Ticketed for Speeding, Same Model of Car Behind Me

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10-07-2012, 04:13 AM
Olegwashere

Ticketed for Speeding, Same Model of Car Behind Me

My question involves a traffic ticket from the state of: Massachusetts

i was going west on 90. towards springfield and we JUST GOT out of HEAVY stop and go traffic. (right after the sturbridge nyc exit)
ive been commuting for training all week. 82 mile trip each way.

Anyways just got out of traffic and starting going normal speeds.
i was just accelerating to pass some cars and there was the same type of car/ same color right behind me.

is that even a defense?
ticket was lidar.
checked off left lane
going 82 in a 65.
its impossible i was going 82 since when i saw the cop flagging me down i was going 70(exactly half way mark on my guage)didnt even blink on hitting the break pedal.

besides the point i saw him so i pulled over literally not even 50+ feet passed where he was.
took my card and reg before he even got to me and i rolled down my window.
he didnt even say anything just you were going 82 i dont need your registration. didnt even tell me anything else.
wrote me the ticket and went back to his car and backed up 60+ feet to where he was before.
i was like did that just happen.
anyways wanted to get home.
and since there was more traffic i caught up (going speed limit) to the car that was behind me originally and took pics of car and plate.

any advice here?
21. i have a lane violation from the same road last year but other then that my record is clean since i was 16. i didn't fight it because i was going to california for the next month and wouldn't be able to show in court. its not effecting my insurance premium but the rep said it was effecting me getting a lower premium. with this ticket i already pay 190 a month.

any advice.
can provide additional info if needed.

edit: grabbed my ticket. says lidar left lane and i believe clocked at 2147 ft.
also both cars mine and the person he might have clocked are both the same shiny black. so that really doesnt help my case.

- - - Updated - - -

Cant edit after 60 minutes?
ive been googling away.
since the ticket has 2147 as distance i read that lidar isn't accurate after 1000 feet? is that correct? statues in massachusetts?

also it says speed was posted. obviously it was but about 7/8 mile back.

if he just has lidar as his source for my speed whats the accuracy he was standing in the breakdown lane.
it was a little after a hill.
traffic in all 3 lanes. it wasnt super busy but enough to fill most gaps. after stop and go traffic for 4 1/2 miles before that.

- - - Updated - - -

edit number 3: also for offenses i cant even read the number but i think it says 7,086c or l then under it for d speeding. they are both crossed through with one line... what does that even mean. that i'm in violation of both? 90/17 or 90/18
10-07-2012, 01:19 PM
That Guy

Re: Ticketed for Speeding, Same Model of Car Behind Me

Quote:

Quoting Olegwashere

is that even a defense?

Hadn't worked for the hundreds of people before you and its not likely to work for you!

Quote:

Quoting Olegwashere

its impossible i was going 82 since when i saw the cop flagging me down i was going 70(exactly half way mark on my guage)didnt even blink on hitting the break pedal.

besides the point i saw him so i pulled over literally not even 50+ feet passed where he was.

OK, so his claim is he measured your speed at 81 when you were 2174 feet a way;
So you saw him glanced at your speedometer saw the 70;
Let us assume it took you a second to react;
During that second you drove for 100 feet;
Stopping distance from 70mph is approximately 200 feet;
So total 300 feet form the time you noticed him while your speed at 70mph;
You stopped 50 feet past him and so all of the above happened 250 away from him;
He says you were at 81 when you were 2174 feet a way from him;
You say you were at 70mph when you were 250 away from him...

Quote:

Quoting Olegwashere

ive been googling away.
since the ticket has 2147 as distance i read that lidar isn't accurate after 1000 feet? is that correct? statues in massachusetts?

I'm guessing only an ignorant fool would post anything close to that on the internet!

Quote:

Quoting Olegwashere

and since there was more traffic i caught up (going speed limit) to the car that was behind me originally and took pics of car and plate.

