My Daughter is Being Emotionally Mistreated

My question involves a child custody case from the State of: Michigan

My five year old daughter's father is an on again, off again dad. He's there for her when he has a new girlfriend to impress, that's about it. His mother, however, is very active in my daughter's life, in a very negative way. She is consistently trying to sabotage my relationship with my daughter. While I realize that can sound like a petty thing to say, this has been going on for a couple of years now and is only getting worse. She tells my daughter that I punish her because I don't love her (and that she would never punish my daughter because she loves her too much to do that). She has no rules or structure for my daughter at her house. She's even allowed in the horses' paddock without adult supervision. She even allows her to hit without consequences. She consistently refers to herself as "Mom" to my daughter, even though I have told her not to. She is in a better financial position to spoil my daughter better than I am and constantly tells my daughter that. Plus, she tells my daughter that she's not allowed to tell me what happens at her house, which worries me about things that are going on that I don't even know about. My daughter has told me that "Grandma says I shouldn't love you." She told me today that a lawyer supposedly told her that she has no responsibility to adhere to my wishes about any of this, even about my daughter calling her mom, which is in the court order (below). Not only that, but she is constantly calling anyone she can think of that I am associated with and trying to find dirt on me.

Why let her go there, you ask? I'm being screwed, that's why. My daughter's dad has no interest in seeing her, but he is his mommy's little puppet. He pursues visitation, but his mom is the one that picks her up, drops her off, and spends all of the time with her. He barely sees her at all. He won't speak to me about anything. I have to go through his mom to get to him. He gave the court his mother's address even though legally they are supposed to have his. He refuses to tell me where he lives, even though he has had my daughter at his house before. He is currently facing CSC charges for having sex with a 13 year old at the age of 23 and managed to get it set so that his mom is his court-ordered supervisor, despite my objections. Circuit court notified FOC about the CSC case before I even knew about it. FOC set a hearing date and told the dad that because of it, supervised visitation is mandated until the close of the case. There was also no court ordered visitation in place. This is the first time we've had ordered visitation. I denied his mother visitation because of the issues I had with her and she had the dad file a motion for visitation. Since the two were so close in time, ,they scheduled one hearing for both issues. I presented text records to the referee that proved his mother was the one asking to see my daughter, not him. That's why I was not found in contempt for denying the dad reasonable access to the child. The dad hasn't had his own visitation with my daughter since she was 5 months old. It's always been his mother and she uses his paternal rights to get my daughter. I also presented a statement from my daughter's counselor stating that her grandmother is emotionally harming her and sabotaging my relationship with my daughter, but they didn't listen to it, obviously. The court order, word for word, says the following:

"Father has been denied parenting time, but the denial is not deemed wrongful as father seeks enforcement of a verbal agreement, not the existing order. Courts do not enforce verbal agreements. Moreover, father is currently facing CSC charges which gave mother obvious concerns. Pending further order, father shall have supervised parenting time with child every other weekend from 6pm Friday to 6pm Sunday. The first weekend shall occur Friday, June 14, 2013. Paternal grandmother is deemed adequate to supervise. Neither parent shall disparage the other parent nor allow anyone in the proximity of the child to disparage the other parent. Mother thinks that paternal grandmother refers to herself as "mom." Without a finding that this is in fact true, the referee offers guidance to paternal grandmother not to refer to herself as such."

I have kept records of each visit in which her father was not present, including each time my daughter's grandmother has called herself mom (twice since the court order). I have many affidavits from people stating that they have heard her do that. I have records of his CSC case and am keeping myself updated on it.

What else can I do? What are my legal rights (I live in Michigan where there are no grandparent laws)? Is there any way I can keep my daughter away from that house? Any laws that would help support my case? Any processes I can go through? I am beyond sick of my daughter being caught in the middle of this BS. She does NOT deserve it and I'm tired of watching her be torn and used and am also concerned about her safety while she's there. Please help.

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Quoting Kayla88

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My question involves a child custody case from the State of: Michigan

My five year old daughter's father is an on again, off again dad. He's there for her when he has a new girlfriend to impress, that's about it. His mother, however, is very active in my daughter's life, in a very negative way. She is consistently trying to sabotage my relationship with my daughter. While I realize that can sound like a petty thing to say, this has been going on for a couple of years now and is only getting worse. She tells my daughter that I punish her because I don't love her (and that she would never punish my daughter because she loves her too much to do that). She has no rules or structure for my daughter at her house. She's even allowed in the horses' paddock without adult supervision. She even allows her to hit without consequences. She consistently refers to herself as "Mom" to my daughter, even though I have told her not to. She is in a better financial position to spoil my daughter better than I am and constantly tells my daughter that. Plus, she tells my daughter that she's not allowed to tell me what happens at her house, which worries me about things that are going on that I don't even know about. My daughter has told me that "Grandma says I shouldn't love you." She told me today that a lawyer supposedly told her that she has no responsibility to adhere to my wishes about any of this, even about my daughter calling her mom, which is in the court order (below). Not only that, but she is constantly calling anyone she can think of that I am associated with and trying to find dirt on me.

