Accused of Giving False Information to the Police, Who Put Owner's Info on a Ticket
My question involves traffic court in the State of: CALIFORNIA
This happened in 2008 in Yucca Valley, CA. I ask this now because I found out about this charge while clearing up all FTA/FTP tickets on my DMV record. This unfortunately is my last deal before I can get my suspended license reinstated. Anyway, in September 2008, I was pulled over by CHP for speeding and didn't have my license with me (my license was still valid at the time, I just had it at home). I got a ticket and had to give my thumbprint on the ticket. Little did I know that the ticket didn't have my information on it, but the information that matched the owner of the vehicle I was driving which was a friend of mine. I am now being charged with giving false information to a police officer. I still remember the day of the citation. The officer and I didn't exchange much words. He asked me for my information and I gave it to him along with my thumbprint. And now based on his ticket, I am being charged with this misdemeanor. They recently spoke to the CHP cop and he vaguely remembers this of course. The signature on the ticket is unclear. I spoke to my public defender and he says we're just waiting on the results of the dmv fingerprint confirmation. My question is, what happens next? I will not take blame for a cops negligence. And I know I should have read the ticket before signing it, but I didn't realize back then that mistakes are made like this and that I would have a potential charge of lying to a cop in the future. Had I known this sick stuff happens, i would have read it. It bothers me that people are actually charged for stuff like this...especially by our government. Talk about innocent til proven guilty...that's all bull.
Re: Accused of Giving False Information to Chp when It Was Chp Who Falsely Assumed
Could you please be more specific about what part of the law you're accused of violating? It would help if you could point to a specific section of the penal or vehicle code, since there are a number of different laws that could cover what you've described. What did your public defender say about what happens next? You should always read everything you sign, since your signature carries legal significance.
Re: Accused of Giving False Information to Chp when It Was Chp Who Falsely Assumed
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themadnorwegian
You should always read everything you sign, since your signature carries legal significance.
In this instance I disagree. Signing a ticket is only a promise to appear as required. It does not attest to any statement being true or false contained on the ticket.
What is being claimed, as I understand it is the they are claiming OP gave the car owners information as his information.
the odd thing is: this happened 3 1/2 years ago. I know if I got a ticket I would deal with it. It sounds like OP failed to take care of the ticket and friend/car owner was the one they went after for the ticket and he turned in his buddy/OP. So, to me, that puts the OP's claims in the questionable category. Why didn't OP take care of the ticket years ago.
Re: Accused of Giving False Information to Chp when It Was Chp Who Falsely Assumed
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jk
In this instance I disagree. Signing a ticket is only a promise to appear as required. It does not attest to any statement being true or false contained on the ticket.
While it is true that a signature on a citation is only a promise to appear (which OP did not do), and not a statement of accuracy on the form, the signature does play a role in the totality of the circumstances here. Granted, it is OP's word against the cop's as to whether he gave his truthful identification info or not. However, the totality of the incident provides pretty strong circumstantial evidence of intentional deceit.
OP received a citation that falsely identified the registered owner as the driver. OP not only signed the citation, but put his thumb print on it...yet never pointed out the "error" to the issuing cop. The signature is "unclear," according to OP, which raises a reasonable question of whether it was intentionally unclear...especially if it is not readily recognizable as OP's signature. Then, OP fails to appear to answer for the citation. Presumably, the registered owner received notice of the FTA and ratted out OP (since this ended up on OP's DMV record in spite of the "error"). This also implies that OP was sent notice that the "error" had been discovered and he had been identified as the driver...and OP STILL does not appear to answer for the charge. So, while OP can argue that he provided correct info, he also avoided multiple opportunities to correct the "error."
An ambitious prosecutor could make a pretty convincing circumstantial case not only for false statement but for felony forgery (due to the "unclear" signature). While the signature is only a promise to appear, it is a promise for the person listed on the citation to appear. Since circumstances provide for a reasonable conclusion that OP intended to deceive the officer into issuing the citation to the RO rather than himself, it could also be argued that by signing the citation he was "putting forth as true a document he knew to be false."
And, to OP:
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chynagyrl1911
I will not take blame for a cops negligence. And I know I should have read the ticket before signing it, but I didn't realize back then that mistakes are made like this and that I would have a potential charge of lying to a cop in the future. Had I known this sick stuff happens, i would have read it. It bothers me that people are actually charged for stuff like this...especially by our government. Talk about innocent til proven guilty...that's all bull.
This situation did not arise due to "a cops negligence." It occurred due to YOUR negligence (giving you the benefit of the doubt that you actually didn't lie to the cop). You neglected to have your driver's license with you as is required by law. You neglected to read the cite (which you were given a copy of to take home and post on the refrigerator for mommy). You obviously never intended to answer the charges or you would have read the citation later and discovered the "error" then. You neglected to go to court as you signed a promise to do. You neglected to take responsibility and take steps to correct the "error" when your buddy got the FTA notice. That's a lot of "neglecting" on your part.
