When Can a Hotel Room be Searched by the Police
My question involves criminal law for the state of: A person on the run for failure to appear to sentencing, 7 years prior for drug possession, is in a hotel room paid for by him, but in a friend’s name, basically the friend checked in. Upon their 6 day stay, the duo happen to catch a hotel chair inside their room on fire, it was extinguished and did not detonate a fire alarm, sprinkler system, and the fire department was not alerted. The hotel was unaware of the incident until the maid service entered the room the following day and noticed the burnt mark on the chair, they paid $100 fee for the damage to the chair. Later that evening the two ordered another room, moved their belongings to the new room and switched the chair out.
The following evening, nearly 20 hours later, the two left for a local retail store, but Josh forgot his cell phone. Josh is the one with the FOJ drug charge went back to the room to obtain his phone. While looking for his mobile device the door opened surprising him and a man identified himself as police and said josh’s name, and arrested him for FOJ. The room was completely packed up, no bags open, there were locked two safes inside a rolling trunk which was also. They completely packed the room to move or go home.
The police took his phone and texted contacts trying to lure them to the hotel. Josh was taken to jail for processing. Meanwhile Dan shows up, and got off the elevator on the 5th floor. Keep in mind this is a very large hotel with 60-70 rooms per floor. Upon stepping out of the elevator he was immediately detained and taken to the police outside of Josh’s hotel room door. His “consented” search leads to the discovery of a gun, to which he was arrested for possession of a concealed fire arm without a permit.
The discovery states, that when Dan stepped out of the elevator and saw police and firemen, he yelled loudly, “where is Josh?”. Then the document states he consented to a search. HE never consented to a search, nor yelled where is josh, but a Discovery is considered fact and truthful.
When Josh was taken out of the hotel there were two unmarked police vehicles parked in parking spots, and he was taken to jail in one of those unmarked cars. When Dan arrived parked in the back did not see the vehicles, but when he was leaving as Lisa was arriving many emergency vehicles including police, fire trucks, and ambulances, were parked outside the entrance with no flashing emergency lights. They were just there parked.
Lisa takes the elevator to 5th floor, and hears voices and commotion, so she immediately hits the elevator down button. As she waits for the elevator to return to the floor, a fireman walks up and waits with her. She asks innocently, “What’s going on? Is everyone or everything ok?” Fireman responds with, “Yeah, just two TWEEKERS were trying to burn down the place with a butane torch”. The chair fire, or scalding, happened 20 hours or the day before and the damages had already been compensated for by Josh and JP, which leads me to believe they were trying to establish “exigent circumstances” to cover their rear ends for entering an occupied hotel room without a warrant, but still trying and create charges for Dan and Josh.
Josh was taken to FOJ County, sentenced, served 4 of his 36 months and was then taken back to the county of the hotel incident. His inmate search page shows the following.
Arrested for: 18-18-403.5(1),(2)(A) POSSESSION OF A CONTROLLED SUBSTANCE (seven years prior and the FOJ?)
Bond Amount: $0.00 Bond Type: SENTENCED
Held For Agency: FOJ COUNTY SO
Arrested for: 16-19-103 FOJ WANTED BY OTHER AGENCY FELONY
Next Scheduled Court Date: 10/2/2014 9:30:00AM
Bond Amount: $50,000.00 Bond Type: CASH/SURETY
Held For Agency: hotel COUNTY COURTS
What does this mean?
Dan, the one that got off of elevator and search, is this even legal? He could have been going to any room on that floor, and let’s say he did say, “where is Josh?”, it’s possible, that another Josh could have been a guest on that floor or hotel as well. And my question isn’t should they be in trouble, my question is, we have rights for a reason, to make our country the land of the free, without upholding our constitutional rights, we are no better than a communist country that imprisons indefinitely by fabrication. Were the rights of Josh or Dan infringed and do they possibly have a chance of having the cases thrown out and / or a multi-million dollar lawsuit against a large hotel chain for privacy violation of a paying guest.
The friend or JP whose name was on the room, was allowed to leave, and he has not been charged with anything to date.
Both people are good people and are serving plenty of time for other things. Do they have any chance at seeing their 20's-30's?
Re: No Warrant Occupied Hotel Room Search Rights
Please tell me what law you believe exists that prohibits the hotel from complying with a police request, or, for that matter, provides a hotel guest with guaranteed "privacy rights".
Re: No Warrant Occupied Hotel Room Search Rights
The hotel can authorize a premises search based on the activities. Seriously, they are good people who just happen to go to jail once in a while?
Re: No Warrant Occupied Hotel Room Search Rights
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Disagreeable
The hotel can authorize a premises search based on the activities. Seriously, they are good people who just happen to go to jail once in a while?
"Right of Privacy in Hotel Room Lawyers
Can a Hotel Employee Enter My Room without My Permission?