Why let her go there, you ask? I'm being screwed, that's why. My daughter's dad has no interest in seeing her, but he is his mommy's little puppet. He pursues visitation, but his mom is the one that picks her up, drops her off, and spends all of the time with her. He barely sees her at all. He won't speak to me about anything. I have to go through his mom to get to him. He gave the court his mother's address even though legally they are supposed to have his. He refuses to tell me where he lives, even though he has had my daughter at his house before. He is currently facing CSC charges for having sex with a 13 year old at the age of 23 and managed to get it set so that his mom is his court-ordered supervisor, despite my objections. Circuit court notified FOC about the CSC case before I even knew about it. FOC set a hearing date and told the dad that because of it, supervised visitation is mandated until the close of the case. There was also no court ordered visitation in place. This is the first time we've had ordered visitation. I denied his mother visitation because of the issues I had with her and she had the dad file a motion for visitation. Since the two were so close in time, ,they scheduled one hearing for both issues. I presented text records to the referee that proved his mother was the one asking to see my daughter, not him. That's why I was not found in contempt for denying the dad reasonable access to the child. The dad hasn't had his own visitation with my daughter since she was 5 months old. It's always been his mother and she uses his paternal rights to get my daughter. The court order, word for word, says the following:

"Father has been denied parenting time, but the denial is not deemed wrongful as father seeks enforcement of a verbal agreement, not the existing order. Courts do not enforce verbal agreements. Moreover, father is currently facing CSC charges which gave mother obvious concerns. Pending further order, father shall have supervised parenting time with child every other weekend from 6pm Friday to 6pm Sunday. The first weekend shall occur Friday, June 14, 2013. Paternal grandmother is deemed adequate to supervise. Neither parent shall disparage the other parent nor allow anyone in the proximity of the child to disparage the other parent. Mother thinks that paternal grandmother refers to herself as "mom." Without a finding that this is in fact true, the referee offers guidance to paternal grandmother not to refer to herself as such."

I have kept records of each visit in which her father was not present, including each time my daughter's grandmother has called herself mom (twice since the court order). I have many affidavits from people stating that they have heard her do that. I have records of his CSC case and am keeping myself updated on it.

What else can I do? What are my legal rights (I live in Michigan where there are no grandparent laws)? Is there any way I can keep my daughter away from that house? Any laws that would help support my case? Any processes I can go through? I am beyond sick of my daughter being caught in the middle of this BS. She does NOT deserve it and I'm tired of watching her be torn and used and am also concerned about her safety while she's there. Please help.

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It is important to note that this poster has a history of dating and taking sex offenders as boyfriends. So far she is on #2.

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Quoting Antigone

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It is important to note that this poster has a history of dating and taking sex offenders as boyfriends. So far she is on #2.

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Antigone, that is QUITE enough. This makes two websites now where you have followed every post I have made with offensive comments. This is in direct violation of Michigan Penal Code statutes on electronic harassment. I have every legal right to be posting on the internet without having to worry about whether you are a member and what you will post this time. Note that I am not at all opposed to pursuing legal action if it continues.

These type of websites are intended for legal advice, pure and simple. The code of conduct you agreed to upon joining this (and the other site) both prohibit offensive posting and harassment. You would do well to bear that in mind.


An FYI to anyone else reading this post, so as to avoid Antigone's misinformation: My daughter's father's case is his first and we have been separated for almost six years. He also was 23 and plenty old enough to know better, not to mention having sex with a child only eight years older than my preschooler, which is SICK. My fiancee was an adjudicated minor at the age of 14 and is therefore not on the public SOR. His actions, while not smart, were not an attack on anyone and was consensual. I hope the rest of you can maintain a friendly atmosphere and help me gather information that can help my daughter. Her wellbeing is what is important here, not personal vendettas.

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Quoting Kayla88

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Antigone, that is QUITE enough. This makes two websites now where you have followed every post I have made with offensive comments. This is in direct violation of Michigan Penal Code statutes on electronic harassment. I have every legal right to be posting on the internet without having to worry about whether you are a member and what you will post this time. Note that I am not at all opposed to pursuing legal action if it continues.

