Fraud Committed by Notary on a Contract
My question involves a consumer law issue in the State of: Ohio
I purchased services of a bail bonding company. 11/2009 i went to their offices and paid the amount required to bail a friend out of jail. I signed a contract (whew, giving them poa and agreeing to their 2 page contract) I got a receipt for the amount paid from the bail bondsman, dated the 17th (which was the day that i was there). I signed and dated the paperwork 17th as well.
I didnt get a copy of the paperwork. I called twice and never did get it -until the situation turned badly and the friend didnt show up for his court appts. The bail bond co called me, and i called the friend, got him to a wendy's to meet with the bonds person, they (3) took him in (peacefully).
I then get a bill ( got bill months later) for $5,000.00 and the long awaited copy of contract.:grumpy:
I sent back a check for $1.500.00 and marked paid in full on it, and a letter saying no way did they have to send bounty hunters out of state or anything - that i had helped set the meeting to bring him in. They sent it back saying they couldnt accept that, that just because i hadnt received a copy of the contract didnt mean it did not exsist.
Upon viewing the LATE (4 yrs now they are taking me to court) contract I see that now one page is notarized -not the poa where there is a place for it, but the second page detailing fees, in the place for it there . (I am a notary as well, so I noticed these things and know the serious issues here Collusion of a notary in a false certification is very serious too. )
There was no notary in the room when I signed. They now have a woman (who I see is also part owner of the firm) signing she witnessed my signiture, (which she did not, nor did she give any oath, get id, etc, as she was not there!) Also, she has the date wrong, saying the 16th instead of the 17th as the two of us put down on other things.
So because there is fraud in this paperwork, does that void it? Lots of errors here, due to her not being there, i was not asked to sign in a sequential journal of notarial acts. (which she is required to do to prove she and I were there and she observed all details.).
Any assistance here would be a God-send, thank you - Need to respond to the court in 28 days
Re: Fraud Committed by Notary on a Contract
Quote:
Quoting
ohwidow
I then get a bill ( got bill months later) for $5,000.00 and the long awaited copy of contract.:grumpy:...
Upon viewing the LATE (4 yrs now they are taking me to court) contract I see that now one page is notarized -not the poa where there is a place for it, but the second page detailing fees, in the place for it there .
Do you still have your other copy?
Quote:
Quoting ohwidow
(I am a notary as well, so I noticed these things and know the serious issues here Collusion of a notary in a false certification is very serious too. )
As you know, "A notary public shall also provide himself with an official register in which shall be recorded a copy of every certificate of protest and copy of note, which seal and record shall be exempt from execution." ORC Sec. 147.04. If you're in the log, and there's no tampering or other irregularity with the log, the entry was made back in 2009 (which isn't to say it was a bona fide notarization - just that it happened more or less contemporaneously).
Quote:
Quoting ohwidow
So because there is fraud in this paperwork, does that void it?
I see nothing in the Ohio Code that requires notarization, nor does it affect the statute of limitations. You're not disputing that you contracted to pay the money in the event that the defendant absconded and his bond was forfeit, and you're not disputing the authenticity of your signature. So as it stands, I see nothing in your narrative that affects the amount or enforceability of your debt.
Beyond that, the lawsuit against you may be relying upon the notarization to create a presumption that the amount claimed is valid, or for some similar purpose, and your dispute of the notary's signature may be relevant to that aspect of the lawsuit. Have you checked the complaint for any references to the notarization?
Quote:
Quoting ohwidow
Lots of errors here, due to her not being there, i was not asked to sign in a sequential journal of notarial acts. (which she is required to do to prove she and I were there and she observed all details.).
You can, of course, report the misconduct of a notary to the Secretary of State.
Re: Fraud Committed by Notary on a Contract
Quote:
Quoting
ohwidow
So because there is fraud in this paperwork, does that void it?
No.
You're not denying that you signed the contract.
And not getting a copy WHEN you signed it is nobody's fault but your own.
You could easily have insisted that duplicate papers be put on the table in front of you before you signed anything and taken a set with you.
Lesson learned.
By the way, it's your friend that owes you whatever you have to pay the bail bondsman.
Re: Fraud Committed by Notary on a Contract
Further, speaking of misconduct, how are you privy to information that the notary may not have been observing the witnessing via camera from an office and witnessing the signature of the bondsman?
Re: Fraud Committed by Notary on a Contract
Please tell me you are not complaining, because no one here is giving you a magic bullet to defraud someone else. Here's your sign.:wallbang:
Re: Fraud Committed by Notary on a Contract
Thanks for your reply..... I have the first copy, the one they sent when they sent the 5,000 invoice, and then the second, is tagged along with the court paperwork.
If i block out the names, etc. is there a way to scan it in here? So others can see what never to do, as well, such signing away of all they require!!
Perhaps u might find some wiggle room?
i see not much yet here, of a way out. I should be like hillary clinton and say i dont remember time and time again, let them prove it, and they would be hard pressed too (impossible!), even if i thought that would work tho, there is the check i sent in at first trying to settle this back when. 4 yrs ago
However, i think i would rather find a way to sue the notary for the amount i suffer because of this, for the dirty deeds they have done. u said [Beyond that, the lawsuit against you may be relying upon the notarization to create a presumption that the amount claimed is valid, or for some similar purpose, and your dispute of the notary's signature may be relevant to that aspect of the lawsuit. Have you checked the complaint for any references to the notarization?] // end copy
I need to get a magnifying glass and read, re read allthis legal mumbo jumbo and see if indeed there is.
I would also report her to the insurance state pple too, for not giving me a contract.
again, thank you much
- - - Updated - - -
Thanks for the reply, these are kinda the responses I figured, dang it!
Yes, for sure, quite a few lessons here in this dealing (given today, I wouldn't have done it (bonding) period).
Expensive as contacting that 'friend' would cost me peace of mind, so, I will leave it alone. This yr anyway, might consider passing it on in a few yrs.
Speaking of years, not sure how this will work out, other than it appears I am going to loose these funds.
So, a fifty dollar per month payment, who would complain if at least they are getting paid?
Yes I know, there is a 3% interest mentioned, after judgement. However, there are other costs, like their atty fees as well. No telling how much that will be. grrrr...outrageous fees already so figure another grand or two is possible, whew.
Is that something that the bonding co would have to accept?
Just wish ---- oh well.... wish in one hand and spit in the other and see which one fills up fastest huh?? Regards
- - - Updated - - -
Just an update, today I paid an atty a retainer, he seemed to think he could file a summery judgement, that the bond was forfieted, that the bond co didnt loose anything because the person was back in jail, (w/my help in setting up a meeting with bond agents pple).
That a business has to have some expense on their own, and the org 10% of the bond paid of 5,000.00 surley paid for some risk and profit.
Passing on a 5 grand bill for 3 pple for less then 3-4 hrs work top was outragious and we arent going to have to pay that he said. (Like he was assisting in paying this, grin).
And if indeed, we need to neg then we bring up the notary deal (not much of a stand, but might muddy the waters) so, perhaps not full amount and their atty fees and such is on the table after all. If this thread is still open I will update the final result. thanks again for the opinions given.