Generally, if you are using your hotel room in an ordinary way, then you have a limited right of privacy in the room. However, if the hotel believes that you are engaging in illegal acts, then hotel management has the right to enter and search your room without your permission. Under no circumstances can the hotel authorize the police to conduct a search of your room without your consent or without a proper search warrant."
Re: No Warrant Occupied Hotel Room Search Rights
Before we go any further with this, who are you in this scenario?
Yes, it matters.
Re: No Warrant Occupied Hotel Room Search Rights
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Disagreeable
The hotel can authorize a premises search based on the activities. Seriously, they are good people who just happen to go to jail once in a while?
based on what activities? The chair issue that took place in a different room a day earlier?
I think not.
the big problem is;
the guy was a wanted felon. I would have to research it but off the top of my head, they don't need a warrant to enter to arrest the felon if they believe he is in the room.
augamini2
the state may make a difference. You did not provide a state like you were asked.
Re: No Warrant Occupied Hotel Room Search Rights
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cbg
Before we go any further with this, who are you in this scenario?
Yes, it matters.
I am none of these people. I am an outside friend, who just wants them to not get totally nailed to the wall. Colorado has a thirst for felonies for some reason. I am interest in the way things work in the legal world, and sadly Ive been completely floored by how lady justice wears her blind scarf, but I believe horse blinders would be more realistic in todays legal world. How does over crowding the jails with petty crimes benefit:
1. the cop who has more work to do now, court, paper work ect? unless he is given a monetary incentive to work harder and arrest more people.
2: The Judicial branch, unless they own the halfway houses and probation companies, because here in Colorado, you never can get out of the system for some reason.
3. Society. How can putting decent people in a cage with some real bad people benefit anyone?
4. Private Prisons, well, we know how they benefit, they have the state rent the facility that the tax payers already paid for, to the state for about its construction cost for one years rent, then charge per warm body. The cost for each person is more than putting each prisoner up a the Ritz Carlton or Four Seasons Denver about $400 a day, with two room service meals of Steak an lobster. Maybe then the inmates might like to stay if they had marble shows and 1000 thread egyptian cotton sheets. They are fed food that most Americans would not even bare to look at, and live in concrete cells, why some jerk makes off with millions of tax paying dollars a year, all because his brother was a senator or city councilman. Inmate families are to pay fees to give thier loved ones money, outlandish phone call prices, video visits at $13 a pop and commensary items that state on the label, not for individal retail sale. WOW, breaking the law right in front of those who are paying for their crimes. What a slap in the face..
Ive never been to jail, I'm law abiding, tax paying, normal person. But I think its time Normal people, help take our country back. These two goof balls getting arrest has opened my eyes to a side of society and government that makes me EMBARRASSED to be an AMERICAN, claiming to be free. Our rights are there for a reason, and just because some people think these two men "ought" to be in jail, does mean they should be in Jail if a safety net in our constitution, that helps keep this nation great, stops the process because procedure was not followed correctly, then thats our system at work. The police should have done more to prove these two mens guilt, instead of friends trying to disprove their charges with technicalities.
but in a nutshell.. thats how I fit in.
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jk
based on what activities? The chair issue that took place in a different room a day earlier?
I think not.
the big problem is;
the guy was a wanted felon. I would have to research it but off the top of my head, they don't need a warrant to enter to arrest the felon if they believe he is in the room.
augamini2
the state may make a difference. You did not provide a state like you were asked.
my bad, COLORADO. is my state. Denver, Colorado.
Re: No Warrant Occupied Hotel Room Search Rights
Yes or no question.
Were you, or were you not, present to witness these activities? Did you personally see what happened at the hotel?
Re: No Warrant Occupied Hotel Room Search Rights
No, i read the discovery and talked to lisa and dan.
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cbg
Yes or no question.
Were you, or were you not, present to witness these activities? Did you personally see what happened at the hotel?
No. Read discovery and spoke to lisa and dan.. For josh.. Why would he be sent back to hotel county of foj was for his 2006 failure to appear drug charge.. Which he is now sentenced for 3 years.. Which was done after the hotel incident
Im trying to decide if its worth paying for thier lawyer.. If its a losing battle.. Id rather buy a boat.. Not being rude to my friends but.. I dont want to just toss a large amount of money.
2006 he was 18 and had been on his own since 13 . Josh dropped out of the 8th grade. He is one of the smartest.. Well read.. Traveled people i know. You would think he was a product of harvard. An 18 year old mind set of a homeless prodigy who survived on his own since the age of 13 and a 26 man trying to put his life together are two very different people. Not everyone lives the family portrait life.. But does that make thier way of life wrong?
Re: No Warrant Occupied Hotel Room Search Rights
Since you were not there, you do not know what actually happened. You don't know how much of your friends' descriptions were self-serving.