Not sure what if anything that would prove! Well, aside form the fact that you made most of it up... Here is why it makes no sense whatsoever:

You mentioned that car was behind you, you then were flagged down by an officer;
So you got distracted and not likely to have been looking at his license plate;
The officer got your documents and issued a citation;
But then after being cited, "there was more traffic" meaning it was somewhat congested, or at least tight where if you were able to drive the speed limit, traffic around you would have been able to drive the speed limit as well.... Yet you managed to get past all that highway traffic, only to catch up to a vehicle which you claim was behind you. And this is... what? 12-15 minutes after you departed ways?

Quote:

Quoting Olegwashere

also it says speed was posted. obviously it was but about 7/8 mile back.

And unless you pass another speed limit sign, that last sign you saw 7/8 mile back would still be in effect...

Quote:

Quoting Olegwashere

if he just has lidar as his source for my speed whats the accuracy he was standing in the breakdown lane.
it was a little after a hill.

Lidar is accurate to within +/- 1 to 2 miles per hour...

Quote:

Quoting Olegwashere

edit number 3: also for offenses i cant even read the number but i think it says 7,086c or l then under it for d speeding. they are both crossed through with one line... what does that even mean. that i'm in violation of both? 90/17 or 90/18

I Without seeing it, I couldn't tell you what it means or what it doesn't. You can redact all personal information, upload a scan of the citation to Photobucket.com and post a link here...

Quote:

Quoting Olegwashere

any advice.

You can try this one... You saw the Highway 90 sign and thought that was the speed limit!

(Just joking... It won't work).
10-10-2012, 07:01 AM
Olegwashere

Re: Ticketed for Speeding, Same Model of Car Behind Me

200 feet does seem a little short. but my point was in the half second i was distracted i saw him waving me down i pulled over close enough to him that he didn't even have to move his cruiser to get to me. as he was ahead of it.

the whole ticket took about 5-6 minutes max. he didn't really talk to me.
all he did was walk up to my car passenger door. said you were going 82. is this your current address went back to his car wrote the ticket came back and said here you go. nothing else didn't even make me sign it.
i was distracted because i was looking in my rearview at this car coming up on me.

anyways. believe what you want about my "story"
i'm estimating the feet it was to stop but i def saw 70 on my speedometer maybe in a small area were the traffic let up i COULD have hit 80 at one point(at like 5/6000 feet back) but only to pass someone else.
as everyone in mass knows your massholes and people sure do drive like it
im not saying this to make my case. but i went out saturday night in ct. was driving up 91n and was going about 70 which is honestly usually how fast i go. and people were zooming past me in the left lane so that must be at least 85/90 for them to be able to do that. and thats on a daily basis. if you dont keep up with the flow of traffic their going to think your a masshole.

http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f1...cketEdited.png

- - - Updated - - -

And as for the sarcasm dont worry i can take it.

im not really looking for and excuse im just saying there was no way i was doing 82.
im one of those people that i see what's there. if i was doing 82 id gladly take the ticket. but that's not the case.
i have sped before in my younger days where i did do that hell i even hit 90+ sometimes. but not this time.

i'm a pretty smart guy even at the ripe age of 21. My records clean i dont go out and drink ridiculously. i have a 9-5 well a 9-7 i pay my taxes just like everyone else.

and there has been other cops on that road the past week. i drove about 1000 miles(if youd like i can do exact math) on that road last week. and none of the other times i was going 82.....

- - - Updated - - -

anyone else have any insight? i wont see the effects on my insurance until august! but my good driver discount will go out the door. im really itching to fight this but like i said i have never had a speeding ticket and dont know how far lidar distance goes. (this is the only thing that bugs me) i dont want to be penalized for something i didnt do. i would much rather take the 70 in a 65 that i was doing vs the 82 in a 65 i wasnt.
10-10-2012, 07:44 AM
That Guy

Re: Ticketed for Speeding, Same Model of Car Behind Me

Here's more... Since you're insisting on making a fool of yourself:

Quote:

Quoting Olegwashere

200 feet does seem a little short.

