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Alimony After 5-Year Marriage

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  • 08-02-2014, 01:58 PM
    Disagreeable
    Re: Alimony After 5-Year Marriage
    Hmmmm, From what I read it clearly says the court can order one spouse to pay the other.

    Quote:

    (750 ILCS 5/504) (from Ch. 40, par. 504)
    Sec. 504. Maintenance.
    (a) In a proceeding for dissolution of marriage or legal separation or declaration of invalidity of marriage, or a proceeding for maintenance following dissolution of the marriage by a court which lacked personal jurisdiction over the absent spouse, the court may grant a temporary or permanent maintenance award for either spouse in amounts and for periods of time as the court deems just, without regard to marital misconduct, in gross or for fixed or indefinite periods of time, and the maintenance may be paid from the income or property of the other spouse after consideration of all relevant factors, including:
    (1) the income and property of each party, including

    marital property apportioned and non-marital property assigned to the party seeking maintenance;
    (2) the needs of each party;
    (3) the present and future earning capacity of each

    party;
    (4) any impairment of the present and future earning

    capacity of the party seeking maintenance due to that party devoting time to domestic duties or having forgone or delayed education, training, employment, or career opportunities due to the marriage;
    (5) the time necessary to enable the party seeking

    maintenance to acquire appropriate education, training, and employment, and whether that party is able to support himself or herself through appropriate employment or is the custodian of a child making it appropriate that the custodian not seek employment;
    (6) the standard of living established during the

    marriage;
    (7) the duration of the marriage;
    (8) the age and the physical and emotional condition

    of both parties;
    (9) the tax consequences of the property division

    upon the respective economic circumstances of the parties;
    (10) contributions and services by the party seeking

    maintenance to the education, training, career or career potential, or license of the other spouse;
    (11) any valid agreement of the parties; and
    (12) any other factor that the court expressly finds

    to be just and equitable.
    (b) (Blank).
    (b-5) Any maintenance obligation including any unallocated maintenance and child support obligation, or any portion of any support obligation, that becomes due and remains unpaid shall accrue simple interest as set forth in Section 505 of this Act.
    (b-7) Any new or existing maintenance order including any unallocated maintenance and child support order entered by the court under this Section shall be deemed to be a series of judgments against the person obligated to pay support thereunder. Each such judgment to be in the amount of each payment or installment of support and each such judgment to be deemed entered as of the date the corresponding payment or installment becomes due under the terms of the support order, except no judgment shall arise as to any installment coming due after the termination of maintenance as provided by Section 510 of the Illinois Marriage and Dissolution of Marriage Act or the provisions of any order for maintenance. Each such judgment shall have the full force, effect and attributes of any other judgment of this State, including the ability to be enforced. Notwithstanding any other State or local law to the contrary, a lien arises by operation of law against the real and personal property of the obligor for each installment of overdue support owed by the obligor.
    (c) The court may grant and enforce the payment of maintenance during the pendency of an appeal as the court shall deem reasonable and proper.
    (d) No maintenance shall accrue during the period in which a party is imprisoned for failure to comply with the court's order for the payment of such maintenance.
    (e) When maintenance is to be paid through the clerk of the court in a county of 1,000,000 inhabitants or less, the order shall direct the obligor to pay to the clerk, in addition to the maintenance payments, all fees imposed by the county board under paragraph (3) of subsection (u) of Section 27.1 of the Clerks of Courts Act. Unless paid in cash or pursuant to an order for withholding, the payment of the fee shall be by a separate instrument from the support payment and shall be made to the order of the Clerk.
    (f) An award ordered by a court upon entry of a dissolution judgment or upon entry of an award of maintenance following a reservation of maintenance in a dissolution judgment may be reasonably secured, in whole or in part, by life insurance on the payor's life on terms as to which the parties agree, or, if they do not agree, on such terms determined by the court, subject to the following:
    (1) With respect to existing life insurance, provided

    the court is apprised through evidence, stipulation, or otherwise as to level of death benefits, premium, and other relevant data and makes findings relative thereto, the court may allocate death benefits, the right to assign death benefits, or the obligation for future premium payments between the parties as it deems just.
    (2) To the extent the court determines that its award

    should be secured, in whole or in part, by new life insurance on the payor's life, the court may only order:
    (i) that the payor cooperate on all appropriate

    steps for the payee to obtain such new life insurance; and
    (ii) that the payee, at his or her sole option

    and expense, may obtain such new life insurance on the payor's life up to a maximum level of death benefit coverage, or descending death benefit coverage, as is set by the court, such level not to exceed a reasonable amount in light of the court's award, with the payee or the payee's designee being the beneficiary of such life insurance.
    In determining the maximum level of death benefit

    coverage, the court shall take into account all relevant facts and circumstances, including the impact on access to life insurance by the maintenance payor. If in resolving any issues under paragraph (2) of this subsection (f) a court reviews any submitted or proposed application for new insurance on the life of a maintenance payor, the review shall be in camera.
    (3) A judgment shall expressly set forth that all

    death benefits paid under life insurance on a payor's life maintained or obtained pursuant to this subsection to secure maintenance are designated as excludable from the gross income of the maintenance payee under Section 71(b)(1)(B) of the Internal Revenue Code, unless an agreement or stipulation of the parties otherwise provides.
    (Source: P.A. 97-186, eff. 7-22-11; 97-608, eff. 1-1-12; 97-813, eff. 7-13-12.)
  • 08-02-2014, 02:07 PM
    Mr. Knowitall
    Re: Alimony After 5-Year Marriage
    You were asked about your made-up "One month per year of marriage" rule. You cited the statute. It doesn't support you.
  • 08-02-2014, 03:32 PM
    Disagreeable
    Re: Alimony After 5-Year Marriage
    You misinterpreted what I was saying then. I was referring to the discussion about maintenance can be ordered.


