they are nice because they want the guilty party to confess to their actions.

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Quoting jk

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Castle doctrine laws allow a lot of leeway for a person rightfully in their home to use lethal force to protect themselves but if you initiate the argument (which you did) and the other person was rightfully in the home (which you said he was), the castle doctrine laws are not going to save your ass from prison.

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So, if I initiate an argument with someone who lives with me (by accusing that person of criminal wrongdoing), that person has the right to attack me, and I can't use the castle doctrine to defend myself?

As is apparent, you are not completely innocent in your actions. You are intimately familiar with the mind set and anger issues of your father and you claim to be in fear of being killed or harmed by him yet you confront him in a confined area of the house. That is not the action of someone who is in fear for their life. One knows if there is a 300 pound man chasing them down the hallway of a residence. That is why they call BS on your story. And no the Castle Doctrine would not help you.


I am curious though as to if he claims to have never entered the residence they are charging you with the presentment of a firearm from your bedroom. Unless of course he claims you brought it outside.

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Quoting John_28

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So, if I initiate an argument with someone who lives with me (by accusing that person of criminal wrongdoing), that person has the right to attack me, and I can't use the castle doctrine to defend myself?

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Not so fast dimbulb! If you start something then you should be ballsy enough to finish it logically. However, circumstantially dependent of course, if there's a point that reason and reasonability come into play, then you quite possibly may be able to respond as the situation dictates......or maybe not!

Stick that in your pipe and smoke it!