Not the point/argument you would want to make... In fact in this same sentence/paragraph, you're arguing that you stopped close the where the officer was, and yet 200 feet is too short?

The longer it gets, the farther you will be from the officer... So which way would you like to go with? 200 feet or 300 feet (and yes, realistically, it is much closer to 300+ feet than it is to 200)?

Quote:

Quoting Olegwashere

but my point was in the half second i was distracted i saw him waving me down

You either get distracted a lot or the story is falling apart again...

And just because my hypothetical suggested you may have been distracted you did not have to add it to your story... In fact, "speeding" and "distracted driving" should never mix... Although one could also argue that a driver might speed if he's distracted and not watching his speedometer! Either way, the two should never mix..

Quote:

Quoting Olegwashere

i saw him waving me down i pulled over close enough to him that he didn't even have to move his cruiser to get to me. as he was ahead of it.

That is not what you stated in your first post:

Quote:

Quoting Olegwashere

wrote me the ticket and went back to his car and backed up 60+ feet to where he was before.

So which is it.. Did he back up 60 feet to where he was before you came along? Or did he not back up nor did he need to because you saw him signal you and you were able to make a dead stop from your claimed speed at 70mph, all within 50 feet?

Quote:

Quoting Olegwashere

my point was in the half second i was distracted i saw him waving me down.....

Is this "distracted" the same "distracted" you mentioned a few lines down? This one:

Quote:

Quoting Olegwashere

i was distracted because i was looking in my rearview at this car coming up on me.

Because if it is, and you were distracted while you were looking in the rear view mirror at the car coming up behind you, and your being distracted was interrupted by the officer waving you down, then you should keep in mind that this is long after he had established you were speeding. So if this when you're alleging the car coming up at you was speeding, then the officer did not get the other car's speed, he got your speed.

Alternatively, if it is your contention that you noticed the other car back when the officer measured your speed at 2174 feet, and though you were going 70mph, the guy behind you was going 82 (as measured by the officer), then the presumption is that he would have passed you long before you got to the point where the officer waived you to stop.. And yet here you are, still claiming that this same vehicle was still approaching you, and you were still distracted by it doing so while watching it through your rear view mirror when the officer waived you to pull over.

Still needs plenty of work! But in all honesty, I am done telling you where the flaws in your story are! But I will respond to your other comments!

Quote:

Quoting Olegwashere

anyways. believe what you want about my "story"

Good, I am glad you realize it continues to fall short.... And the good thing for you is that you don't have to convince me of anything. You do have to convince the judge though... And whether your claim varies from a simple "your honor, it wasn't me.. It had to be another vehicle"... Or whether you do actually provide so many details (all of which are clearly inconsistent), there is a strong likelihood that the judge heard some version of your "story" before...He may laugh it off, or he may cut you off at some point...

Quote:

Quoting Olegwashere

i'm estimating the feet it was to stop but i def saw 70 on my speedometer maybe in a small area were the traffic let up i COULD have hit 80 at one point(at like 5/6000 feet back) but only to pass someone else.

Does Massachusetts allow a driver to exceed the speed limit when passing? Not likely... But, with your estimate of your speed being way off from where the officer claimed he clocked you, your estimate of the distance may be flawed as well.

And there goes another admission of guilt, by the way!