    Quote:

    Quoting Mr. Knowitall
    View Post
    You were asked about your made-up "One month per year of marriage" rule. You cited the statute. It doesn't support you.

  • 08-03-2014, 02:29 AM
    llworking
    Re: Alimony After 5-Year Marriage
    Quote:

    Quoting budwad
    View Post
    No IIworking, you are not seeing what I'm saying. If the respondents reach an agreement to have the spouse requesting alimony receive a lump sum payment buyout of alimony of what present day dollars are worth for the alimony (over the time that they would normally receive alimony), then it is over. There are no alimony payments. The payment is categorized as EQ distribution. No taxes.

    Of course there are no taxes on a distribution of marital property...other than taxes paid on anything that comes out of a retirement account.

    However....you still are not getting it. He gets to deduct money he pays as alimony. It reduces his taxes significantly if he does. It does not matter where he sources the money, he still gets to deduct it from his taxes. For someone who is only going to be paying alimony for two years, and someone in his marginal tax bracket, it would be ludicrous to give up the tax deduction in favor of an adjustment to the property settlement. I can see it perhaps being worthwhile in a situation where alimony could be for a much longer term, but in a short term alimony case it again, would be ludicrous.
  • 08-03-2014, 03:13 PM
    budwad
    Re: Alimony After 5-Year Marriage
    Quote:

    Quoting llworking
    View Post
    Of course there are no taxes on a distribution of marital property...other than taxes paid on anything that comes out of a retirement account.

    However....you still are not getting it. He gets to deduct money he pays as alimony. It reduces his taxes significantly if he does. It does not matter where he sources the money, he still gets to deduct it from his taxes. For someone who is only going to be paying alimony for two years, and someone in his marginal tax bracket, it would be ludicrous to give up the tax deduction in favor of an adjustment to the property settlement. I can see it perhaps being worthwhile in a situation where alimony could be for a much longer term, but in a short term alimony case it again, would be ludicrous.

    No llworking, I really do get it. But you are looking at strictly from the financial and tax ramifications of the agreement to make a lump sum payment as opposed to paying it out monthly as a maintenance support payment. I am not disagreeing with you based on your position. I am looking at it from a different point of view.

    I look at it from the point of view that the settlement is final. It may cost the paying spouse more but the settlement is a known figure and will not change if the supported spouse goes back to court for reconsideration.

    If in the 5 years that payments will be made, the paying spouse gets a better job or comes into a windfall or maybe wins the lottery, the supported spouse can not go back to court. And not knowing the character of the people involved, that maybe something that is of value.
  • 08-03-2014, 04:13 PM
    drthyrd
    Re: Alimony After 5-Year Marriage
    Quote:

    Quoting Dogmatique
    View Post
    She's 30, with am apparently decent degree - it would not be unreasonable to argue that she's more than capable of joining the workforce sooner rather than later. She hasn't really given up a career in order to raise the children.

    Still, an attorney is the best move.

    I love you Doggie, but disagree professionally. Five years is LONG time to be out of the workforce and reenter in a professional capacity. It doesn't mean it won't happen, but it is possible (if not probable) the worth of her degree has diminished, especially if she never worked or worked for only a very short time in her field. It would be easier to enter a field directly out of college than to enter after five years as a SAHM. She is at a considerable disadvantage at this point - one that time/effort/connections could overcome, but still a disadvantage.
  • 08-03-2014, 05:04 PM
    Dogmatique
    Re: Alimony After 5-Year Marriage
    Quote:

    Quoting drthyrd
    View Post
    I love you Doggie, but disagree professionally. Five years is LONG time to be out of the workforce and reenter in a professional capacity. It doesn't mean it won't happen, but it is possible (if not probable) the worth of her degree has diminished, especially if she never worked or worked for only a very short time in her field. It would be easier to enter a field directly out of college than to enter after five years as a SAHM. She is at a considerable disadvantage at this point - one that time/effort/connections could overcome, but still a disadvantage.

    Okay, I can agree with that - I just cannot for the life of me turn that into justification for alimony and I think an attorney would bristle if his client was offering that (actually it seems that OP's attorney is bristling). I do wish though that OP would return and let us know why his attorney is balking.
  • 08-03-2014, 06:21 PM
    llworking
    Re: Alimony After 5-Year Marriage
    Quote:

    Quoting budwad
    View Post
    No llworking, I really do get it. But you are looking at strictly from the financial and tax ramifications of the agreement to make a lump sum payment as opposed to paying it out monthly as a maintenance support payment. I am not disagreeing with you based on your position. I am looking at it from a different point of view.

    I look at it from the point of view that the settlement is final. It may cost the paying spouse more but the settlement is a known figure and will not change if the supported spouse goes back to court for reconsideration.

    If in the 5 years that payments will be made, the paying spouse gets a better job or comes into a windfall or maybe wins the lottery, the supported spouse can not go back to court. And not knowing the character of the people involved, that maybe something that is of value
    .

    Ah...I get it now...you are completely misunderstanding alimony. You are assuming that it is absolutely final. That is not correct at all. Any agreement for alimony can and should be written that allows alimony to cease under certain conditions. On top of that, some states even outline when alimony can cease, even if its not written into the agreement.

    You are inaccurately basing your opinion on the fact that you don't understand that conditions can and should be placed on alimony.
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