Creating a Nuisance by Entering a Closed Area
My question involves criminal law for the state of: Nevada
Facts:
* There was a sign, STATE CONSERVATION AREA CLOSED DUE TO GOVERNMENT SHUTDOWN, posted on a closed gate at the entrance to road leading to Visitor Center.
* I assumed that this sign referred to the Visitor Center, the road and the parking lot.
* So I parked the car outside, applied sunscreen for safety, and ducked under the gate to hike in the desert.
* 20 minutes later, a Ranger stopped me and wrote me a citation for 43 CFR 8365.1-4 (a) (2) Creating a nuisance entering a closed area in accordance with 31 USC g 1311.
Geez, I feel so stupid now. But I did not even think for a moment that the desert was closed or how the government shutdown would affect parklands. There were hikers and bicyclists all over. And apparently, there were legal areas to enter to the right and left of the gate, that led then to State desert and Federal desert. It would have been nice to get directions to the legal-to-hike areas or at least a warning.
Whatever... I was wrong, and they were in rights to issue me an expensive $275 ticket.
Do I just pay it? Does this mean I'm guilty then? I read that it's a misdemeanor. Does this mean I'll be on the No-Fly list? Will a conviction affect my job? Will this be on my permanent record? I wish I knew how serious this was.
Do you think I can tell the judge that it was very confusing out there on the 1st Saturday of the shutdown? Or that they added more signs and barriers after that day. Or that I met other hikers that told me they were stopped too but only received a warning.
I don't suppose it will be like on TV where the DA wants to cut a deal with me.
Any comments, even the ones recounting my stupidity, will be appreciated.
thank you.
Re: Government Shutdown Made Me Do It -- Creating a Nuisance in a Closed Area
Personally, I would fight such nonsense but only you know how much tolerance you have for that kind of stress. The DA doesn't want to deal with this. Your local news media might be helpful - a nice story about how the stupid shutdown nonsense might make a good followup story. I'm thinking under the circumstances a judge and prosecutor might not want to treat you like a criminal. Plead the truth and see what it gets you. Of course, given the kind of government we now seem to have, they might just want to make an example of you to demonstrate what happens to citizens who make waves. As I said, only you can decide the threshold of pain you're willing to endure to stand up against nonsense.
It was, however, a confusing time and it sounds like the park service's signs were confusing. That might get the whole thing dismissed if they think you're willing to pursue the matter. See if you can get legal help from some local organization.
Re: Government Shutdown Made Me Do It -- Creating a Nuisance in a Closed Area
Quote:
Quoting
Bubba Jimmy
It was, however, a confusing time and it sounds like the park service's signs were confusing. .
I'm with you on most of what you are saying but due to this:
Quote:
and ducked under the gate to hike in the desert.
It's kind of hard to claim ignorance. Even by the OP's own statement:
Quote:
* I assumed that this sign referred to the Visitor Center, the road and the parking lot.
his actions are an outright admission to the violation. A closed road doesn't mean just to vehicular traffic.
Re: Government Shutdown Made Me Do It -- Creating a Nuisance in a Closed Area
Gotta go with jk on this.
Closed gates mean keep out, and not just your vehicle. "AREA CLOSED" means "area", as in the whole property. If they meant "only the visitor center, parking lot, and roadway" were closed, that's what they would've said. "Area" means EVERYTHING. My officers are state law enforcement, but since they are also federally sworn, they did a fair share of patrolling federal lands (a major conservation area/wildlife refuge) during the shut down, because a handful of people endangered themselves by entering the area when the normal resources that oversee the safety weren't available. Normally, persons lost, stranded, stuck, or injured would've had help available, but during the shut down, it wasn't SAFE for members of the public to be out there.
No, the incident won't put you on a "no fly" list.
Re: Government Shutdown Made Me Do It -- Creating a Nuisance in a Closed Area
Without quibbling if he should have passed the gate or not, the issue is what he was charged with. He wasn't charged with trespassing or ignoring signs (on the other side, the sign didn't say nothing). He was charged with this:
Public health, safety and comfort.