Quote:

Quoting Olegwashere

as everyone in mass knows your massholes and people sure do drive like it
im not saying this to make my case. but i went out saturday night in ct. was driving up 91n and was going about 70 which is honestly usually how fast i go. and people were zooming past me in the left lane so that must be at least 85/90 for them to be able to do that. and thats on a daily basis. if you dont keep up with the flow of traffic their going to think your a masshole.

http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f1...cketEdited.png

- - - Updated - - -

And as for the sarcasm dont worry i can take it.

im not really looking for and excuse im just saying there was no way i was doing 82.
im one of those people that i see what's there. if i was doing 82 id gladly take the ticket. but that's not the case.
i have sped before in my younger days where i did do that hell i even hit 90+ sometimes. but not this time.

i'm a pretty smart guy even at the ripe age of 21. My records clean i dont go out and drink ridiculously. i have a 9-5 well a 9-7 i pay my taxes just like everyone else.

and there has been other cops on that road the past week. i drove about 1000 miles(if youd like i can do exact math) on that road last week. and none of the other times i was going 82.....

None of this will work for you either... Your clean driving record means very little along with the several admissions you've made, not getting caught in CT or this past weekend does not mean you were not speeding when you were cited... As for being a "pretty smart guy", if being "pretty" didn't help you with the officer, I don't think it will mitigate your potential losses in court either! And if you were as smart as you claim, you would not have left so many holes I could drive a semi truck-trailer.

But good luck in court... You're going to need it!

Edited to Add: As far as the citation goes, that entry looks like a 7.086 GC or 7.086bc
10-10-2012, 12:11 PM
davidmcbeth3

Re: Ticketed for Speeding, Same Model of Car Behind Me

I don't care if you were speeding. Now, this ticket is so sloppy I would see if your state law allows you to demand an information to replace it - before you enter your plea.

I would focus on objections to the LIDAR cert. of cal. being allowed into evidence and that the LIDAR model used has any previous judicial notice and lack of foundation being stated during trial.

Suggested reading: State of MA v. Melendez-Diaz SCOTUS opinion,
10-10-2012, 08:36 PM
Olegwashere

Re: Ticketed for Speeding, Same Model of Car Behind Me

Quote:

Quoting That Guy

Here's more... Since you're insisting on making a fool of yourself:

thanks i think. I came here for some help on something that happend. you know this is a legal help forum not a smart ass convention.

Quote:

Quoting That Guy

So which is it.. Did he back up 60 feet to where he was before you came along? Or did he not back up nor did he need to because you saw him signal you and you were able to make a dead stop from your claimed speed at 70mph, all within 50 feet?

i was driving along and he was waiving me down. (as i looked away from my rearview mirror and seeing the other car coming up on me)
i signaled from the left lane into the breakdown lane. he walked to my car from his and after he gave me my ticket got in his car and backed up a certain distance!

Quote:

Quoting That Guy

And there goes another admission of guilt, by the way!

i wasn't saying i wasn't speeding im just saying i wasn't going 82.

the story is just saying if cops were really out there patrolling the roads everyday on my way to work i would see 100+ people being pulled over but i dont.
and obviously im starting to come off sour and thats because i am.

do you go always go 30 in a 30 or hell do you really drive 15 in a residential? stop at EVERY stop sign and never take a right turn on a red light? well if you do you must be related to mother theresa. good riddens.

anyways the guy barely talked. im going to send for discovery and wait it out as long as possible to send for a court date.
then hope he doesnt show up and show proof to the magistrate hearing.

p.s. i've also read most lidar's take a picture of the person's license plate. so if my plate is in that picture ill happily take the ticket.

i hope you take your extra 1% of being right. and use it for good.
10-10-2012, 09:40 PM
davidmcbeth3

Re: Ticketed for Speeding, Same Model of Car Behind Me

Quote:

Quoting Olegwashere

i wasn't saying i wasn't speeding im just saying i wasn't going 82.

I don't care if you were going 100 MPH ... my advice is sound. Your goal is to win the case after the state rests and then you motion for a summary judgment. Lets face it, any testimony you have to offer will only hurt your case as anything favorable to your case will be dismissed as being biased whereas anything that hurts your case will be used against you. Never testify unless you have an affirmative defense to offer.
10-11-2012, 12:26 AM
That Guy

Re: Ticketed for Speeding, Same Model of Car Behind Me

Quote:

Quoting Olegwashere

thanks i think. I came here for some help on something that happend. you know this is a legal help forum not a smart ass convention.