Re: No Warrant Occupied Hotel Room Search Rights
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cbg
Since you were not there, you do not know what actually happened. You don't know how much of your friends' descriptions were self-serving.
True but im beginning to think noone here is a lawyer and throwing ideas that can be self serving as well.. Lets image all statements are true. In a perfect world were thier rights violated? In the digital age we live there are cameras in the elevator. Elevator lobby.. And the end of the hall where the room was located at the stairwells. They have sound as well
Re: No Warrant Occupied Hotel Room Search Rights
Identification of a wanted felon by staff. Officer walks up to desk, shows picture says have you seen this guy? Clerk says yep he is in room 27. Officer says can I have a key to that room please. What is clerk going to say "No, we harbor criminals from justice, get out of here Copper!!!"?
I once bounced over 60 teens from a property I was a manager at for partying. By the time I got back to the lobby, the police had stopped and were at the front desk. The saw all the people pouring out the front doors and thought the place was on fire.
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jk
based on what activities? The chair issue that took place in a different room a day earlier?
I think not.
the big problem is;
the guy was a wanted felon. I would have to research it but off the top of my head, they don't need a warrant to enter to arrest the felon if they believe he is in the room.
augamini2
the state may make a difference. You did not provide a state like you were asked.
Re: No Warrant Occupied Hotel Room Search Rights
as I said before, he is a wanted felon. I believe that gives them the right to act as they did.
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Were the rights of Josh or Dan infringed and do they possibly have a chance of having the cases thrown out and
no way to tell since nobody here has all the facts
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/ or a multi-million dollar lawsuit against a large hotel chain for privacy violation of a paying guest.
for what? What did the hotel do?
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Disagreeable
Identification of a wanted felon by staff. Officer walks up to desk, shows picture says have you seen this guy? Clerk says yep he is in room 27. Officer says can I have a key to that room please. What is clerk going to say "No, we harbor criminals from justice, get out of here Copper!!!"?
ya lost me. What are you addressing here?
Re: No Warrant Occupied Hotel Room Search Rights
I am addressing your apparent thought the staff could not issue a key and authorize a search of the room for a wanted criminal. Once in the room the police have probable cause and staff permission to search the room for safety of other guests in hotel. Whenever possible, staff should accompany the officer in such an instance.
Re: No Warrant Occupied Hotel Room Search Rights
He already had a warrant out for him, that is the part you are not comprehending correctly.
Re: No Warrant Occupied Hotel Room Search Rights
there was a warrant for his arrest for 6 or 7 years, but the room was not in his name, they created a fake fire the next day to justify the entry, they had paid the $100 fine the morning of the incident, which happened around 9pm-11pm. So if they had already paid for the damage their torch did to the chair, then why would the fire department be there? on the floor, in their room... maybe to create a reason for entry.
Re: No Warrant Occupied Hotel Room Search Rights
An arrest warrant often gives the police the right to make entry to a location where he is residing in order to affect the arrest. A search is a different matter, but, if one or both of them were also on some form of probation opr parole, or out on conditional release where they waived their 4th Amendment rights, then that would also give the police the right to make entry.
Of course Colorado goes after felons! Felonies are serious criminal offenses, and one has to TRY to commit a felony and then to abscond! It's not an accident.
The defendants will be (or were) assigned legal counsel if they cannot afford their own. Their attorneys can determine if there is any chance to suppress any evidence located at the scene. You were not there, you only know what your criminal pals are telling you and what you have read ... which may not be all the information available.
In any event, this is a matter for your friends to discuss with their attorneys. If they discuss their activity with YOU, then the state can call YOU to testify against them! No, you cannot plead the Fifth, and you cannot refuse to answer questions made to you in court. So, if you hope to help them, then encourage them to speak with their attorneys and no one else.
Maybe NOW they can resolve their legal issues, complete their sentences and any probation/parole and/or drug rehab and maybe they will become drug free and productive members of society. (And not a risk to any further structures when they try and smoke meth!)
Re: When Can a Hotel Room be Searched by the Police
that was confusing. they burnt the chair... on wed night... hotel staff notices thursday morning, they pay a fee for the damage, rent a new room, move items to new room, and took the burnt chair because it now was thier chair since they paid for it. this occured at 10:00am. The card was ran for the chair that was burned and they rented under a new reservation a new room, took their burnt chair which belonged to them to the new room, and then moved the chair from the new room that was not destroyed to the old room upon check out check in. THe burnt chair was in their new room because it now belonged to them, it was a desk chair. THis is all at a very nice Boutique hotel that cost $200-$300 a night. At 9pm the night after the "fire" that hotel never knew about, just a spot on the chair was discovered by the maid, so they bought the chair and changed room taking thus burnt chair now their property, they went to get some things at walgreens, josh forgot his phone, the police entered the room, like they waited for him to leave, but he came back while they grouped and were inroute to the room, which should have been unoccupied, but since the hotel is large, josh got thier first, thus being just as surprised as they were the room was occupied, he was taken off, dan showed up 20-30 mins laer, was pulled from the elevator and search on a floor that had over 60 hotel rooms. Lisa shows up as dan is being taken out and sees all the "emergency vehicles" with no emergency lights on. Josh said two unmarked police cars were in the parking lot when he left in one of those vehicles... meaning, the fire department and ambulance and police cars, none with flashing lights showed up a day after the chair, now thier property, was singed, , josh had been taken out and no emergency vehicles,,,, dan taken out emergency vehicles no emergency,,, there was no fire..fireman tells lisa, tweekers trying to burn down the building with a torch.. but no fire.
