My question involves a child custody case from the State of: PA
Hi, been divorced 7 years now. We have twins that are almost 17. There is a custody order in place with shared physical and legal custody, sunday-sunday. For about 6 months now, one kid (A) has wanted to spend more time at mom's and we (Ex and I) verbally agreed with that. Our other kid (B) is staying with the 50-50.
They graduate high school in ~1.5 years (End of custody & support). My kids are very close to their mom. We have not used lawyers in several years (we both let our lawyers go) and have mediated a custody modification and dealt with DRO for support recalculations on our own without attorneys. I give mom extra money and we have learned to be somewhat accommodating but now Ex is not so cooperative.
Long story short, I have an oppty to start a business in VT requiring me to move. I have tried to discuss this with Ex, but she will not allow for me to relocate, with or without the kids...The kids need to stay in their school district, with friends, etc. Ex is single mom, and her mother (kids grandma) has moved into her house and helps. I have said that I can pay more support, lets work it out together, its better in the long run. I also proposed that the custody be 80-20 (Me @ 20%) but she won't hear of it. My kids prefer to live with their mom full time....whenever I travel for work during my weeks, my kids want to stay at their mom's. In other words, they are fine with this, but they don't want to push for it since "Mom gets mad when we bring up staying at her place most of the time". Mom is more than capable at caring for the kids, but she is bitter. Believe me, I would not be doing this if my kids weren't ok with it.
Custody Order only stipulates "Shared Physical Custody", the schedule (sun-sun) and Joint Legal Custody. There is no ordered parenting plan.
If I move to Vermont without the kids, my ex has threatened me with a "contempt of court" wrt to the custody order...can that happen? I understand that a contempt of a custody court order could result in fines, loss of custody and even up to 6 months in jail but everything I've read on the subject seems to deal with kidnapping, interference of custody, etc and I don't see that as the case here.
I've seen on some forums the mention that Visitation is a right, not an obligation? Does that apply here? Am I in contempt if I simply do not 'take' the girls on my weeks?
Obviously I'll need an attorney at some point, but I wanted to understand as much as possible before I start interviewing attorneys.
Thanks!
Moving to Another State With 50/50 Custody
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11-23-2013, 09:23 AMstevMoving to Another State With 50/50 Custody
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11-23-2013, 10:02 AMllworkingRe: Moving Away - Shared Custody 50-50When you have joint physical and legal custody they way that you do now, you ARE responsible for the children during your parenting time. Its different than visitation.Quote:
Quoting stev
She cannot stop you from moving away without the children. She could only stop you from moving away with the children. Obviously the timeshare/custody situation with the children will need to change and you will likely get hit with child support or more child support, but again, a judge couldn't stop you from moving if the judge wanted to do so. -
11-23-2013, 01:03 PMstevRe: Moving Away - Shared Custody 50-50
Thanks. So can she file a contempt of court petition (re: Custody Order)? If yes, then she will. What happens then? (I may want to file a petition to modify custody before I move and I believe a judge would wait for custody mod to be heard, correct? Please see the info I added below about my kids' disabilities.)
If I choose not to appear for said contempt of court (Custody Order) hearing, can i be fined, extradited, incarcerated?
If my ex is faced with primary custody, she'll claim it's too much burden or her. She claims she has to also care for her mother, but from what I see and hear, grandma while 86 YO, does help around the house and with kids often. What could a judge decide in light of that?
I should mention that our kids have special needs. One is very mildly autistic (fully functioning, can hold a job, smart and communicative/articulate), the other is in a wheelchair but is at grade level in school (Straight As!), has skills for work, communicative/articulate but does need an aide & overnight care. I am able to (and currently do) spare no expense for her care and aides. I have a very long list of benefits to my kids if they were to live primarily with mom, and I believe I have a workable 80-20% custody proposal...so I could file a petition to mod custody, but I know ex will not agree to it, so I see it as a waste of time unless it helps with the possible contempt hearing. I've asked ex to mediate with me on a custody mod (Switch to 80-20), but she says she will not agree to anything other than 50-50. 80-20 is the max I see possible given the travel demands on this venture. I am fully aware that an increase in CS is likely and that's not an issue.
Thoughts? Thanks again! -
11-23-2013, 01:48 PMllworkingRe: Moving Away - Shared Custody 50-50Again, a judge cannot force you to exercise 50/50 physical custody. The judge can only force you to be financially responsible for your children. Starting a business is a risky venture...and when you have two disabled children that you are responsible for that makes it even more risky. If I were in your shoes I would think long and hard about this. I really do understand where mom is coming from on this. I am not saying that you should flat out refuse the opportunity but you need to be certain that you are going to be able to meet both the current and added financial responsibility.Quote:
Quoting stev
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11-23-2013, 02:50 PMstevRe: Moving Away - Shared Custody 50-50
Thanks, can ex file a petition for contempt of court (custody order)?