I've always said... Better a smart ass than a dumb ass!

And you're right... It is a legal help forum. Its not a test your lies and see which one will fly forum!

Quote:

Quoting Olegwashere

i was driving along and he was waiving me down. (as i looked away from my rearview mirror and seeing the other car coming up on me)
i signaled from the left lane into the breakdown lane. he walked to my car from his and after he gave me my ticket got in his car and backed up a certain distance!

That's version # 3 folks...

Remember:

Version #1: The officer apparently drove up the 60 plus feet to where this guy was because after he "wrote me the ticket and went back to his car and backed up 60+ feet to where he was before".

Version #2: The officer "... didn't even have to move his cruiser to get to me. as he was ahead of it".

Version #3: There is no telling if the officer moved his cruiser prior to writing the citation, although "he walked to my car from his and after he gave me my ticket got in his car and backed up a certain distance!"

Stay tuned for Version #4 where: "The officer got in his car to drive up to the defendant's. But didn't move it after issuing the citation."

Quote:

Quoting Olegwashere

i wasn't saying i wasn't speeding im just saying i wasn't going 82.

Right, the phantom car behind you was!

Quote:

Quoting Olegwashere

the story is just saying if cops were really out there patrolling the roads everyday on my way to work i would see 100+ people being pulled over but i dont.

Has nothing to do with whether you committed you violation or not!

Quote:

Quoting Olegwashere

and obviously im starting to come off sour and thats because i am.

And you will stay that way until you decide to get a better attitude. I didn't put you in this predicament! I am trying to save you from lying under oath... be my guest though, what do I care!

Quote:

Quoting Olegwashere

do you go always go 30 in a 30 or hell do you really drive 15 in a residential? stop at EVERY stop sign and never take a right turn on a red light? well if you do you must be related to mother theresa. good riddens.

Actually, and funny you should mention 30 because I've been cited for 57 in a 30. But I had a difference idea about a defense. I didn't have to lie... And its 25 in a residential where I am; yes, I do stop at every stop sign; and I never take a right on red if its prohibited... But I'm no longer on trial, you are! And no one will ask you if you were going t 82 in a 70... The citing officer will say it as a matter of FACT!

Oh, and shame on you about the Mother Theresa comment! She's probably praying for you as we speak you heartless pig!

Quote:

Quoting Olegwashere

anyways the guy barely talked. im going to send for discovery and wait it out as long as possible to send for a court date.
then hope he doesnt show up and show proof to the magistrate hearing.

Yeah, that oughta work!

Quote:

Quoting Olegwashere

p.s. i've also read most lidar's take a picture of the person's license plate. so if my plate is in that picture ill happily take the ticket.

This is getting creepy... And you're starting to sound like you're from Iowa!

There is not a single law enforcement agency that will ever utilize a picture taken by a Lidar device. Do you know why? Because there is not a single authority in the entire country, which would allow the use of such photos in the prosecution of speeding violations. And no, photo Radar is completely different!

In other words, there is no requirement that the officer show a picture of your license plate to prove your guilt!

Quote:

Quoting Olegwashere

i hope you take your extra 1% of being right. and use it for good.

I hope you think about your zero percent of being honest and try to improve it a little!
10-11-2012, 05:54 PM
lostintime

Re: Ticketed for Speeding, Same Model of Car Behind Me

New Jersey is 1000 ft.

Distance arguments have been successfully used in MA though.

Check your PM box.
10-11-2012, 05:58 PM
free9man

Re: Ticketed for Speeding, Same Model of Car Behind Me

What the heck dude? You have been proclaiming that distances are successfully used in some states, people ask you to post proof and you don't. Now you're gonna pull some Secret Squirrel BS and not put up? Put your money where your mouth is, post some cases from a state where distance successfully got the violator off. Maybe if you did that, folks around here would start taking you a little bit more seriously.

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