These type of websites are intended for legal advice, pure and simple. The code of conduct you agreed to upon joining this (and the other site) both prohibit offensive posting and harassment. You would do well to bear that in mind.


An FYI to anyone else reading this post, so as to avoid Antigone's misinformation: My daughter's father's case is his first and we have been separated for almost six years. He also was 23 and plenty old enough to know better, not to mention having sex with a child only eight years older than my preschooler, which is SICK. My fiancee was an adjudicated minor at the age of 14 and is therefore not on the public SOR. His actions, while not smart, were not an attack on anyone and was consensual. I hope the rest of you can maintain a friendly atmosphere and help me gather information that can help my daughter. Her wellbeing is what is important here, not personal vendettas.

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I post on both site and I am not stalking you. You did not give the posters of this website all the information that was gleaned from the other website.

Kayla fails to mention that her current fiance is a Tier 3 sex offender. He penetrated a girl on a school bus.

Again, consensually...and it's not like he dropped his pants. They were messing around and he fingered her. Wowee, how utterly tragic. Again, 14 years old. I don't know a single teenager that hasn't done something stupid. I can remember a couple times making out with my bf on the bus and seeing it a LOT. It's NOT unusual. I had sex in a car, so legally, if I had been caught, I would be a registered sex offender for sex in public. I've also gone skinny dipping in the river. Whoops, sex offender again! Guess by your standards, I'm scum. I drank underage...there's an MIP. Funny thing? I was a pretty good kid, as was my fiancee. Good grades, held jobs, didn't do drugs, etc. Teenagers are synonymous with bad decisions....but it's people like you who enjoy making people feel like sh*t who are the REAL problem. I would understand your attitude toward a rapist. Or murderer. Or wife beater. My fiancee is none of those. However, at this point, you're simply being petty and vindictive. I am trying to find out how to help my daughter. Don't want to help her? Then screw off.

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Quoting Kayla88

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Again, consensually...and it's not like he dropped his pants. They were messing around and he fingered her. Wowee, how utterly tragic. Again, 14 years old. I don't know a single teenager that hasn't done something stupid. I can remember a couple times making out with my bf on the bus and seeing it a LOT. It's NOT unusual. I had sex in a car, so legally, if I had been caught, I would be a registered sex offender for sex in public. I've also gone skinny dipping in the river. Whoops, sex offender again! Guess by your standards, I'm scum. I drank underage...there's an MIP. Funny thing? I was a pretty good kid, as was my fiancee. Good grades, held jobs, didn't do drugs, etc. Teenagers are synonymous with bad decisions....but it's people like you who enjoy making people feel like sh*t who are the REAL problem. I would understand your attitude toward a rapist. Or murderer. Or wife beater. My fiancee is none of those. However, at this point, you're simply being petty and vindictive. I am trying to find out how to help my daughter. Don't want to help her? Then screw off.

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And you wonder how your daughter is so emotionally damaged.

tigi out:rolleyes:

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Quoting Antigone

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And you wonder how your daughter is so emotionally damaged.

tigi out:rolleyes:

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I am sorry tigi but I think that you are out of line on this one. There is a huge difference between two stupid teenagers that were the same age and an adult who has sex with a 13 year old.

You are harassing this poster and you are better than that.

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Quoting llworking

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I am sorry tigi but I think that you are out of line on this one. There is a huge difference between two stupid teenagers that were the same age and an adult who has sex with a 13 year old.

You are harassing this poster and you are better than that.

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I disagree, LL, you let her know how to proceed then.

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Quoting Antigone

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I disagree, LL, you let her know how to proceed then.

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I already did. She needs to get the child's therapist to testify in court.

Thank you for that. I have a pretty comprehensive knowledge of law, even though I'm definitely not a lawyer (paralegal major, though). I was always the nerd that truly enjoyed learning laws and legislature for the fun of it (as well as following current events) and was even a police reservist until I moved out of the county. However, my courtroom knowledge is practically nil. Knowing I have the facts and that the grandmother's disparagement and misuse of her son's custody is illegal, but presenting it in court is something I am very inexperienced in. As said, this is the first formal visitation arrangement in my daughter's life...all because I was made aware by my daughter about what was going on and put my foot down. Her grandmother is the type of person who is sweet as pie to your face, but will backstab in a heartbeat. To be honest, I feel a bit naive having trusted her as much as I did. I should have known she would put her druggie son above anything else because of parent/child bonds. All I can do now is try to fix the situation before it gets worse. Sigh.