You can rant all you want about "this sick stuff"...all the injustice and the "bull" of the assumption of innocence until proven guilty, etc. But, this is all on you, not some tyrannical government or incompetent cop.
Re: Accused of Giving False Information to Chp when It Was Chp Who Falsely Assumed
I am trying to conceive of how bad a day might be having that I might actually write down the R/O information on a citation rather than the name and date of birth I was just verbally provided and wrote down in my notebook! Or how I would even GET the birthdate of a registered owner without a lot of name surfing.
Another thing to consider, in CA when we run the registered owner, guess what we do NOT get: birthdate, and physical description - both of which would be on the citation. The officer would only have gotten this info by either obtaining it directly from the OP, or, when the OP provided his name and birthdate, buy running that info up on his MDT and writing it on the cite.
If find it highly unlikely that this was NOT an intentional act on the part of the OP.
Re: Accused of Giving False Information to Chp when It Was Chp Who Falsely Assumed
the reason why i am dealing with this now is because it appeared on my dmv record which i looked up recently. The car I was driving belonged to my friend and was registered under his name. I do admit that when i gave the cop the registration and insurance information, I didn't say "that's not me" or anything much at all. I really didnt intend to deceive the cop. I just figured that my thumbprint would be enough to identify me at the end and the reason why i didn't deal with it then was because i was deployed to iraq from 2008-2011...not because i was negligent. That wasn't a good time for me and the thought that i may never come back home really was more important than making sure the cop got my name down...honestly, nothing really mattered in that time.
Re: Accused of Giving False Information to Chp when It Was Chp Who Falsely Assumed
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chynagyrl1911
the reason why i am dealing with this now is because it appeared on my dmv record which i looked up recently. The car I was driving belonged to my friend and was registered under his name. I do admit that when i gave the cop the registration and insurance information, I didn't say "that's not me" or anything much at all. I really didnt intend to deceive the cop. I just figured that my thumbprint would be enough to identify me at the end and the reason why i didn't deal with it then was because i was deployed to iraq from 2008-2011...not because i was negligent. That wasn't a good time for me and the thought that i may never come back home really was more important than making sure the cop got my name down...honestly, nothing really mattered in that time.
Insurance and registration information do not have the registered owner's birthdate and physical description. The officer might have had to do some serious searching on his computer to verify the registered owner's information. I can pretty much guarantee you that the officer asked for your name and birthdate. Yes, it is POSSIBLE that he ignored what you said and wrote the ticket down with your birthdate and the R/O's name, or even all the R/O's info ... or that he was too lazy to ask you anything and then simply fished around on the MDT until he found the right owner's name, but that would be quite uncharacteristic of any officer I know and more work than simply asking for it. Possible? Sure. But, highly improbable.
Re: Accused of Giving False Information to Chp when It Was Chp Who Falsely Assumed
First off, thank you for your service to our country. As a fellow vet, you have my respect and gratitude.
However, as a police officer who has written my fair share of citations over the years, I also have a hard time understanding how this situation could have occurred by any means other than deliberate deception. I am willing to take you at your word that it wasn't deliberate, but it really is a stretch to do so. As I said in my first post, it seems to me that the prosecutor has a very convincing circumstantial case against you. And, your unwarranted personal attack on the issuing officer, and rant about the forces of evil in the judicial system conspiring against you, not only showed a complete lack of personal responsibility but also (as you can probably tell from my previous post) severely damaged my view of your credibility.
When I was serving in the military, the attributes of integrity, personal honor, and accepting responsibility and consequences for one's actions were highly valued. I doubt that that culture has dramatically changed. Whether you deliberately deceived or not, your actions and failures to act led to these charges against you. I'm not saying you should throw yourself on your sword. But, visibly taking responsibility for your own part in this, rather than trying to put the blame on others, will go a long way to establishing some credibility with your accusers in believing this was not a deliberate act.
Re: Accused of Giving False Information to Chp when It Was Chp Who Falsely Assumed
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chynagyrl1911
the reason why i am dealing with this now is because it appeared on my dmv record which i looked up recently. The car I was driving belonged to my friend and was registered under his name. I do admit that when i gave the cop the registration and insurance information, I didn't say "that's not me" or anything much at all. I really didnt intend to deceive the cop. I just figured that my thumbprint would be enough to identify me at the end and the reason why i didn't deal with it then was because i was deployed to iraq from 2008-2011...not because i was negligent. That wasn't a good time for me and the thought that i may never come back home really was more important than making sure the cop got my name down...honestly, nothing really mattered in that time.
did you ever give the cop your true name and birth date?
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The signature on the ticket is unclear.
My signature is unclear but I still recognize my signature. Did you sign the ticket with your name?