If I choose not to appear for said contempt of court (Custody Order) hearing, can i be fined, extradited, or incarcerated? -
11-23-2013, 03:33 PMllworkingRe: Moving Away - Shared Custody 50-50Why would you even want to let it get to that point? Yes, all of those things are possible...but none of them are likely if you handle it properly court-wise and fulfill your financial obligations to your children.Quote:
Quoting stev
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11-23-2013, 06:02 PMstevRe: Moving Away - Shared Custody 50-50
She won't agree to any changes in the current custody order. I would prefer it doesn't get to this point, but it might. I don't see any options. If I pursue a custody mod and she doesn't agree, then it's up to the judge, and theres a good chance she won't approve the modification.
Financial obligations aren't an issue. I've always kept up with that, and in fact pay for more than what the court ordered. -
11-24-2013, 03:02 AMllworkingRe: Moving Away - Shared Custody 50-50Why do you think that a judge would not approve the modification? The judge cannot force you to not relocate. The judge doesn't have that authority.Quote:
Quoting stev
Financial obligations could rapidly become an issue with a new business startup...that was the point I was making. -
11-24-2013, 07:08 AMstevRe: Moving Away - Shared Custody 50-50
Sure, thanks. Wrt relocation, my income has become more investment based and that part of my earned income was going to be from managing that money. (Had a support hearing in 2010 for when I started my first start-up) Basically we have support recalculated every year when tax returns are completed since it does vary year to year and I won't know exactly what I made for the year until my returns are done (hope that makes sense). This venture (and my last one) represented 25% of my total income since 2010.
Main issue is that my ex will contest it vehemently. She is very good at soliciting sympathy and spinning things and will claim it's a huge burden on her (i.e. Ex will say grandma in house is a burden and I will claim grandma helps around the house...) Wrt the benefits to the children, I am sure she can counter almost every one.
Many of the benefits I would cite are related to basically my belief that shared parenting is not working for us. Multiple parenting classes, therapy over 7 years. I would prefer that my kids lived at one house primarily (in the past, either house would have been fine). Though now, my kids are older, and all the dysfunction that my ex and I have, has been appearing in my kids. They model her behavior, and it makes discipline and communication very difficult. My one kid (A) lives with her mom nearly full time now because I am too strict (Which is sort of laughable, but compared to her mom, I am very strict) though she has recently stated that she wants to spend some more time at our house.
Having the kids interviewed by the judge will be a crapshoot, they may say they want to keep things the way they are Child A at basically 90-10, Child B - at 50-50.
This makes me think that the judge will say, "Father can find a similar job/venture locally so as to not deprive children of time with father and not put additional burden on mother". I understand that. -
11-24-2013, 10:15 AMllworkingRe: Moving Away - Shared Custody 50-50I understand, but you are probably going to be stuck with more "fixed" expensesQuote:
Quoting stev
Grandma is 86 years old dad, you are not going to win that argument. However, its a moot argument because all the judge can do is make you more financially responsible...IE responsible for providing the cost of some at home care...or something of that nature. The judge CANNOT prevent you from moving or force you to exercise more parenting time than you are willing to exercise.Quote:
Main issue is that my ex will contest it vehemently. She is very good at soliciting sympathy and spinning things and will claim it's a huge burden on her (i.e. Ex will say grandma in house is a burden and I will claim grandma helps around the house...) Wrt the benefits to the children, I am sure she can counter almost every one.
Again, mostly moot points.Quote:
Many of the benefits I would cite are related to basically my belief that shared parenting is not working for us. Multiple parenting classes, therapy over 7 years. I would prefer that my kids lived at one house primarily (in the past, either house would have been fine). Though now, my kids are older, and all the dysfunction that my ex and I have, has been appearing in my kids. They model her behavior, and it makes discipline and communication very difficult. My one kid (A) lives with her mom nearly full time now because I am too strict (Which is sort of laughable, but compared to her mom, I am very strict) though she has recently stated that she wants to spend some more time at our house.
The problem in your thinking is that the judge CANNOT make a ruling of that nature. The judge can only make you financially responsible for easing mom's burden if you are not there physically to do it yourself.Quote:
Having the kids interviewed by the judge will be a crapshoot, they may say they want to keep things the way they are Child A at basically 90-10, Child B - at 50-50.
This makes me think that the judge will say, "Father can find a similar job/venture locally so as to not deprive children of time with father and not put additional burden on mother". I understand that.