Re: When Can a Hotel Room be Searched by the Police
And how do you, or any of them, know whether or not the police showed a search warrant to the hotel staff?
Re: No Warrant Occupied Hotel Room Search Rights
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augemini02
A person on the run for failure to appear to sentencing, 7 years prior for drug possession, is in a hotel room paid for by him, but in a friend’s name, basically the friend checked in.... Josh is the one with the FOJ drug charge went back to the room to obtain his phone. While looking for his mobile device the door opened surprising him and a man identified himself as police and said josh’s name, and arrested him for FOJ.
You left out the part that would explain how the police found out that Josh was staying at the hotel, and that he was a fugitive. It wasn't guesswork.
Also, how did the door open? You have not indicated that the police officer had a key / key card. You have not indicated that anybody opened the door for the officer.
Please provide the missing information.
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Quoting augemini02
Upon stepping out of the elevator he was immediately detained and taken to the police outside of Josh’s hotel room door. His “consented” search leads to the discovery of a gun, to which he was arrested for possession of a concealed fire arm without a permit.
You have left out more key facts. You later indicate that Dan is not the person who rented the hotel room. So why is it that Dan knew where the hotel room was, and had his gun in the hotel room? If you are telling us that it's not Dan's hotel room, that he wasn't staying in the room, then you're indicating that it was not his rights that would have been violated by a search of the room. It doesn't help us when you withhold key facts.
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Quoting augemini02
She asks innocently, “What’s going on? Is everyone or everything ok?” Fireman responds with, “Yeah, just two TWEEKERS were trying to burn down the place with a butane torch”.
If Josh is a tweaker, perhaps he left out the part of the story where he was again smoking meth in the hotel room on the day the police arrested him.
You seem to be numbering the tweakers at four. Why were the police focused on Dan and Josh, not the guy who rented the room or Lisa?
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Quoting augemini02
The chair fire, or scalding, happened 20 hours or the day before and the damages had already been compensated for by Josh and JP, which leads me to believe they were trying to establish “exigent circumstances” to cover their rear ends for entering an occupied hotel room without a warrant, but still trying and create charges for Dan and Josh.
In the real world, it would be much easier to just get an arrest warrant for the fugitive. For all we know, they had one.
One possibility is that the hotel has a policy of reporting suspicious fires to the police, and when the police investigated they found evidence of criminal activity (i.e., illegal drug use) in the room, triggering further investigation. (Believe it or not, large hotels aren't fond of being used as drug houses, or having drug users set their rooms on fire.) You would have to tell us how, in that process, they figured out who Josh was.
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Quoting augemini02
His inmate search page shows the following.... What does this mean?
It sounds like he's facing a drug charge for the drugs he had in the hotel room, and remains on a hold due to his probation violation and underlying sentence.
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Quoting augemini02
Dan, the one that got off of elevator and search, is this even legal? He could have been going to any room on that floor, and let’s say he did say, “where is Josh?”, it’s possible, that another Josh could have been a guest on that floor or hotel as well.
Yet Dan was recognized by the police immediately upon his getting out of the elevator? There are a lot of facts you're choosing not to share with us.
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Quoting augemini02
Were the rights of Josh or Dan infringed and do they possibly have a chance of having the cases thrown out....
You would have to fill in the missing information about how the police came to find Josh. Under your incomplete account, it's not clear whether Dan had any privacy rights in relation to the hotel room.
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Quoting augemini02
...and / or a multi-million dollar lawsuit against a large hotel chain for privacy violation of a paying guest.
You said they were tweakers -- that sort of fantasy suggests that they're on crack.
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augemini02
there was a warrant for his arrest for 6 or 7 years, but the room was not in his name, they created a fake fire the next day to justify the entry, they had paid the $100 fine the morning of the incident, which happened around 9pm-11pm. So if they had already paid for the damage their torch did to the chair, then why would the fire department be there? on the floor, in their room... maybe to create a reason for entry.
I would put the odds of a hotel deeming the replacement cost of a chair at $100 to be roughly zero percent. Exaggerating only slightly, I believe that's more in line with what hotels bill as the replacement cost of a bath towel.