(a) No person shall cause a public disturbance or create a risk to other persons on public lands by engaging in activities which include, but are not limited to, the following:
(2) Creating a hazard or nuisance;
I would certainly like to see the government make a compelling case as to what hazard or nuisance he created by his mere presence.
The sense here is hazard or nuisance to the PUBLIC rather than to himself or to some pissed off park ranger.
Re: Government Shutdown Made Me Do It -- Creating a Nuisance in a Closed Area
Yes, well, the barricades moved by WW II veterans in Washington DC did not get them cited for anything. Nor the congressmen that grandstanded with them. This was all a political hoax. Sure, it's generally wrong to duck under a gate. I'm trying to give the OP practical and helpful advice to help him deal with a situation. The whole shutdown was nonsense, and to be caught up in it and financially penalized is not justice. But HopingForABreak, you make your own decision. Pay the fine or resist. Those are your choices. Yes, you will have a permanent criminal record that does not ever go away. For what? Being a U.S. citizen desiring to use your own national property. Looking at the statute under which you are charged, it does not seem that you were charged with trespass but with creating a hazard or nuisance. Seems like a stretch to me, all over a political conflict. I'd certainly plead my case to a judge rather than just roll over as others seem to think you should do.
Re: Creating a Nuisance by Entering a Closed Area
I think this is one of those tickets that are worth a not guilty on the moral issue, even if not the legal.
Re: Creating a Nuisance by Entering a Closed Area
Quote:
Quoting
Bubba Jimmy
Personally, I would fight such nonsense but only you know how much tolerance you have for that kind of stress. The DA doesn't want to deal with this.
It's federal. It's going to be a U.S. Attorney's Office, not a "D.A.". Whether or not the U.S. Attorney's Office wants to deal with the issue is beside the point - they routinely do deal with this type of issue. I would personally take it seriously and look at how I might avoid a conviction.
I do agree with you that the charge does not seem appropriate, given the described conduct. See, e.g., United States v. Branson, Case No. 08-cr-0001 TAG. (U.S. Dist. Court, ED California 2008). However, I suspect that the reason for the charge is that the officer didn't want to cite the OP for the much more serious offense of trespassing on federal land.
Quote:
Quoting Bubba Jimmy
Your local news media might be helpful - a nice story about how the stupid shutdown nonsense might make a good followup story.
I doubt that the media would have any interest in the story, but he's of course free to try to convince them that it's worth their time.
Quote:
Quoting Bubba Jimmy
Of course, given the kind of government we now seem to have, they might just want to make an example of you to demonstrate what happens to citizens who make waves.
Why do you believe that this has something to do with "mak[ing] an example of you to demonstrate what happens to citizens who make waves"? He committed an offense, he was cited, and he's in exactly the same position as any other person facing a minor criminal charge.
Quote:
Quoting Bubba Jimmy
It was, however, a confusing time and it sounds like the park service's signs were confusing.
No it doesn't. When you have to duck under a barricade to enter a posted, closed-off area, it's pretty obvious that you're not supposed to walk in.
Quote:
Quoting
Bubba Jimmy
Yes, well, the barricades moved by WW II veterans in Washington DC did not get them cited for anything. Nor the congressmen that grandstanded with them.
So what?
Quote:
Quoting Bubba Jimmy
The whole shutdown was nonsense, and to be caught up in it and financially penalized is not justice.
The Republican Party's antics may well have been political theater, but as a result of those antics various government services had to be shut down, including the area at issue. The antics had real consequences. And yes, even when a political party is throwing a tantrum, people are expected to follow the law.
Re: Creating a Nuisance by Entering a Closed Area
In order to answer this accurately, we need to know the SPF of the sunscreen you applied. From that, we could formulate an answer.
Re: Creating a Nuisance by Entering a Closed Area
I agree. OP stated that he knew that the road was closed and had to go as far as to duck under the gate that closed the area in order to access it. However, as FR stated, being cited for
Quote:
Creating a nuisance entering a closed area
does seem to be out of reach for the events as described, I'm wondering if the OP's response to being confronted by the ranger may have something to do with the citation. He did mention that he spoke with other hikers after receiving it, so maybe the report will have a lot more incriminating info that justiifies the actual citation.